Byzantium (Constantinople/Istanbul) vs Antheia (Sozopolis)

[Dan113112]

We still use Byzantinum (Bizanc) and Carigrad - Emperor city. Istanbul was also greek name and wrong lame name.

Istanbul is the Turkish name.

[Lanciarius_90]

Istanbul is the Turkish name.

No is not. It was greek phrase and mean : "in the city".

[fizy45]

No is not. It was greek phrase and mean : "in the city".

Call it as you wish the main reason here is its existence in game it will be called Byzantion in my post you keep talking about its name and in here you continue stop arguing about the Istanbul name it will not be named as Istanbul relax my friend

[Dan113112]

No is not. It was greek phrase and mean : "in the city".

There were many names. According to Wikipedia the term is not "in the city" its "to the city." Europeans use the term Constantinople to refer to the city in Medieval times I believe. It doesn't change the fact that Istanbul was commonly used among Turks as well along with many other names.

Lol. The lack of knowledge is striking here.

So. I never said I wasn't ignorant about the subject.

You know..... "north" american.... They are always "smart", but never live here...

What an arrogant assumption to make.

[Mrlabx]

No is not. It was greek phrase and mean : "in the city".

Actually name of Istanbul came from a Turkish word 'Islambol' means 'City of Islam'. Stinpolis means 'to the city' in Greek phrase which is not familiar with Istanbul.

[fizy45]

We still use Byzantinum (Bizanc) and Carigrad - Emperor city. Istanbul was also greek name and wrong lame name.

Please my friend just comment about its existence in game if you say Istanbul is a lame name than another user may came and say constantinople is a lame name please be careful...

The correct name is Byzantion or Byzantium and it was included in original RTW !!!

I have to say you are a very patient person.

Why you say that ?

I repeated the name of Byzantion because of an error in forum if thats what you meant...

[Legion_IX]

Why you say that ?

I repeated the name of Byzantion because of an error in forum if thats what you meant...

No, it wasn't sarcasmus or irony.
If I would get over and over again posts "call it this. no call it that. no it's called different" and so on, I would get bit ... upset, probably. But you manage to stay all the time patient and polite. Thats a good property of you, sadly not everybody has it

[StealthFox]

Threads Merged.

[Dan113112]

The question is which city at the time was more powerful. Athens or Byzantium? Was Byzantium independent at the time or under another faction's boot? I know that Anthens was a tribute paying state.

[Manuel I Komnenos]

Lol. The lack of knowledge is striking here. You understand that Byzantium was a powerful city state which controlled trade on the Black Sea, which stopped the Galatians from landing in Asia Minor (until they were aided by Nicomedes of Bythinia) and which engaged in war against the naval power of Rhodes, right...?

[August]

Lol. The lack of knowledge is striking here. You understand that Byzantium was a powerful city state which controlled trade on the Black Sea, which stopped the Galatians from landing in Asia Minor (until they were aided by Nicomedes of Bythinia) and which engaged in war against the naval power of Rhodes, right...?

Is this a hearsay or you have something to show everyone?

[Manuel I Komnenos]

Is this a hearsay or you have something to show everyone?

War of Byzantium against Rhodes and Bithynia. Polybius book 4.

These Gauls had left their country with Brennus, and having survived the battle at Delphi and made their way to the Hellespont, instead of crossing to Asia, were captivated by the beauty of the district round Byzantium, and settled there. Then, having conquered the Thracians and erected Tyle into a capital, they placed the Byzantines in extreme danger. In their earlier attacks, made under the command of Comontorius their first king, the Byzantines always bought them off by presents amounting to three, or five, or sometimes even ten thousand gold pieces, on condition of their not devastating their territory: and at last were compelled to agree to pay them a yearly tribute of eighty talents, until the time of Cavarus, in whose reign their kingdom came to an end; and their whole tribe, being in their turn conquered by the Thracians, were entirely annihilated. It was in these times, then, that being hard pressed by the payment of these exactions, the Byzantines first sent embassies to the Greek states with a prayer for aid and support in their dangerous situation: but being disregarded by the greater number, they, under pressure of necessity, attempted to levy dues upon ships sailing into the Pontus.

Now this exaction by the Byzantines of a duty upon goods brought from the Pontus, being a heavy loss and burden to everybody, was universally regarded as a grievance; and accordingly an appeal from all those engaged in the trade was made to the Rhodians, as acknowledged masters of the sea: and it was from this circumstance that the war originated of which I am about to speak. For the Rhodians, roused to action by the loss incurred by themselves, as well as that of their neighbours, at first joined their allies in an embassy to Byzantium, and demanded the abolition of the impost. The Byzantines refused compliance, being persuaded that they were in the right by the arguments advanced by their chief magistrates, Hecatorus and Olympidorus, in their interview with the ambassadors. The Rhodian envoys accordingly departed without effecting their object. But upon their return home, war was at once voted against Byzantium on these grounds; and messengers were immediately despatched to Prusias inviting his co-operation in the war: for they knew that Prusias was from various causes incensed with the Byzantines.

The Byzantines took steps of a similar nature, by sending to Attalus and Achaeus begging for their assistance. For his part Attalus was ready enough to give it: but his importance was small, because he had been reduced within the limits of his ancestral dominions by Achaeus. But Achaeus, who exercised dominion throughout Asia on this side Taurus, and had recently established his regal power, promised assistance; and his attitude roused high hopes in the minds of the Byzantines, and corresponding depression in those of the Rhodians and Prusias. Achaeus was a relation of the Antiochus who had just succeeded to the kingdom of Syria; and he became possessed of the dominion I have mentioned through the following circumstances.

As to the provocations given before this to Prusias by the Byzantines they were various. In the first place he complained that, having voted to put up certain statues of him, they had not done so, but had delayed or forgotten it. In the second place he was annoyed with them for taking great pains to compose the hostility, and put an end to the war, between Achaeus and Attalus; because he looked upon a friendship between these two as in many ways. detrimental to his own interests. He was provoked also because it appeared that when Attalus was keeping the festival of Athene, the Byzantines had sent a mission to join in the celebration; but had sent no one to him when he was celebrating the Soteria. Nursing therefore a secret resentment for these various offences, he gladly snatched at the pretext offered him by the Rhodians; and arranged with their ambassadors that they were to carry on the war by sea, while he would undertake to inflict no less damage on the enemy by land.

Such were the causes and origin of the war between Rhodes and Byzantium.

At first the Byzantines entered upon the war with energy, in full confidence of receiving the assistance of Achaeus; and of being able to cause Prusias as much alarm and danger by fetching Tiboetes from Macedonia as he had done to them. For Prusias, entering upon the war with all the animosity which I have described, had seized the place called Hieron at the entrance of the channel, which the Byzantines not long before had purchased for a considerable sum of money, because of its convenient situation; and because they did not wish to leave in any one else's hands a point of vantage to be used against merchants sailing into the Pontus, or one which commanded the slave trade, or the fishing. Besides this, Prusias had seized in Asia a district of Mysia, which had been in the possession of Byzantium for many years past.

Meanwhile the Rhodians manned six ships and received four from their allies; and, having elected Xenophantus to command them, they sailed with this squadron of ten ships to the Hellespont. Nine of them dropped anchor near Sestos, and stopped ships sailing into the Pontus; with the tenth the admiral sailed to Byzantium, to test the spirit of the people, and see whether they were already sufficiently alarmed to change their minds about the war. Finding them resolved not to listen he sailed away, and, taking up his other nine ships, returned to Rhodes with the whole squadron.

Meanwhile the Byzantines sent a message to Achaeus asking for aid, and an escort to conduct Tiboetes from Macedonia. For it was believed that Tiboetes had as good a claim to the kingdom of Bithynia as Prusias, who was his nephew.

But seeing the confident spirit of the Byzantines, the Rhodians adopted an exceedingly able plan to obtain their object. They perceived that the resolution of the Byzantines in venturing on the war rested mainly on their hopes of the support of Achaeus. Now they knew that the father of Achaeus was detained at Alexandria, and that Achaeus was exceedingly anxious for his father's safety: they therefore hit upon the idea of sending an embassy to Ptolemy, and asking him to deliver this Andromachus to them. This request, indeed, they had before made, but without laying any great stress upon it: now, however, they were genuinely anxious for it; that, by doing this favour to Achaeus, they might lay him under such an obligation to them, that he would be unable to refuse any request they might make to him. When the ambassadors arrived, Ptolemy at first deliberated as to detaining Andromachus; because there still remained some points of dispute between himself and Antiochus unsettled; and Achaeus, who had recently declared himself king, could exercise a decisive influence in several important particulars. For Andromachus was not only father of Achaeus, but brother also of Laodice, the wife of Seleucus. However, on a review of the whole situation, Ptolemy inclined to the Rhodians; and being anxious to show them every favour, he yielded to their request, and handed over Andromachus to them to conduct to his son. Having accordingly done this, and having conferred some additional marks of honour on Achaeus, they deprived the Byzantines of their most important hope. And this was not the only disappointment which the Byzantines had to encounter; for as Tiboetes was being escorted from Macedonia, he entirely defeated their plans by dying. This misfortune damped the ardour of the Byzantines, while it encouraged Prusias to push on the war. On the Asiatic side he carried it on in person, and with great energy; while on the European side he hired Thracians who prevented the Byzantines from leaving their gates. For their party being thus baulked of their hopes, and surrounded on every side by enemies, the Byzantines began to look about then for some decent pretext for withdrawing from the war.

So when the Gallic king, Cavarus, came to Byzantium, and showed himself eager to put an end to the war, and earnestly offered his friendly intervention, both Prusias and the Byzantines consented to his proposals. And when the Rhodians were informed of the interference of Cavarus and the consent of Prusias, being very anxious to secure their own object also, they elected Aridices as ambassador to Byzantium, and sent Polemocles with him in command of three triremes, wishing, as the saying is, to send the Byzantines "spear and herald's staff at once." Upon their appearance a pacification was arranged, in the year of Cothon, son of Callisthenes, Hieromnemon in Byzantium. The treaty with the Rhodians was simple: "The Byzantines will not collect toll from any ship sailing into the Pontus; and in that case the Rhodians and their allies are at peace with the Byzantines." But that with Prusias contained the following provisions: "There shall be peace and amity for ever between Prusias and the Byzantines; the Byzantines shall in no way attack Prusias, nor Prusias the Byzantines. Prusias shall restore to Byzantines all lands, forts, populations, and prisoners of war, without ransom; and besides these things, the ships taken at the beginning of the war, and the arms seized in the fortresses; and also the timbers, stone-work, and roofing belonging to the fort called Hieron" (for Prusias, in his terror of the approach of Tiboetes, had pulled down every fort which seemed to lie conveniently for him): "finally, Prusias shall compel such of the Bithynians as have any property taken from the Byzantine district of Mysia to restore it to the farmers."

Such were the beginning and end of the war of Rhodes and Prusias with Byzantium.

The Gauls and Byzantium. Memnon of Heraclea chapter 11.

When the Gauls came to Byzantium and ransacked most of its territory, the Byzantines were worn down by the war and asked their allies for help. All the allies provided such help as they could, and the Heracleians gave four thousand gold pieces (this is what the envoys had asked for). Not long after, Nicomedes made a pact with the Gauls who were attacking Byzantium, and arranged for them to cross over to Asia; the Gauls had tried to cross over many times before, but had always failed, because the Byzantines would not allow it. The terms of the pact were as follows: the barbarians should always support Nicomedes and his children, and should not enter into alliance with any other state which requested it without the permission of Nicomedes. They should be allies of his allies, and enemies of his enemies. They should serves as allies of the Byzantines, if necessary, and of the inhabitants of Tius and Heracleia and Chalcedon and Cierus, and of some other rulers. On these terms, Nicomedes brought the multitude of Gauls over to Asia. The Gauls had 17 eminent leaders, of whom the most important and distinguished were Leonnorius and Luturius.

[fizy45]

Woow my post turned into this one

Anyway its good to see people are also wish to see Byzantion in game...

CA fix this now !

[Legion_IX]

To stay on topic. I agree that the lack of Byzantium is not good. Especially due to it's strategic position. It's going to be even more important when Scythia or Sarmatia and Kimmeria will be playable faction (what is very likely in my opinion). Capua is strange too. But it doesn't made any difference if you have Napolis or Capua. In case of Byzantium the lack of it made some interesting stragies obsolet.

[Caledoni]

to be honest there's a lot of threads made moaning about inclusions and what not that are pretty irrelevant, this one however makes a lot of sense to me

to me on any campaign play through Byzantium is one of the most important cities in the game, equaled only by Rome, Carthage and Alexandria. i can understand not making it a large important city at the start but to not have a city there at all and have one with no strategic or future historical value a little bit to the north is a bit pointless.

i personally think it will be a great shame not to have such an important city both historically (bear in mind that the game time goes forward) and strategically (the meeting of the East and the West)

[fizy45]

to be honest there's a lot of threads made moaning about inclusions and what not that are pretty irrelevant, this one however makes a lot of sense to me

to me on any campaign play through Byzantium is one of the most important cities in the game, equaled only by Rome, Carthage and Alexandria. i can understand not making it a large important city at the start but to not have a city there at all and have one with no strategic or future historical value a little bit to the north is a bit pointless.

i personally think it will be a great shame not to have such an important city both historically (bear in mind that the game time goes forward) and strategically (the meeting of the East and the West)

%100 agree with you

[Marvzilla]

Thanks for the read Manuel Komnenos.

[Piazzo Cappiaro]

I think it should stay as it is. To me, Byzantium is an extremely poor choice and I believe CA have made the correct decision.

[{Augustus}]

i think its no possible to place it there because there is not enouf room if you look at the campain screenshot they releast today you will see that there is not enouf place.

[Stoopisaurus]

No Emperor would create a new capital from scratch in an uninhabited and poor desert without any solid basis.

Oh really ? Ever heard of Peter the Great ?