"Don't Kill the Messenger" ...But what if you could?

[Everto]

We all know the good old saying of "Don't Kill the Messenger"... but WHAT IF YOU COULD!!! What I'm getting at is directly implementing a mechanic where you could have a more interactive diplomatic experience...whereby (if you so choose) you could straight up EXECUTE a foreign envoy, or one of your envoys could be executed. This mechanic would be an over the top way of expressing rage at the proposal of a foreign power (say they tell you to surrender "or ELSE"). There have been a few occasions in my long Total War career where I have been so offended by diplomats that I actually hunted them down with assassins on the campaign map and struck them down (in good old RTW I and MTW II that is). Obviously this mechanic will probably no longer exist and we will (most likely) have a more Shogun II-esque diplomatic mechanic where you "discover" new factions and tribes as your borders expand and you come to the royal court of these people's and give them your message, or they come to yours (I loved talking directly to the Warlord in Shogun II).

What I'm proposing is that there can be a mechanic like in Shogun I (OLD SCHOOL BABY), where if you clicked on the Geisha, she could execute the diplomat right there; in Rome II you could do this by having the Guards murder the emissary for gravely insulting your people. Obviously such an act would have HUGE ramifications; Firstly this would be an immediate declaration of war against said faction, Secondly it would damage ties between the two factions so badly that all further diplomatic envoys would be "turned away" from the court of the faction whose own envoy was executed at your court (for a time), thirdly such an act would thoroughly tarnish the reputation of a nation, and thus you can't go around executing emissaries from all over the world who are asking for trade rights because in the end all your neighbors will see you as a vile and deceitful people. This should be an EXTREME measure, reserved for the most insulting of messages (i.e. Rome coming in and telling you that all your **** belongs to them now) That's when you, as a proud leader of the Gauls, calmly express your feelings on the matter by sending Rome the head of their envoy...

Or of Course we can always turn to this Iconic figure... whose face IS EXACTLY LIKE MINE when Parthia arrives on my land and gives me a "do this or ELSE" ultimatum..

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Which quickly follows with THIS...

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Thoughts?

[Greve Af Göteborg]

I think you should be able to refuse dialogues with a faction (basically not allowing them to actually speak to you). Just like in civilization, where if you piss off a civilization enough they won't even talk to you.

[Sun Jetzu]

this thread needs to be at the top daily, you sir are a genius lmao
+1 rep

[Everto]

this thread needs to be at the top daily, you sir are a genius lmao
+1 rep

Thank you sir, thank haha

[Serkelet]

I always found that feature of Shogun Total War very funny, indeed, and I never understood why CA got rid of it in their next games.

[torongill]

It would be nice purely as a cosmetic feature. I don't want to be forced to recruit diplomats and send them over to some foreign land and watch them every turn whether the idiot is still moving or has stopped because there are ten guards on a bridge in the middle of nowhere. The new system is better for me.

[Everto]

It would be nice purely as a cosmetic feature. I don't want to be forced to recruit diplomats and send them over to some foreign land and watch them every turn whether the idiot is still moving or has stopped because there are ten guards on a bridge in the middle of nowhere. The new system is better for me.

I want the Shogun II system of speaking to the faction leader to remain (obviously once you come into contact with said faction), you are still sending an emissary, they're just not going to be an agent on the map, which is fine by me. Yet if your delegation infuriates the faction, or if their delegation infuriates you, we would have the EXTREME choice to show our displeasure in the form of a blatant execution. I believe that such an action should be restrained only to a very inflammatory suggestion; I.E become my protectorate and forfeit your freedom, give me your lands OR ELSE, declare war on your ally OR ELSE... etc. This should not be an option if they're asking if they can trade some furs for pretty trinkets, that'd be just stupidly abused by twisted gamers lol

This is Sparta!

Lol, I knew this was coming, +rep

[Dan113112]

I remember seeing something similar to this in EU: Rome - Vae Victus. In that game, if someone declared war on you, you could execute their diplomat, throw him in the dungeon, or just let him go on his way. Similarly, the AI could do the same.

[spiderknight]

Have they said whether or not there are gonna be diplomats again? Its not an era where the map was really known ........

[Dan113112]

This is Sparta!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkWS9PiXekE

[ptoss1]

This is Sparta!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkWS9PiXekE

Or alternatively:

This is Khwarezm!

Except they died pretty horribly.

Not to say the Spartans didn't but they got a movie.

[Sun Jetzu]

you think if the real 300 spartans could see the movie now in the future, they would just kick the tv set right through the wall?

[The Juggernaut]

you think if the real 300 spartans could see the movie now in the future, they would just kick the tv set right through the wall?

I think that if the real 300 spartans saw the movie now, they would wonder how they got the people in the boxes. And WTF electricity was. And how planes work. And...

I doubt any ancient people would care how they were portrayed in a movie for a very long time. Just saying

[Arcani 4 Ever]

I don't see what's so revolutionary about this. This mechanic was implemented in Shogun 1 and Medieval 1. You could kill emissaries and the other factions could as well.

But, the main thing here is, that there won't be diplomats in Rome II *as far as i can tell, if i'm wrong someone tell me* Also diplomacy has never been the forte of Total War games, so i might end up getting my diplomat killed out of the most ridiculous situations...and that really doesn't sound pleasing.

[oppaiO_O]

i would like to keep the same shogun 2 diplomatic way of doing things with the addition of a button instead of a check mark for a yes or an x for a no have a little button to be the option to kill the envoy and then show a little clip like how they did it when a faction dies in shogun 2...heads be flyin'

[Everto]

i would like to keep the same shogun 2 diplomatic way of doing things with the addition of a button instead of a check mark for a yes or an x for a no have a little button to be the option to kill the envoy and then show a little clip like how they did it when a faction dies in shogun 2...heads be flyin'

My thoughts exactly sir

[Sun Jetzu]

how about you can declare war by killing then....
BOOM
cinematic movie.
Are you mad?
No I am Seubi!!!!!!!

[zagy20]

how about you can declare war by killing then....
BOOM
cinematic movie.
Are you mad?
No I am Seubi!!!!!!!

I thought the Suebi were always mad.

[Sun Jetzu]

I thought the Suebi were always mad.

yea but when a diplomat comes and insults their queen...man they go crazy!
In Suebi a diplomat is accountable for the words of his kings.
Either way, they dont care what you have to say...

[Sun Jetzu]

this has nothing to do with anything of this thread, but i thought it was cool. And i am not making a thread for this lmao
Check this out

a collage of the factions.