The Alchemists Chambers

[Myrddraal]

Well would you look at that, you're alchemists now...

Myrddraal - Just a .... Miles Gregarius??? ..... and proud of it!

[Epistolary Richard]

You never know, Myrddraal, one day you may make it to the exalted rank of Optio like myself.

One day...

Perhaps...

(Anyway, surely being a Miles is infinitely better than being a 'Forger')

[HorseArcher]

You never know, Myrddraal, one day you may make it to the exalted rank of Optio like myself.

One day...

Perhaps...

(Anyway, surely being a Miles is infinitely better than being a 'Forger')

but you are Epistolary Richard. You were a civitate and for personal request, you wanted yourself removed from the rank. Or were you patrician?

Anyway , anyone being a civi can be an artifex. A rank equal as civitate, with the difference of being a member who is more "mod"-oriented.

In my eyes, your rank should be an Opifex, and I don't think anyone would argue about it, looking at your past-history of scripting and modding RTW.
It is your call ER..

same deal with Myrddraal

[Epistolary Richard]

but you are Epistolary Richard. You were a civitate and for personal request, you wanted yourself removed from the rank. Or were you patrician?

Anyway , anyone being a civi can be an artifex. A rank equal as civitate, with the difference of being a member who is more "mod"-oriented.

In my eyes, your rank should be an Opifex, and I don't think anyone would argue about it, looking at your past-history of scripting and modding RTW.
It is your call ER..

same deal with Myrddraal

Of course, Archer, of course. I was just being a trifle flippant with my fellow modder there, as it appeared to be a rather non-serious thread.

Ah now that would be my problem see: I eat KBtM's for breakfast, but I haven't had a CTD in quite some time.

Ah... that'll be why your dragging your heels with Wheel of Time so much...

Quite seriously, what's the explanation for another exclusive modders club at the TWC?

Another? Not quite sure what the first one was... :hmmm:

Anyway, I believe all the discussion and explanations can be found in this thread.

[Myrddraal]

No thanks, Miles Gregarius sounds way cooler!

(Anyway, surely it's infintely better than being a 'Forger')

Forger! That sounds ROCKING! How many more points do I need?

[Epistolary Richard]

Forger! That sounds ROCKING! How many more points do I need?

You need a googleplex of points plus six 'special tokens'. Tokens can be found in promotional boxes of 'Special CTD' - the cereal of champions!

[The Walrus]

Wow two legends in one post!(faints) PARTY for us being alchemists.

MYRDDRAAL IS MY GOD FOR MAKING WoT

[Myrddraal]

PARTY for us being alchemists.

umm, I'm taking the ****... I thought I was being quite un-subtle too. Let me spell it out. I want to be in no way associated with yet another attempt to replace an already existant modding community.

It is not the title under your username that makes you a good modder, or a better or more important person. I want to be a... a... a Togatus? Is that right?

[Myrddraal]

Ah now that would be my problem see: I eat KBtM's for breakfast, but I haven't had a CTD in quite some time.

Quite seriously, what's the explanation for another exclusive modders club at the TWC?

[The Walrus]

I got a confession-I'm not an alchemist. I'm just a small modder (text editting mostly)

[Myrddraal]

Anyway, I believe all the discussion can be found in the Consillium Bella forum.

Cheers, I'll check it out.

Another? Not quite sure what the first one was...

Apologies, the original TTO and the TWC are unfortunately linked in my mind.

I got a confession-I'm not an alchemist. I'm just a small modder (text editting mostly)

Good on you! You know what, my first question was a rather stupid one about the Lukup Map maker for MTW. I then went on to complain that no one was answering my questions. I was an annoying newbie and I really ****** off Lord of Storms

At least I'm not a newbie these days...


BTW, I can't find the thread, am I being blind?

[Epistolary Richard]

Cheers, I'll check it out.

I've linked the relevant thread above.

Apologies, the original TTO and the TWC are unfortunately linked in my mind.

Oh dear, oh dear, you are behind the times. TTO is now NTO under the direction of Archer - and NTO is open to all (see here).

[Myrddraal]

the original TTO

I got it now. Besides, we already had Alchemists in the days of MTW, only they worked in a lab rather than a chamber, and they didn't have titles and ranks. They did enjoy modding though, I don't know if that matters however.

[Lusted]

THe Alchemists chamber is not meant to be like the TTO, it is just meant to be a forum where good experienced modders can go do and discuss various aspects of modding.

[Myrddraal]

So what are the existing forums for? Discussing bannanas?

All you are trying to do is exclude new members from your discussions. I suppose it makes you feel high and mighty...

[Lusted]

We are not, if we wanted to exlude new members we would have made the Alcemists chamber hidden, but all the modding forums are visible to all. The Alchemists chamber is there for when modders want to discuss some obscure or
very complicated bit of modding with fellow modders, the other forums are there for discussing the relevant parts of modding.

[Myrddraal]

some obscure or very complicated bit of modding with fellow modders

So again, I'm going to ask the same two questions I asked of the TTO, and the same to questions which have never been explained to me in a satisfactory way:

In what way is this an addition to the modding community?
- Surely, 'very complicated bits of modding' are already discussed amongst fellow modders all the time...

Why is it exclusive?
- What if I wanted to discuss certain 'very complicated bits of modding', what if a member who for years has been developping his mod on another board comes here to ask about a 'very complicated bits of modding', he is excluded. This is a private club folks, unless you have the right rank you can't be a good modder! It's almost too funny for words!

You are dividing the community. That is a fact how you can pretend otherwise defeats me. You are making two forums, one for the 'good' modders, and one for everyone else. This is the latest in welcoming, newbie friendly and community building forum ideas.

[Halie Satanus]

So again, I'm going to ask the same two questions I asked of the TTO, and the same to questions which have never been explained to me in a satisfactory way:

In what way is this an addition to the modding community?
- Surely, 'very complicated bits of modding' are already discussed amongst fellow modders all the time...

Modding community, hmm maybe nothing in the grand scheme of things, but to this site maybe a lot, the aim is to build a stong community here, and while we bow to the core modders of the .Org we offer a lot more to noobs in terms of easy acceptance to the site and community. what, as you implied yourself seem unable to grasp, is that this site is looking to the future of its place in the hierachy of total war sites rather than relying on reputation.

Why is it exclusive?
- What if I wanted to discuss certain 'very complicated bits of modding', what if a member who for years has been developping his mod on another board comes here to ask about a 'very complicated bits of modding', he is excluded. This is a private club folks, unless you have the right rank you can't be a good modder! It's almost too funny for words!

While i agree that it may be a little to exclusive at present, something which needs addressing imo, we have an established system of ranks and exclusive forums here, in part they are what makes this site different from peer sites, and perhaps is what keeps people here. you seem a little fixated on the alchemist chambers to be honest, no one is going to make a contribution to this site and go unnoticed for long, as there are plenty of foums to discuss modding at every level. Even for those who want to talk about bananas.

You are dividing the community. That is a fact how you can pretend otherwise defeats me. You are making two forums, one for the 'good' modders, and one for everyone else. This is the latest in welcoming, newbie friendly and community building forum ideas.

Is it a slow day at the org?? fact is the alchemist chambers were created at the request of high end modders, go figure. dividing the community, LOL i hear this a lot around here, why do people think that having a restricted forum divides anything is almost to funny for words, as i said the AC does seem a bit over restricted at the moment, but its part of the fun of this site.

This is the latest in welcoming, newbie friendly and community building forum ideas.

Yes it is.

[Lusted]

In what way is this an addition to the modding community?
- Surely, 'very complicated bits of modding' are already discussed amongst fellow modders all the time...

Not at TWC. We lack the modding discussion that .org has, and by giving modders a place to discuss modding we hope to imporve the modding community here.

Why is it exclusive?
- What if I wanted to discuss certain 'very complicated bits of modding', what if a member who for years has been developping his mod on another board comes here to ask about a 'very complicated bits of modding', he is excluded. This is a private club folks, unless you have the right rank you can't be a good modder! It's almost too funny for words!

Any modder can be invited in and given access to it, if a modder has been developing his mod for years on another board he is likely to be heard of, and will likely be given access.

You are dividing the community. That is a fact how you can pretend otherwise defeats me. You are making two forums, one for the 'good' modders, and one for everyone else. This is the latest in welcoming, newbie friendly and community building forum ideas.

What modding community? There isn't really one at TWC. Modding discussion generally consists of a new modder asking a question and a more experienced modder answering it. There isn't much exploration if what the limits of the engine are, what exactly is possible, how to implement certain things. If we really wanted to make it exclusive we would hide it, but it isn't hidden, everyone can view it and learn from and discussion that take place. I would think only a small amount of mdding discussion would go on in there, mostly i would think for new features discovered which need to be fully explored before a tutorial is made for the whole community. Or maybe a beta release of a new tool for modders to test and make sure it works. We want new modders to see the forum, and think "that looks interesting, i want to be a part of that", and there will be more than enough info in the other forums here in the reworked mod workshop for them to get started and get help for problems they may be having.

[Myrddraal]

What? What has this got to do with the .org? I'm not speaking here as a .org moderator, or a .org member. I'm speaking my personal opinnion here!

But since you mention it, here are a couple of things that bug me atm.

You seem completely fixated on this idea of competition between fansites. Are we not all here because we enjoy the totalwar series, and are we not all here because we want to discuss it?

That is the bottom line. ___________

Every point you make reminds me of this competitive and destructive spirit. I remember the exclamations of joy when the TWC moved up a space in the list of fansites at the .com, I remember the hosting of illegal downloads to attract members to the TWC, I remember the personal attacks on Tosa, who's been a member of the tw community longer than you or I by a long shot, I remember the original TTO trying to put it's name to every decent mod out there.

It seems to me the ranking system you have here is purely designed to be competitive - if you take your research here, I'll give you a cyber cookie, yay!

You aren't TW fans, you're TWCenter Fans.

So long as I have a corner of the web in which I can discuss the series with like minded people who also enjoy playing and modding it, then I'm not bothered by the text under my Avatar. Those who prize having "ReallyImportantPersonus" under their username more than contributing something to the wider community... well I won't comment because I'm quite unneccesarily agitated atm. The same goes for those of you focused entirely on making the TWCenter a bigger site. The totalwar games are a means to an ends now, which is a great great shame.

I hope you enjoy yourselves in your forum and I'm sure plenty of people will aspire to be as important as you, but not me. Any research I do for MTWII will be in a public forum where all can contribute or comment without needing to apply first.


Bitter? Yes I'm very bitter. I've tried to visit TWC more often and tried to contribute by answering questions, but last time I tried, I got slated for posting links back to the .org. Three cheers for the community!

You aren't soothing my bitterness by creating these types of forums, and it's unfortunate that it has to be something so negative that motivates me to post here again.


I must emphasise here, this is my personal oppinion, and does not reflect the oppinions of the .org staff.


EDIT - Comming back to this in a bit of a calmer state of mind: I mean no disrespect to you guys individually. You're all great modders, but I can't resist posting when these things (which are so objectionable to me) happen seemingly with the support of so many people. Maybe that makes me insane...

EDIT 2: I also hope my angry posting does not dimish me in your own eyes. I know it's a lot to ask, but try to hear the motivation behind the :wub: rather than the words he speaks.