Settlement Population Control Problems

[menawati]

I'm currently playing a Bosporan campaign and have taken over a number of Scythian cities. Due to the some buildings in them (I think they are called 'Herders') the populations are increasing at crazy rates and I can't remove those buildings. Building wells and cisterns makes it ok for a while but ofc it just further increases population growth so I've now got low tax on them but still happiness is plummeting even with good governors and a garrison.

So I thought no problem I'll just use the population control buildings to reduce the populations a bit. The first one 'suburbs' seems to work but all the following ones like 'village' and 'town' seem to do absolutely nothing and now they are close to rioting and populations are still growing like crazy.

Are those buildings bugged or am I doing something wrong ?

[alhoon]

Let them riot and exterminate their cities... that would work.

[oOIYvYIOo]

Let them riot and exterminate their cities... that would work.

If you cant destroy buildings to avoid the growth follow this example as this is the best one , remove everyone you have, destroy hapiness buildings, increase the taxs at max level but before all that get a decent army to attack (5 to 10 units) close to the city to lay siege when the civilians rebel.

[menawati]

Well, when I took the cities I had to exterminate the population in the first place else happiness was like 10% on low tax with full garrison. It's fine of course when the pop is like 3 or 4k you usually got a good long time to build all the culture and happiness buildings as the pop grows and it eventually it reaches zero growth and it's stable.

I really don't know what's happening with this campaign tho I just can't stop those damn Scythian cities growing - they are still like 5% growth up at 40k population and the rural community control does absolutely nothing apart from the first one (suburbs). Never had this problem with any of my other RS2 campaigns and it's the first time I've even had to use the buildings to decrease growth.

[Odesos]

You are not doing anything wrong.I had similar problems in my Bosporan campaign.Solution?Just leave them alone,focus on black sea coast and guard you east front.something funny.Every time when partia and seleucid stop fighting seleucid attack me,then peace next turn and again

[mishkin]

You are not doing anything wrong.I had similar problems in my Bosporan campaign.Solution?Just leave them alone,focus on black sea coast and guard you east front.something funny.Every time when partia and seleucid stop fighting seleucid attack me,then peace next turn and again

I did that too, but I felt like cheating. (I know its not cheating, but I found it a little "weird")

[menawati]

Ah, glad to know someone else had similar issues then. I have never experienced such extreme problems with unrest and crazy population expansions before. My governors are good, leader has good traits (no recession) but I lost control to such an extent that it got unplayable having to keep full garrisons and low tax all the time. I'm also now puzzled as to how the suburb-village-town buildings work as they do nothing at all for me apart from the first one.

[Odesos]

post some pictures.Sarmatia was a big pain.from town to town 2 turns,no roads huge army.difficult to defend too

[ur-Lord Tedric]

When you conquer a settlement (and I always Enslave and never need to Exterminate)...

- Have a Governor all ready with, hopefully, reasonable Influence traits, but definitely 'Population Control' Ancillaries/Retinue like 'Magistrate' and 'Skilled Politician and the special high Influence ones
- Destroy the Faction-specific buildings (incl Barracks)
- Destroy the Faction-specific temples that cannot be upgraded
- Destroy the Settlement Tax that is normally at the first level (makes a great difference)
- Destroy enough additional buildings so that you can see a maximum of 23 and so you know you haven't missed any
- Build the Law & Happiness base
- Have a small garrison to start with that can soon be reduced to 1 (in most cases)
- Move in a Spy & Assassin

Most settlements really aren't a problem and I've never had to go back and exterminate a single one in all the testing. It may be that some Factions aren't as good at this as the Romans, and this could be addressed. Active Governor management helps.

[tungri_centurio]

[QUOTE]

how do they get traits/ancillaries like magestrate en so on.most of my FM have low managment and enfluence even iff i leave them for few turns in my citys with scription or ludus..and with that outrages pop growth,low income,unhappy citys....

[ur-Lord Tedric]

Seriously this^ have worked in the steppes? I tried doing it (long time ago) and didnt work .
And the problem is bigger when the settlements afected are your settlements (were my settlements), playing as Sarmatia or Bosphorus.

As noted, the vast majority of the experience is with Rome as that's what I've been testing almost exclusively for the last Year+. However, I did have a Sarmatian 'holiday' last year for a couple of months (mainly to test HA) and also applied the same and certainly didn't have too many problems that I recall.

how do they get traits/ancillaries like magestrate en so on.most of my FM have low managment and enfluence even iff i leave them for few turns in my citys with scription or ludus..and with that outrages pop growth,low income,unhappy citys....

Traits and Retinue are added all the time. Genuine active management of Governors helps and that includes moving the Ancillaries around. Because characters start to die off after approximately 60yrs old, that's when I replace them. Old guys can not only be a great source of new Ancillaries before they die, but they can be used to park the 'bad ancillaries' that they then take with them when they die.

Some of my characters (one per front if I can manage it) will be chosen specifically, and particularly if they start with some themselves, with Influence in mind. They get (iirc):

- A Greek Physician (everyone gets one of these if possible)
- An Honest Advisor (+1 Law)
- A Magistrate
- A Skilled Politician
- A Geometer
- and/all up to another 4 - who add Influence (Astrologers, Historians, Sculptors, etc, and possible one of the 'specials' like Tiberius Gracchus with Inf+3)

These guys move in to a new settlement as soon as it;s conquered, normally with a small garrison, and they stay there until a permanent Governor is found with other ancillaries to take over - then they move on. I will swap out retinue from them when they get old, or often earlier as they then acquire Good Admin and Influence themselves.

I also often move Governors around a bit, making sure that Senators get the Propraetor positions, for example, and I will replace the occasional bad one.

Finding a really good 'builder' can save a lot of money too - and they can be used to save loads on the expensive stuff. I gain at least one new character every turn. They go to school in Capua until I need them.

[mishkin]

Seriously this^ have worked in the steppes? I tried doing it (long time ago) and didnt work .
And the problem is bigger when the settlements afected are your settlements (were my settlements), playing as Sarmatia or Bosphorus.

[Sertorio]

Culture penalty, i believe that is the reason why the Bosphoran faction has problems controlling the steppe settlements. I also chose to ignore the steppe, keep it defended and concentrate on the black sea.

[menawati]

Culture penalty, i believe that is the reason why the Bosphoran faction has problems controlling the steppe settlements. I also chose to ignore the steppe, keep it defended and concentrate on the black sea.

Sounds like that could be it (and thanks Tedric I usually do all that stuff except the spy/assassin).
Anyway I restarted the campaign, didn't attack Scythia at all this time and just sent some boats over the sea to hit Pontus/Greeks/Pergamon instead. Mainly Greek culture settlements there so suits Bosporus better anyway.

[LoGaL]

Tedric, the problem is an indestructible building called herders wich raises population grow way too much

[ur-Lord Tedric]

Tedric, the problem is an indestructible building called herders wich raises population grow way too much

Then I'll get the Team to have a look - especially as many Factions ( to help the AI) have had pop growth increased recently, which may then only exacerbate the problem.

Since discovering and then learning more about the Mod, there are just so many new and revised buildings that can increase Happiness and reduce Unrest that I have never, ever, not once, had a settlement rebel in all the testing. The Druid building of the Celts is also non-destructible and can cause issues, but they are manageable.

[mishkin]

thanks for the answers/work Tedric

[menawati]

Sorry to bring it up again but I mentioned a problem with the 'rural community control' buildings. The ones that increase pop growth have always worked fine for me and are very useful but I'm still not sure how the ones that reduce growth are supposed to work. Because of my growth going wild in steppe settlements on my Bosporus campaign I used them in an attempt to halt the growth and offset the 'herders'. The first one, 'suburbs', had an effect but none of the rest made any difference at all to the population growth.

[ur-Lord Tedric]

Sorry to bring it up again but I mentioned a problem with the 'rural community control' buildings. The ones that increase pop growth have always worked fine for me and are very useful but I'm still not sure how the ones that reduce growth are supposed to work. Because of my growth going wild in steppe settlements on my Bosporus campaign I used them in an attempt to halt the growth and offset the 'herders'. The first one, 'suburbs', had an effect but none of the rest made any difference at all to the population growth.

That's no problem - and I had no experience of those because I have never used them. However, I have just gone through EDB and the negative pop bonus is definitely there.

I'll see if it can be checked.

[tone]

Strange - "Herders" only provides a 1% population growth bonus in our current Beta - it may have been 1.5% before, but that's not that signfiicant.