Build a PC for Rome 2 / Hardware Recommendations and Advice Thread

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

Loving the setup so far. What are the cons for Water cooled? I've always wanted to build a rig with it included, but I was always that little bit out of my depth when it came to cooling.
The Alienware monitor was a bloody fantastic buy at $190 in an auction. The RRP is still I think at ~$449, so good score there. It was "manufacturer refurbished", but it came in the Alienware box, with seals and protectors intact.

In terms of keyboard/mouse, anything will do, but i'm looking at lower end keyboards that have led back-lit keys, cus it's pretty annoying playing on a bright screen at night and needing a light on to see the keys, which in turn reflects off your screen.

[Biggus Splenus]

No cons to water cooling apart from the price. Never fear of a leak, that's not going to happen unless you yank on the tubes with a considerable amount of force or cut the tubes. It's even easier to install than air cooling heatsinks.

That is a great buy for the monitor

For the keyboard I would recommend a Ducky one
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...1361&vk_sort=4
About $140 AUD and comes in a ton of colours. It's expensive because of the mechanical keys, but if you don't really care about them and just want the LED back lights, the best option is this Razer
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...ducts_id=22074
But you can only get it in green.

For the mouse, it depends on what you want. Corsair have a great FPS mouse with a sensitivity button (deigned for good sniping). They also have an MMO mouse which could come in handy with Total War if you configure the custom keys properly (quickly giving orders to your legion with a single click), but the key placement is a little strange in my opinion, but you might like it.
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...h=258_697_1303

Logitech have a great MMO mouse too which have a bunch of key on the side where your thumb is (which light up any way you want, so it can match your board colouring ), I think it's got a great appearance and it has a nice braided cord. Definitely worth your money.
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...ducts_id=21066

I know these seem fairly pricy, but they will last a long time

[A Barbarian]

@Splenyi
Sorry, but you have a bit of a dangerous half-knowledge, mixing up stuff and sometimes presenting your personal opinion as fact or as the 'absolutely best thing to do'. Please be a bit more conservative with your opinions, thanks!

PS: I am assembling PCs since 20 years


Regarding the original poll: If possible, I would wait until Rome 2 is out and has been benchmarked before building a rig explicitly for Rome 2. Especially the multi-core optimization is a completely unknown variable and can have a big impact regarding the CPU choice (Intel has superior performance per core but AMD offers more cores for less money).

Just a general tip regarding graphics cards. If you buy a card for $250 or more, I wouldn't buy a model with 2GB memory anymore. Only if you usually don't use any AA it might be a safe choice. HD textures and HD texture mods are getting more and more popular and even on a 1920x1080 resolution you can exceed 2GB using HD textures (e.g. modded Skyrim). I know that the default memory for Nvidia cards is 2GB atm but usually there are also 3GB or 4GB models available for some extra cash.

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

No cons to water cooling apart from the price. Never fear of a leak, that's not going to happen unless you yank on the tubes with a considerable amount of force or cut the tubes. It's even easier to install than air cooling heatsinks.

That is a great buy for the monitor

For the keyboard I would recommend a Ducky one
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...1361&vk_sort=4
About $140 AUD and comes in a ton of colours. It's expensive because of the mechanical keys, but if you don't really care about them and just want the LED back lights, the best option is this Razer
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...ducts_id=22074
But you can only get it in green.

For the mouse, it depends on what you want. Corsair have a great FPS mouse with a sensitivity button (deigned for good sniping). They also have an MMO mouse which could come in handy with Total War if you configure the custom keys properly (quickly giving orders to your legion with a single click), but the key placement is a little strange in my opinion, but you might like it.
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...h=258_697_1303

Logitech have a great MMO mouse too which have a bunch of key on the side where your thumb is (which light up any way you want, so it can match your board colouring ), I think it's got a great appearance and it has a nice braided cord. Definitely worth your money.
http://www.pccasegear.com/index.php?...ducts_id=21066

I know these seem fairly pricy, but they will last a long time

Yeah, woah. Probs not going to go with that end of Keyboard/ Mouse. Don't like the Macro keys, because MMOs are the worst thing to happen to gaming since they stopped making N64... and the price is too much to ask. I've seen some customisable backlit keyboards for under $100.

time for some End Game BF3!

[Biggus Splenus]

@Splenyi
Sorry, but you have a bit of a dangerous half-knowledge, mixing up stuff and sometimes presenting your personal opinion as fact or as the 'absolutely best thing to do'. Please be a bit more conservative with your opinions, thanks!

Sorry if I done so, can you point out where?

Regarding the original poll: If possible, I would wait until Rome 2 is out and has been benchmarked before building a rig explicitly for Rome 2. Especially the multi-core optimization is a completely unknown variable and can have a big impact regarding the CPU choice (Intel has superior performance per core but AMD offers more cores for less money).

Well, I for one want to be playing Rome 2 when it comes out, and I don't want to have to wait till benchmarks to order and assemble my PC. So I guess this is a PC built in anticipation for Rome 2

Just a general tip regarding graphics cards. If you buy a card for $250 or more, I wouldn't buy a model with 2GB memory anymore. Only if you usually don't use any AA it might be a safe choice. HD textures and HD texture mods are getting more and more popular and even on a 1920x1080 resolution you can exceed 2GB using HD textures (e.g. modded Skyrim). I know that the default memory for Nvidia cards is 2GB atm but usually there are also 3GB or 4GB models available for some extra cash.

I am aware of that, but Shogun 2 doesn't need more than 2GDDR5, and I doubt Rome 2 will either. TW just doesn't need or use graphics the same size or as much textures as games like Skyrim. 3GDDR5 will only come in handy when you are playing a heavily, graphically modded Skyrim (for example) or using a multi-monitor setup. Vanilla games these days don't really need 3 GDDR5 apart from games with seriously intensive graphics like Crysis. But again, this is a TW build.

I know you can get Nvidia cards with more than 2 GDDR5 but that is a lot more expensive than an AMD card with the same memory. I was going to cover all this thoroughly, but I obviously haven't yet, hence no YouTube videos

EDIT: I've renamed the thread to clear up anyone's thoughts.

[A Barbarian]

Sorry if I done so, can you point out where?

Damn, I lost my original detailed response, lol. So here in a quick form (quotes are not exact anymore):

i7 CPUs are not for gaming

While many games don't profit from the hyperthreading of i7 CPUs and some even perform lower with hyperthreading enabled, there are some games which can profit from it and the future there will certainly be more since better multithreading/multi-core usage is the only way to increase the performance substantially (single core performance is going up relatively slow). Sure i5s have the better price/performance ratio (I have a i5-2500k myself) but i7 can be great for games too (if you have the money).

ASRock Extreme 4/6 is a no brainer compared to ASUS/Gigabyte

While the Extreme 4/6 are very good boards and have an excellent price/performance ratio, in the last 2 years, I had less problems with ASUS boards (didn't use any Gigabyte boards) and found their system software superior to ASRock. So it's a trade off.

CUDA is used by TW games to handle thousands of soldiers and that's why Nvidia > AMD in TW games

No, TW games don't use CUDA. The pathfinding, AI, animation, ... related to the units are all calculated by the CPU (and essentially a single core) which is why the performance goes into the knees when too many units are trying to get across a bottleneck like a bridge for example. If I remember correctly, according to the benchmark comparisons I have seen, it seems that MSAA runs better on Nvidia cards and when it's enabled they usually win but without MSAA AMD is often faster.

Except for the CUDA section where you mix up a lot of stuff completely, you are mostly right but I would just be a bit more careful with your statements.


Regarding building a PC before Rome 2 is out, consider these facts:
- S2 was completely broke for most X58/X79 chipset users who used a AMD 7xxx graphics card for more than 1 year (until AMD finally fixed the issue in a recent beta driver)
- S2 was completely broke for all AMD bulldozer CPU users for a few weeks/months (needed motherboard BIOS updates)
- One S2 patch introduced a 50% performance penalty for all GTX670/680 cards for a few months (until Nvidia fixed their drivers)

[Adreno]

Do not get the 680, it's geared towards animation and video rendering more than gaming. Just a single 670 is perfect for your budget I think, and making sure you have the option to add another 670 in the future is always a smart move.


Never buy new parts off of eBay. It's always worth the warranty.


^ This.

As for the 690 and 7990, they are dual GPU cards, ie. the 690 has two 670 GPUs inside of the card. I honestly wouldn't bother with a card that holds that much power and cost $1000 alone, I mean, the VGA setup should be the most expensive part in your gaming rig, but that much power can not be fully utilised in all games today on an average monitor setup.

actually the 680 is pretty much made for gaming, and a 690 has 2 680 chips, like the 7990 has 2 7970 chips, i think youre confused with the new titan, which is more suited for mediawork, they also have special computing gpu's like quadros

[♠ Thomas Cochrane ♠]

^ don't worry I don't want a 680 anyway. the 7970 was perfect, but I'm leaning towards the added compatibility of the 670 (which outperforms the 7970 in most areas anyway)

[Biggus Splenus]

Ah, more typos I've been tired lately, that's my excuse

[Chris Death]

Although there is sure some useful info to be found in this thread in my opinion it is still of high risk.

This thread is supposed to be a tutorial for others to invest money on something that has not been
approved yet and where there is no chance to prove until the game is being released.

Fact is; you can be prepared with best hardware and knowledge but this will never guarantee that
the game will work - it just happens by occasion that some games do not like certain setups
and whatever you do - you won't get it to run (no matter how expert one is).

A tutorial usually stands for: do it like explained here and it will work

I made that mistake once - to get a decent rig for arma (a month before it's release) and it just didn't
work - every other game worked on that rig like cheese - just not arma - no matter what i did/changed.

~S~ CD

[Biggus Splenus]

While many games don't profit from the hyperthreading of i7 CPUs and some even perform lower with hyperthreading enabled, there are some games which can profit from it and the future there will certainly be more since better multithreading/multi-core usage is the only way to increase the performance substantially (single core performance is going up relatively slow). Sure i5s have the better price/performance ratio (I have a i5-2500k myself) but i7 can be great for games too (if you have the money).

I suppose it will be, but definitely not now. Maybe in a year and a half it will have a better price/performance ratio because games will actually take advantage of hyperthreading, might even take longer than that, but definitely not now. For a primarily gaming PC at this time, the extra $100 you spend on the i7 is practically $100 down the drain, unless your investing that $100 so your ready for future PC games that will take advantage of this then I suppose that could be an option, but by then Intel will have even better hyperthreaded CPUs for the same price. It's a decision worth considering I suppose.

While the Extreme 4/6 are very good boards and have an excellent price/performance ratio, in the last 2 years, I had less problems with ASUS boards (didn't use any Gigabyte boards) and found their system software superior to ASRock. So it's a trade off.

ASRock certainly haven't been a premium brand in the past, but NOW they are the most reliable. But I do agree with you that their software is not as good as ASUS, MSI or Gigabyte boards.

No, TW games don't use CUDA. The pathfinding, AI, animation, ... related to the units are all calculated by the CPU (and essentially a single core) which is why the performance goes into the knees when too many units are trying to get across a bottleneck like a bridge for example. If I remember correctly, according to the benchmark comparisons I have seen, it seems that MSAA runs better on Nvidia cards and when it's enabled they usually win but without MSAA AMD is often faster.

Except for the CUDA section where you mix up a lot of stuff completely, you are mostly right but I would just be a bit more careful with your statements.

I suppose I was misinformed, not my fault but I definitely should have checked my facts.

Regarding building a PC before Rome 2 is out, consider these facts....

I suppose those are unavoidable software problems though, and S2 definitely went though a long period of constant patching which was a nightmare. Hopefully CA release a complete title this time.

I remember when I was playing S2 multiplayer campaign with my brother right after release, the game would screw up constantly, thinking it was his turn when it was actually mine, and neither of us could do anything. CA should just take their time on Rome 2, and not get all excited and announce the release date so early, so that it gives them more leg way to improve the games bugs. Off topic, but necessary

I made that mistake once - to get a decent rig for arma (a month before it's release) and it just didn't work - every other game worked on that rig like cheese - just not arma - no matter what i did/changed.

I know my younger brother had troubles with ARMA 2, but he just needed to update and optimise his driver settings. Not the same game, but I'm just saying software is equally as essential as hardware. But I suppose you just got unlucky.

And the definition of tutorial is to pass knowledge/information from one person, to another. It's not a strict step-by-step procedure like you are implying.

EDIT: poll scores: 20 want written form, 13 want Youtube form, 8 don't care.

[Chris Death]

And the definition of tutorial is to pass knowledge/information from one person, to another. It's not a strict step-by-step procedure like you are implying.

No, the most common definition of tutorial is; to provide a step by step instruction.

Although there is one entry to be found through google where it says something close to your
definition of a tutorial but for passing knowledge/information nowadays we are using e.g: a knowledge database and/or an info database.

And no matter how we gonna call that thing now it is still of a high risk due to the fact that real people may spend real money provided
by speculation based on prior experience with similar stuff.

~S~ CD

[Numidian Mercenary]

Thing is, for me, it's more practical to build my computer at the end of summer, when I have free time rather than at around October, where I will be busy with work. I know building a PC is not supposed to be particularly difficult but I've not done it before so wouldn't want to be forced to rush through it.


Personally, the only high powered things I will ever use my PC for will be for gaming and perhaps various MATLAB/C++ code. In all honesty, I'm not sure what kind of code I will be running in the future as it's generally stuff written by research scientists but currently it takes quite long to run on my laptop, which is annoying. If i7 CPU, 16GB RAM will improve the performance noticeably, I may be tempted to shell out on it, if you guys reckon it's worth it. Also, it will have the side benefit of future-proofing my pc but I realise that the vast majority of the time these extra aspects will go unused.

[A Barbarian]

If you have large projects, then a multithreaded C++ compiler (e.g. MS-Visual Studio) is one of the applications which benefits most from the hyperthreading of i7 CPUs (pure scientific calculations without much IO usually don't benefit). But what's more important for that is a decent SSD, otherwise the CPU will always be waiting for the HD and the money for the i7 would be wasted.

[Numidian Mercenary]

If you have large projects, then a multithreaded C++ compiler (e.g. MS-Visual Studio) is one of the applications which benefits most from the hyperthreading of i7 CPUs (pure scientific calculations without much IO usually don't benefit). But what's more important for that is a decent SSD, otherwise the CPU will always be waiting for the HD and the money for the i7 would be wasted.

Yeah, will definitely get an SSD, they look amazing! If the price drops enough, even considering 500GB SSD and not bothering with a hard drive at all. In all honesty, I don't download all that much on to my computer and have never even come close to using 500GB before. What do people download that takes up that much space?

If you have large projects, then a multithreaded C++ compiler (e.g. MS-Visual Studio) is one of the applications which benefits most from the hyperthreading of i7 CPUs (pure scientific calculations without much IO usually don't benefit). But what's more important for that is a decent SSD, otherwise the CPU will always be waiting for the HD and the money for the i7 would be wasted.

Thanks. My guess is that I won't be using a multithreaded C++ compiler in the next few years but that is only a guess. I'll keep this in mind when deciding what to get.

[Biggus Splenus]

Will get back to everyone else soon, first thing; "thescotsviking" PMed me about building a PC for around £500, and this is what I sent him:

CASE: Corsair Carbide Series 200R £51
CPU: AMD Phantom II 965 £84
Mobo: ASRock 970 Extreme3 £65
RAM: Corsair 2x2GB (4GB) £25
GPU: Nvidia 650 Ti £125
PSU: Seasonic SI2II 520W £66
HDD: Seagate Barracuda 1TB £61
CPU Cooler: Cooler Master 212 Evo £28

Total: £505

It's a well balanced system, and I'm sure you will be able to play R2 on in. Some worth while upgrades would be (if you can spend the money)

CPU: AMD FX-6300 £106
GPU: AMD 7850 £152 or AMD 7870 £184 (7870 is much better than the 7850, definitely worth joining with the FX-6300)
RAM: Crucial Ballistix 2x4GB (8GB) £36

Perhaps only consider getting the upgraded GPU (graphics card) I listed here if you are going to get the upgraded CPU. The upgraded RAM would complement you system well to for only an extra few pounds, but will not be needed if you are not going for the upgraded parts here. If you want to go with all these upgraded parts, it's another £100, but it is DEFINITELY worth the investment. Maybe consider saving up a little more cash for this.

Would you other enthusiast out there think this is a smart build for the budget?

No, the most common definition of tutorial is; to provide a step by step instruction.

Well I know what a tutorial is, but I don't see what you're trying to do here. Does it really matter if I call it a tutorial or guide?

@ Numidia Merc - the 3570k will still perform very well while compiling code, but the i7 is a fare step further ahead. i7 is definitely a luxury piece; you don't need it for compiling or rendering, it just shaves off some time of the process.

[Chris Death]

Well I know what a tutorial is, but I don't see what you're trying to do here. Does it really matter if I call it a tutorial or guide?

May i quote my own post (the one at which you asked this question) here?

And no matter how we gonna call that thing now it is still of a high risk due to the fact that real people may spend real money provided
by speculation based on prior experience with similar stuff.

~S~CD

[A Barbarian]

If Rome 2 is as poorly multi-core optimized as Shogun 2 AMD CPUs will be relatively slow:

Note that even the i3-2130 outperforms the Phenom II X4 980.
And the FX processor don't have any numbers because due the compatibility problems mentioned before those CPUs didn't work with S2 at the time of that review at all.
But usually the single core performance of the FX processors is similar to a Phenom X6 1100T.



http://www.hardware.fr/articles/846-...anno-1404.html



Another CPU test:

[Numidian Mercenary]

If I had to get storage now though I was thinking 250GB Samsung SSD and a 1TB harddrive from somewhere. Should make £175 in total, which is a lot less than £260 for a 500GB SSD.

Yeah, even with possible future price drops, would that still be the best option? Or are SSD only useful for program files such that a 128GB one could do the trick? That would make £125 in total. So many choices!

[Biggus Splenus]

SSDs are just as useful as HDD, but better in every way. They are definitely the future of storage and in a decade, we won't see any HDDs.

@ barbarian - the i3 is only superior to the FX-6300 when using a single thread. Multi threaded programs run better on the 6300 though, which Rome 2 and Shogun 2 do (2 cores count as multi core I suppose)