Heavy , heavier legionary

[PROMETHEUS ts]

there are testifies of a much heavier version of the Roman legionary , this was for mostly facing the deadly dacian weapons that could hit ,

I hope this possibility to upgrate up to heavier version the roman legionaries could be possible ... since the game allows custom modifications to units and weapons used , perhaps is possible to also implement the heavy version of the normal heavy roman infantryman .





despite in the artistic representation it shows only one arm , I am not sure if instead both arms shoudl be covered .

[Lord Tomyris]

Sounds good...I'd also like to be able to recruit legionaries equipped only with shield and helmet by way of defence - Caesar, Tacitus and Dio all speak of legionaries relieved of their body armour to increase speed and manoeuvrability in battle, and this could make for an interesting tactical choice plus more variety.

[torongill]

Around 100 years outside the timeframe of the campaign, Prom.
While I welcome the idea, it should come as a necessity, i.e. one of the requirements should be the heavy defeat of a Roman army by these falxes.

BTW, can you source the possibility of customizing equipment? I am genuinely interested because I haven't seen anything like that discussed or hinted.

[Kaeso]

Around 100 years outside the timeframe of the campaign, Prom.
While I welcome the idea, it should come as a necessity, i.e. one of the requirements should be the heavy defeat of a Roman army by these falxes.

As historically authentic as that sounds, it seems somewhat counterintuitive to have to lose an army just to get an equipment upgrade. It does however raise an interesting point. Maybe the Romans could start off with lesser equipment but become more advanced as they encounter more cultures. It might provide an interesting dynamic that would encourage Roman players to explore the map.

On the other hand it might be a bit tough to implement. Requiring the creation of many more assets than would otherwise be neccesary.

[Augustus Scipius]

Around 100 years outside the timeframe of the campaign, Prom.

Indeed, but we have had ahistorical technology in previous games. For example in Empire some techs were from outside the 18th century, such as steam-propelled warships or percussion caps. They could be a little creative this time as well, especially if the Manicae were at the end of the armor/weapons tech tree.

BTW, can you source the possibility of customizing equipment? I am genuinely interested because I haven't seen anything like that discussed or hinted.

There have been some threads requesting customisable units/generals, such as this: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...zable+generals

However, there has not been any official acknowledgement on the matter as far as I know.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

Indeed, but we have had ahistorical technology in previous games. For example in Empire some techs were from outside the 18th century, such as steam-propelled warships or percussion caps. They could be a little creative this time as well, especially if the Manicae were at the end of the armor/weapons tech tree.




There have been some threads requesting customisable units/generals, such as this: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showt...zable+generals

However, there has not been any official acknowledgement on the matter as far as I know.

I read it in the first PC gamer review ... they said you could equip your soldiers with the new stuff you come to get with technology , or contact with other cultures.

[Augustus Scipius]

I read it in the first PC gamer review ... they said you could equip your soldiers with the new stuff you come to get with technology , or contact with other cultures.

Do you have a link to the article? Not that I doubt you, I just want to read it myself.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

Around 100 years outside the timeframe of the campaign, Prom.
While I welcome the idea, it should come as a necessity, i.e. one of the requirements should be the heavy defeat of a Roman army by these falxes.

BTW, can you source the possibility of customizing equipment? I am genuinely interested because I haven't seen anything like that discussed or hinted.

The timeframe is about 30 years not 100 , and the game clearly shows the presence of segmentata so it make sense to have also the heavy version of it that was developed just after dacian contacts and since those are ingame too , it makes sense to have that upgrade as well....

[torongill]

Trajan's wars are from the beginning of the second century CE. The timeframe of Rome 2 is supposed to be 300 years counted from the onset of the First Punic war, meaning up to 36 CE. That puts the Dacian wars of Trajan at least 64 years outside the frame of Rome 2 and if the manica and helm reinforcements appeared as a reaction to Dacian weaponry, it would've been after the beginning of the first war, probably after its end, when the lessons learned were being applied.

However, since the research tree is supposed to be completed before the end of the campaign, so that you are able to use the technology in the end campaign, this heavy lorica+manica will be anachronistic by around a century.

I said I have no problem with the addition of anachronistic elements, but they should be costly. EB had marvelous examples - on of the reforms for one of the Eastern states depended on a heavy defeat in which your commanding general died. IIRC it was the so-called "Cataphract reform".

[Augustus Scipius]

Sounds good. Manica should be an upgrade that gives a better melee defence and charge bonus. It could be a branch of technology that started from standardized equipment, advanced to lorica laminata and culminated to manica and ocrae.

[Seanakk]

Somewhat anachronistic, perhaps it may be seen in an expansion covering the later empire but other than that I doubt it.

[Yamabushi]

Heavy armour should be an optional upgrade. I.e giving a legion more armour. will decrease their maneuverability, so it's purely your choice to encumber them or not.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

I bought the magazine .

[BunnyPoopCereal]

Covering the other arm is kinda useless and a poor use of resources because that hand is behind the shield.

[Hannarr]

Only the sword arm required extra armouring, as the other arm was covered by the shield when raised or in formation. the extra armour on the shield arm would weigh several kilograms and would be more of a hindrance than a help when used with a scutum.

[Deadly Rabbit]

Different weapon loads will be very interesting. I vaguely remember reading many years ago an account of a roman general arming some of his legionaries with two handed mauls to take on Persian cataphracts. I would love to be able to explore those sort of options.

[PROMETHEUS ts]

If not wrong the gaul made legionaries named alaudae was equiped with peculiar feather helmets and axes to cut elephant legs.

[B. W.]

If memory serves me correctly, the Romans made this adaptation because the curved swords (not really sure if it was a sword or some other weapon) of the Dacians were causing horrific injuries on the Romans and it was just one arm that was armored.

They've said (I think) that we would be able to equip our legions as we saw fit. I wonder if this means we'll be able to equip individual cohorts or will it be the entire legion?

[Evalation]

I wonder if this means we'll be able to equip individual cohorts or will it be the entire legion?

I believe it may possibly be the entire legion, I think this because everything else they have talked about was about the legion as a whole, unless I misunderstood some posts a while back you can only recruit a entire legion and not individual units anymore.

Though im not certain on this however, it does sound interesting to equip one or more of your legions with gear appropriate to wherever their posted.

Id also like to see winter equipment like Prom suggested a while back, I think that would be really cool and add more realism to the game itself.

[Imperial Eagle]

I believe it may possibly be the entire legion, I think this because everything else they have talked about was about the legion as a whole, unless I misunderstood some posts a while back you can only recruit a entire legion and not individual units anymore.

Though im not certain on this however, it does sound interesting to equip one or more of your legions with gear appropriate to wherever their posted.

Id also like to see winter equipment like Prom suggested a while back, I think that would be really cool and add more realism to the game itself.

Maybe have different types of cohort within a single legion? For example, in the Late Empire legions had the regular cohorts in addition to a lanciarii (light infantry) cohort, and in a BI type expansion the player would arm one cohort as light troops and designate them as lanciarii.... this could also work in representing the Camillan/Polybian legions before the marian reforms, with the hastati, triarii, etc. and maybe even the attached unit of equites? Then later on you can make cav-only alae instead of having to attach them to legions, which could grant a bonus or reduce upkeep maybe. I can just imagine a late game Imperial Legion, with the First Cohort with eagle, etc. and the heavy cohort with manica, the archers and other auxilia cohorts..... Maybe even have the option to make the first cohort the heavily armored one, to protect the Eagle better? Other nations could have their own military systems represented as well.