The Art of War and Medieval 2 Total War

[Eisenhart_IV]

To those who have read or listened to Sun Tzu's The Art of War, how relevant do you think it is to M2TW? How much of the information from the book you think can be directly applied to the game?

[Rijul.J.Ballal]

To be honest pretty much all successful war strategies are more or less similar and it is impossible to win TW without using them, even if you do not wish to use them...

[Deafening Milk]

Only some of it, a lot of the book is about deceit, supply lines and the like as well as general warring strategies. In tw all you have to do is conquer province after province with little thought to your home provinces besides keeping them from revolting and making new buildings

[Eisenhart_IV]

I personally find the title itself, The Art of War, quite ironic. Although i see warfare as more of an art (and Sun Tzu seems to agree) where every battlefield and situation is different, and requires creativity in delivering a victory, Sun Tzu seems to be trying to break it down to set rules and explicit instructions. I fully believe there are methods which have proven to work, therefore warfare has science element in it too, and to me Sun Tzu is actually revealing this side of war. I guess the art side of it comes into play when you have to adjust and apply these broader principles to your given circumstances.

I was listening to the book yesterday, and i thought to myself, that some of his principles, if carefully followed, would take a lot of risks and fun out of m2tw. I know this may sound blasphemous to somebody. What is this newbie thinking of himself!? But i genuinly think Sun Tzu's theories of beating your enemy without fighting and capturing enemies' kingdoms whole and intact, were devised so that as few people as possible would die, and less resources would have to be spent in restoring the army and settlements. I think capturing opponents' countries whole and intact is a good idea, even in m2tw, but i think ideas such as trying to beat your enemy without actual fighting, would make for a successful, but (to me) quite boring gameplay.

This in mind though, i wanted to focus on the things that you have seen in the book and have successfully applied to the game. For instance, i have learned from him the importance of moving swiftly when attacking. When i encounter a particularly tough opponent, taking out several of his settlements in one turn, often disables him so severly that the rest of the campaign becomes significantly easier.

[JasonDomination]

I personally find the title itself, The Art of War, quite ironic. Although i see warfare as more of an art (and Sun Tzu seems to agree) where every battlefield and situation is different, and requires creativity in delivering a victory, Sun Tzu seems to be trying to break it down to set rules and explicit instructions. I fully believe there are methods which have proven to work, therefore warfare has science element in it too, and to me Sun Tzu is actually revealing this side of war. I guess the art side of it comes into play when you have to adjust and apply these broader principles to your given circumstances.

I was listening to the book yesterday, and i thought to myself, that some of his principles, if carefully followed, would take a lot of risks and fun out of m2tw. I know this may sound blasphemous to somebody. What is this newbie thinking of himself!? But i genuinly think Sun Tzu's theories of beating your enemy without fighting and capturing enemies' kingdoms whole and intact, were devised so that as few people as possible would die, and less resources would have to be spent in restoring the army and settlements. I think capturing opponents' countries whole and intact is a good idea, even in m2tw, but i think ideas such as trying to beat your enemy without actual fighting, would make for a successful, but (to me) quite boring gameplay.

This in mind though, i wanted to focus on the things that you have seen in the book and have successfully applied to the game. For instance, i have learned from him the importance of moving swiftly when attacking. When i encounter a particularly tough opponent, taking out several of his settlements in one turn, often disables him so severly that the rest of the campaign becomes significantly easier.

I'd like to point out that the actual literal title of Art of War is the "Laws of War" or the "Ways of War." The book is practical down to its very core, and "art" is but a romantic embellishment that probably has SunZi turning in his grave. At least it helps sell the book.

There actually are a few games that try to simulate the political intrigue that TW lack (Crusader Kings, anyone?). These definitely aren't as mainstream as TW, but they appeal to a niche market.

[Aeratus]

A lot of Sun Tzu's art of war is so general that it can be applied to anything, not limited to actual war. In this sense, it is always relevant (but then again, it's relevant to just about anything).

However, Sun Tzu doesn't have much that can be specifically applied to the game mechanics. Therefore, although Sun Tzu is relevant, it is not directly relevant. You need to make a connection between Sun Tzu's philosophy and actual gameplay.