Campaign Conundrum: destroying the Seleucids with the Iceni

[Balthazzar The Merciless]

Once I have secured Britain as the Iceni, I will bring myself to near bankruptcy with unit upkeep and set sail for Antioch to exterminate the seleucids for reasons I shall keep to myself...

And alas I reach my first conundrum; how does a barbarian horde compete with a hellenic kingdom?

How do barbarians counter a phalanx?! Heavy melee cavalry?
Cataphracts?! A quasi-phalanx unit aptly named 'warband'?
Armoured Elephants?! *headhurlers*
Scythed chariots countered by iceni's own celebrity charioteers!
Heavy infantry will hopefully be relatively well matched!

Without using mercenaries, (camel archers in my barbarian army would be an eyesore!) how can a barbarian horde beat a hellenic kingdom?

[Sharpe]

Bigger muscles.

But there will OBVY be units capable.

[Eofor]

They will beat the Seleucids by virtue of being manlier.

[Sitarus Originalus PM-30+]

two words: agility and maneuverability

two tips: don't sit and wait, seek for the weaknesses

[GideonAI]

Those slingers should be useful against phalanxes.

[Doe3000]

I'm sure the Iceni, like the Arverni, will be able to field noble* infantry (armoured with helmet and chainmail). I think a good tactic would be to pepper the phalanxes with slingshots to brake them down (you could also use javelins from the light chariots) - send the better armed, armoured and trained "noble" infantry to pin the front of the Phalanx, while lighter armoured infantry attacks the flanks and rear of the Phalanx formation.

* By "Noble" infantry, I mean heavily armed and armoured noblemen like these:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

[DogSoldierSPQR]

send the better armed, armoured and trained "noble" infantry to pin the front of the Phalanx, while lighter armoured infantry attacks the flanks and rear of the Phalanx formation.

I thought it were the other way round haha unless this is your version of it?
To counter a Phalanx I used to send expendable light infantry to pin the Phalanx while the heavies get some beautiful kills going from behind. Hmmm

[Mamertine]

I thought it were the other way round haha unless this is your version of it?
To counter a Phalanx I used to send expendable light infantry to pin the Phalanx while the heavies get some beautiful kills going from behind. Hmmm

That's what I did, too. You would lose more units, but not the good ones. And it is easier to replace peltasts than noble swordsmen.

OP, take out the their heavy cav, chariots, and camels with spearmen

archer cav with light cav

elephants with javelins

and engulf their phalanx with infantry as DogSoldierSPQR has already stated. On a more specific note, I personally liked to use club/mace/axe units to flank against the heavier phalanx units from behind and using heavier armored/shielded units holding the front.

[Abot_]

I hope that charging a cavalry unit into the back of a phalanx won't send half the cav unit flying over the phalanx and dying for no apparent reason like it did in Rome I.

[Kadoken]

The Gauls are the one "barbarian" faction that from their faction wiki screens have a decent amount of armor to counter the armored civilized factions. I'm going to guess that the Iceni and the Suebi (The other faction we haven't seen heavy armored troops with) are going to receive a semi-Legionaire or Phalanx unit but with its own twist near the mid to end of the tech trees.

[Vassilli]

Overwhelm them with your superior numbers.

[xjlxking]

Hard on for Seleucid, hmmmm?

[The Forgotten]

Cavalry and javailins split 50/50. Cavalry takes out other cavalry/archers while you micromanage the 2 units of javelin throwers to a phalanx. When the phalanx turns to counter one JT the other will throw a volley at it's unarmored back. JT's will also counter elephants too. So rinse and repeat until javelins are out and then surround the units left and encircle them.

casualty rate - high
plausibility - low
awesome theoretcial plan which sounds awesome - most definitely

[alhoon]

Without using mercenaries, (camel archers in my barbarian army would be an eyesore!) how can a barbarian horde beat a hellenic kingdom?

With better strategy

[Eofor]

With better strategy

And greater manliness.

[Sabre120]

Utilise the inflexibility of the phalanx to your advantage, outmaneuver and outflank them and cause a mass rout.

[GatorMarine1833]

When I played Hellenistic factions in RTW and it's mods, barbarians used to give me a run for my money by not fighting my phalanx.

Essentially it would go like this: I set up my phalanx and put my lighter units to the flanks (typically to protect against cavalry or to use for flanking attacks once the main lines are engaged) and my cavalry was further to each side. The barbarians would then charge me but focus only on the flanks. They'd have two or three units fighting each of my lighter flank units but still keep some facing my phalanx (at a safe distance) forcing me either to split my phalanx to back-up my flank units (and expose my phalanx to their center units) or march my phalanx toward their center and abandon my flank units (thus leaving my phalanx open to an attack from the rear once their units break my lighter units).

[❋ Flavius Belisarius ❋]

I think it would be very hard to attack them if you're not their neighbours and even more if you play with Icenie which is located at the other end of the map.

Admit that you havewin and sacked one of their city , they can return other armies against you. While you will have a very long time before being able to bring reinforcements to your troops on the spot. You should in the first place establish a colony in Estern lands before launching an invasion against Seleucid.

[Ursus]

Would not your boats get eaten by a big whale?

[Captain W. Handberg]

Take the capture point.


On a more tactical, realistic matter; bombard them with projectiles. Slingshots, javelins, arrows. Circle a group of light infantry or better, heavy cavalry around the formations in order to jab at them from behind. Or, even better.
Capture a unit of catapult and use it to blast them to shreds.