What kind of balance changes do M2TW and RTW expansions bring?

**lauri0** · July 15, 2013, 11:20 AM

First off, I'm a complete newcomer to the series, although I'm an avid strategy gamer(anything from turn-based civ to rts games like SC2)

Now that TW games are on sale on steam I got myself RTW and M2TW with their expansions and some of the others(but I'm mostly interested in RTW and M2TW). I started both vanilla campaigns but I've heard that expansions also brought some balance changes. As somebody who values balance immensely in strategy games and gets very quickly annoyed if some units or strategies seem too strong, do these expansions bring important balance changes? Especially regarding cavalry strength as they seem to be really cheap for their power and mobility.

**Agadar** · July 15, 2013, 11:53 AM

From what I have heard the Kingdoms expansion for Medieval Total War 2 brings improvements to the AI. Someone more knowledgeable will have to confirm this and any other changes Kingdom brings.

**Ashu-Siralis** · July 15, 2013, 11:59 AM

Kingdoms nerfs horses. Halves the amount per unit

**FriendlyThing** · July 15, 2013, 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by lauri0

First off, I'm a complete newcomer to the series, although I'm an avid strategy gamer(anything from turn-based civ to rts games like SC2)

Now that TW games are on sale on steam I got myself RTW and M2TW with their expansions and some of the others(but I'm mostly interested in RTW and M2TW). I started both vanilla campaigns but I've heard that expansions also brought some balance changes. As somebody who values balance immensely in strategy games and gets very quickly annoyed if some units or strategies seem too strong, do these expansions bring important balance changes? Especially regarding cavalry strength as they seem to be really cheap for their power and mobility.

Rome (Barbarian Invasion) gives everyone a spear unit (I believe.) Alexander doesn't balance cav (well, you get phalanx when playing as Macedonia, but they can go around the flank). The Persians spam Horse Archers.

In Medieval II Kingdoms, Mongols are in two campaigns (Crusades & Teutonic) bringing Horse Archers with them. I don't remember Britania being horse-intensive (Ireland in the late period have great horses though). Teutonic (other than Mongols) have good horses. Ritterbruder, Dievas Guards, and Dvor.
Crusades is rather horse-intensive (Egypt and Turkey have great horses, Crusaders have Knights). EDIT: Byzantium also has ridiculous upgraded cataphracts.
Americas doesn't have horses other than Europeans and Apache (and you have to fight Europeans to get Horses as Apache).

**Maklodes** · July 15, 2013, 01:20 PM

I think, generally, shields have become more important, and armor less so. Cavalry has become less powerful.

Originally Posted by FriendlyThing

Americas doesn't have horses other than Europeans and Apache (and you have to fight Europeans to get Horses as Apache).

Chichimecs also get a horse unit (chichimec riders) if they beat an army with horses (i.e., Europeans or Apaches with cavalry). It's a rather interesting unit -- a sort of mounted spear unit (+8 bonus against cavalry, like infantry spearmen), so it's a kind of anti-cavalry specialist cavalry a little like yari cavalry or something. It's not that interesting as a concept, but I think it's the only cavalry unit in official M2TW that has an spear-based anti-cavalry bonus.