Critique

[knight of meh]

after learn to read and some lessons in good behaviour. bye.

Don't you just love those people who expect perfection from volunteers ..

[WhiffOfGrapeshot]

They're the best! This mod really isn't at all for someone that wants an arcadey attention deficit disorder catering, vanilla on crack mod. There's a few mods out there for that.

[Gigantus]

Patch 2 will give every settlement a base level barrack, thereby opening the free upkeep slots for the base units. That should (and apparently does) help the economy.
'Carl the Taxman' worked fairly well in version 1, but it had a major flaw: due to it's insane number of monitors per faction it added three minutes to the turn calculations which was unacceptable. I wasn't able to simplify Carl's script (believe me I tried) and we had to abandon it. Carl had about 4 times the monitors of the current script, stretched over 8000 lines.
In comparison: the 'Kalendar' monitor which houses 201 historic_events is just that - ONE monitor. It doesn't slow the calculations perceptibly.

France and Spain are not meant to be defeated...

"The map is unclear and ridiculously fragmented, even for the period."
I don't think you are aware how ridiculously fragmented the map of the time actually was. We have taken care to represent the actual fragmentation to a great degree - but even then it is still a far cry from the actual situation. I am sure Monti can give you a suitable historical map reflecting that. Here is one I found:

[WhiffOfGrapeshot]

Yep, that's ridiculously fragmented, alright.

[sheba021]

How do I tone down my armies turning back on me when they have no general? I can't even move armies over the map without them.

[blow56]

So much for a criticism. There's no point in huffing and puffing at me - and accusing me of bad behaviour - for pointing out the shortcomings of your mod. If you don't like such comments, don't invite them. Believe me, this is my best behaviour. As regards your fragmented map, I am not talking about the number of factions or the placements - I am talking about the cities/fortresses stuck behind impassable terrain, so that they can neither be conquered nor add to gameplay. There are too many such fudges in this - I note you have not tried to defend the Diplomat or Turkish enclaves - and the fact that you admit neither France nor Spain can be defeated is astonishingly revealed as yet another. What is the point of doing that? I played as Sweden, too and discovered that, out of the blue, a peace was imposed on me simply because of some historical fudge you wanted to force. I do not prefer vanilla games, but neither am I overwhelmed by someone's desire to try and forcefeed me a particular view of history. If I want the Thirty Years War as if happened, I will read a book. This is a monumental work of technical wizardry spoiled by blinkered thinking. Now, this 'noob' will go back to play some Darthmod for the good of his sanity ...

[Gigantus]

Inaccessible Forts - every faction has one (Jagdschloss) which is used to house the heir if the faction is played by the AI. I am not aware of inaccessible settlements.
Diplomatic Enclave - the map is simply to vast to send a diplomat around trying to make contact, hence we provided he enclosure.
Turkish Enclave - doesn't exist, but the spawn is too frequent and too strong. This matter is addressed in the coming patch

[Mausolos of Caria]

First of all: The Map is so immersive and impressive that I can't see how anyone would criticize it. To have certain provinces like a diocese split into several parts all over the map must have been a very intense work and I love it. And thanks for explaining the function of the Jagdschloss, I wasn't aware of that before.

As for the diplomats in the mountains, it is really helpful and was they are near Vienna one can really imagine ambassadors from abroad would have met there regularly, so it's not even unhistorical.

My only problem is the economy, especially for the AI, because it's not nice to see them all being bankrupt Also, bigger factions played by the human player have extreme money issues as well which are a bit exaggerated. But little factions (say 6 provinces or less) make for a very good campaign.

[Gigantus]

The economy is getting a nice boost by the adding of barracks to the settlements - free upkeep from round one, results have been encouraging.

[Mausolos of Caria]

The economy is getting a nice boost by the adding of barracks to the settlements - free upkeep from round one, results have been encouraging.

That sounds good indeed, especially for those factions who start with bigger armies (like France). When can we expect the next patch? I know modders don't like this question, just wondering if you only just started with the patch (I guess you have because the first patch has only been released very recently).

[WhiffOfGrapeshot]

That sounds good indeed, especially for those factions who start with bigger armies (like France). When can we expect the next patch? I know modders don't like this question, just wondering if you only just started with the patch (I guess you have because the first patch has only been released very recently).

He said likely 24 hours about 12 hours ago, so probably within the next day or two. This team is quick with their fixes!

[MKeogh]

The economy is getting a nice boost by the adding of barracks to the settlements - free upkeep from round one, results have been encouraging.

Sounds like a step in the right direction. Any thought to giving each city a basic market as well? Merchant income is very important in this mod and the CAI's inability to recruit merchants due to it not being able to afford even a basic market is also killing it economically.

It's not outrageous criticism to say that the CAI is really, really struggling with this map and economic engine even on Very Hard. It's a shame. The potential of this campaign is immense. This mod offers the possibility of a truly deep stategy game within the TW engine. Unfortunately, the CAI is not capable of presenting much of a challenge. M2TW's CAI was never any great shakes, but this mod makes things even tougher on it.

Due to money woes, it can't develop or garrison its cities. Thus, it can't build ships, merchants, or religious agents. Plus, cities that are culturally undeveloped and without a garrison are susceptible to revolts. AI nations lose quite a few cities to revolts which results in them being even weaker. Although I enjoy playing within the large map and restricted economic engine, it eventually feels that I'm hitting an inert punching-bag that is incapable of resisting.

Some criticisms:

I'm not a fan of the "people in flight" mechanic. The biggest weakness of the both RTW and M2TW is that there are too many battles. The biggest reason I usually quit my campaigns is because I get burned-out fighting battles. It's just gets boring and repetitive fighting and winning battle after battle. The "people in flight" mechanic just adds to the tedium. You fight hard to eliminate an AI nation and then "pow" they're back with several magic stacks. It's just tiresome. I always liked the re-emerging faction mechanic of the original STW and MTW and its later iteration in ETW/NTW/STW2 because it happens through a natural rebellion. On the other hand, the instantanous appearance of several doom-stacks with the "people in flight" mechanic is gamey to the extreme. Plus, this is your "reward" for destroying an enemy? Bigger, tougher armies than what you faced prior to taking their last town?

Another issue is countries having such large starting armies at game's beginning that they instantly go bankrupt after Turn 1. The player can work around it by either disbanding units, quickly blitzing and looting, or taking advantage of free garrison slots in minor cities. The CAI can't do any of that so it sinks hopelessly into the red. Any thought to cutting down those large starting armies? Poland-Lithuania's situation is especially grim.

It's good to hear that the endless stream of Turk doom-stacks will be addressed. With 1.x the Turks were a mixed bag, I had one campaign where they gobbled-up a chunk of the map, but there were other games where they would just sit at the bottom of the map apparently confused due to the nearest cities being controlled by rebels rather than Austrians.

I really do think this mod's potential is immense and do appreciate how much hard-work and dedication has gone into it. However, it's a bit undercooked right now. (And that's not even addressing its myriad of stability issues which is a whole other ballgame.)

[Monguntiacum]

You`re right, i underrated the struggle of the CAI with the economy/big armies and unrest of cities. The basic barrack helps much to CAI, also i like the idea of market and maybe the tavern in every city. i gave factions big armies to avoid rushing and help ai factions to hold against aggressive players, but i guess i overshoot the mark

The horde/people in flight we gave to:
spain, poland, sweden and france because they ´re mighty factions with regions "beyond" our map, so i think its unrealistic, when e.g. i kicked frenchies out of Reims and Metz, i conquered France, no when i plunder Reims, my westfrankish brothers will send a big army to kick my ass
ottomans and transylvania, because they´re should plunder and annoy the emperor
bayreuth, trier, baden and hesse, because they´re very weak factions, horde would help AI to survive "litty adverity"

[k/t]

I think doing things the way Deyy did with his Real Rebellion Mod is better for the small factions.

To prevent the player from rushing too much early on in the game, a garrison script would be better than giving all factions large armies whose upkeep the AI can't deal with.

[WhiffOfGrapeshot]

Yeah, a combination garrison script (not full stacks every time a city is sieged, though) and faction resurrection like in Deyy's mod would be nice. "A people in flight" could still happen, but on a smaller scale instead of a sudden onrush of 10 stacks.

[Monguntiacum]

Do you have an idea, what amount of work is scripting a garrison script for 199 regions? Thats slavery

[WhiffOfGrapeshot]

Do you have an idea, what amount of work is scripting a garrison script for 199 regions? Thats slavery

Perhaps only capitols, then you're down to under 30.

EDIT: What the heck, when the next patch is released, I'll give it a go and add a small garrison script for all the regions. Don't be surprised if they all spawn very very similar looking half stacks, though.

[Monguntiacum]

some capitals (of weak factions) have already garrison scripts. but i do not know what effect garrison script monitors for 199 regions would have for turn change time...

[knight of meh]

don't do it for all the regions the siege fest would be unbearable

if you stick to the standard regiments of foot (maybe well trained) and or mercenaries it could become a copy and paste job ... a long one but still less time consuming

[WhiffOfGrapeshot]

some capitals (of weak factions) have already garrison scripts. but i do not know what effect garrison script monitors for 199 regions would have for turn change time...

Apparently it doesn't greatly affect turn times, but I'm somewhat skeptical... Perhaps just 2-3 important regions per faction.

don't do it for all the regions the siege fest would be unbearable

if you stick to the standard regiments of foot (maybe well trained) and or mercenaries it could become a copy and paste job ... a long one but still less time consuming

Yeah, I was thinking standard regiments of foot pikemen and musketeers so it'd be a copy and paste job for the most part.