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Thread: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

  1. #1221

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    The preview sound amazing, thank you so much for all the time and effort you are putting into the mod, it's already a masterpiece and will become better and better! Very excited for the release!

  2. #1222

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    additional change coming with 5.0:

    Infantry Cohesion System Improvements:
    - Walking and Running wont have negative impact on unit cohesion (units are considered to move the speed they can keep formation intact automatically), yet unit speed is reduced to compensate. Walking represents normal move (100steps per minute), while running represents quick march (120 steps per minute).
    - instead, walking will reduce disorder (-6), while running wont (0). Idle unit will have -12. Which means moving slowly will give you option to restore order in your unit after prolonged musketry exchange or melee.
    - being under fire from small arms will counterbalance this and reduce final effect by 50% (3), while being hit by artillery will counterbalance even idle bonus (12)
    - overall, cohesion drop only impacts musket accuracy, charge and melee power. units are not penalized in speed due to cohesion drop, on contrary, disordered units move faster (25% speed increase) which means routed units after melee will run away faster, than you can chase them.
    - morale penalties for low cohesion are slightly increased, therefore leaving unit in prolonged shootout makes the unit vulnerable to morale shock from enemy charge.

    Main reason behind these changes is to improve AI behavior (AI tends to run with units) while giving attacker slight advantage over defender (as defender already has lots of benefits resulting from its deployment, and bonuses for protected flanks, being inspired by general, etc)
    Last edited by JaM; January 10, 2018 at 09:59 AM.

  3. #1223

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Hi !
    I'm currently enjoying your mod on both Empire & Napoleon but I think there is an issue with Economy. I'm playing as France in Campaign and I begin with a -1973 deficit, and I'm unable to gain enough money because trade ports only give one trade road. That's historically accurate for sure but that's quite embarrassing as I'm stuck in bankruptcy or I have to disband half of my army, which is impossible regarding the threat I'm dealing with I didn't try yet with other factions in Campaign but I assume it's the same ? Is there any way to fix it in 5.0 ?
    Thanks !

  4. #1224

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    new version has this tweaked a bit, anyway you can solve this simply by assigning good Minister of Finance, and Governor of America, while you can quickly reduce upkeep by disbanding artillery units which are not that effective anyway. Check the thread about bankruptcy below for more tips

  5. #1225

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    anyway, because with NER everybody likes full square instead of hollow square, i decided to add this also to ER. Yet because the way how technology unlocks, i had to remove square formation from technology research, and replace it with "Army Corps" research, which will give player mobility bonus and will reduce unit costs a bit. Full Square will be available to all Line Infantry units from the start. (only way how to do it, and not remove it from actual pikemen)

  6. #1226

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Ok thanks !
    Yeah full squares are a very good implementation in NER

  7. #1227

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    working hard on ER 5.0, anyway would like to ask you guys on your opinion with one thing - Generals are always misused by AI, because they are cavalry class, and AI will always find a way how to rush them forward alone.. So, i'm kinda thinking about converting all generals to Infantry units.. Let say, Grenadier or Elite Infantry battalion. This way, AI will never charge the general at the start of battle, but instead, will move together with the rest of its infantry. Of course, It will still use it in combat, but at the other side, such unit will be not weak, but will actually be very effective.. practically, instead of 19 combat units + general, we would end up having 20 combat units in stack, with AI never throwing up general in a suicide charge..

    I can counterbalance quick availability of General unit by setting price high (after all, Elite infantry battalion is not cheap, plus it contains general now)

  8. #1228

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Even the commanding element (colonel, drummer, piper, flagbearer) in the middle of a line infantry battalion can be shot out by artillery fire or musket salvos. There may be some use for a guard battalion leading a smaller stack, if only because of its attributes (inspires nearby units). But this sort of leading element is not able to reposition itself fast enough, can be enveloped and concentrated on much faster.
    And in most cases the AI keeps its General out of the fight. At least in ER 4.92 I haven't experienced charges from Generals. When being near to enemy units they mostly rout before being killed off by musket fire... You may reduce its hitbox size even further to make it harder to kill (but I think it is not necessary).
    How about giving the General unit the ability to dismount, like Dragoons? AI dismounts them sometimes (I do not know why it is doing it...).
    The presence of your artillery dictates a lot of the AI's behaviour (Limber them all up, and the AI stops attacking). Maybe recheck their behaviour in relation to actual artillery inferiority in battle? When there is artillery equality or their side has artillery superiority their cavalry normally evades artillery strikes from me (unless you pinpoint their artillery).
    The commanding units (first in stack order) of reinforcing armies do often attack headlong after marching into the battlefield.

  9. #1229

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Problem with generals is most obvious when they reinforce. At that time, game treats them as cavalry, and they always charge. Whole idea came from my recent experience from latest campaign, where i fought multiple large battles with 3-4 stacks reinforcing (7000 vs 8000 battle).. problem was, Generals from each stack got deployed at the start, and AI committed suicide with them by charging forward.

    With General present in the unit, he is usually in the center. Artillery in ETW has strange targeting aiming for the flanks, so General is kinda safe in the middle.. plus, from my experience, its a lot harder to identify which unit is actually commanding unit, from distance they all look same, while AI will treat that unit same way as before and keep it out of harm. Of course player can benefit from Elite battalion and use it actively, but this unit is not cheap (3200 recruit cost, 300 upkeep - costliest infantry unit in the game) and if general gets killed, unit is disbanded and you need to pay full price for a new one...

    Btw, General was already able to dismount, thing is, AI never does it.. I'm not doing this to give player "uber unit", but to make sure AI uses it semi-normally, which is impossible if General bodyguards are mounted.. I was considering making General unit smaller, company size, but then player would instantly see which unit is general, because other units are full size... This way, General unit will be less likely to identified (i will also rename General Bodyguards to something less telling) From Historical perspective, it was quite common for Life Guard to accompany the General, of course, General would not march with them, but its not that far fetched to have General assigned to such unit i think.


    ER 4.92 and further all have artillery with hidden fire attribute. This makes AI unaware of artillery status up to the point you start firing - if you keep artillery out of sight (not within enemy detection range), they wont know if its limbered or not..
    Last edited by JaM; January 23, 2018 at 03:45 PM.

  10. #1230

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    btw, besides this, im working on some adjustments to how governments work, both Republic and Constitutional Monarchy will now get some build in bonuses to compensate the fact you cannot pick ministers from the pool. This way, Republic will get extra tax bonus even if Minister of Finance is not as good as it would have to be for Absolutist Monarchy to get the same percentage bonus. For the same reason, Policing cost will get reduced, as well as unit/ship upkeep or diplomacy bonus.

  11. #1231

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    ER 5.0 will also bring long time promised Eastern faction overhaul - brace yourselves for Eastern combat overhaul, with many units reworked, adjusted technology tree, bonuses, and some new cool but historical units like for example Camel Zamburak Gunners (light 1pdr gun mounted on a camel)

    Camel Gunners will be now very small unit of 12 men, each carrying small 1lber swivel gun mounted on the camel (im using grenade launcher animation and equipment, so they still fire it old fashioned way though). 1lber gun has relatively short range 120m (3:1 scale applies as for all projectiles which means it represents 360m) and limited accuracy. Yet, these projectiles will have much higher penetration than ordinary muskets, being capable killing everything in their path, same way as normal artillery.. Plus, this unit will fire 12 projectiles each salvo, making it quite effective especially against massed enemy attacks.. And of course, because this gun is operated by single men, it will take longer to reload (about 2x more than matchlock musket, about same as standard light artillery unit where whole crew is loading the gun). Camel Gunners will carry only limited number of ammo (8 rounds per men)
    Last edited by JaM; January 26, 2018 at 12:46 PM.

  12. #1232

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    At the same time, i did some adjustments to startpos scripts:

    - first, Morocco will be renamed to Barbary States in ER 5.0. They will get all north Africa via scripting event in first turn. This should make them survive a bit more, plus, gives them option to not be at war with everybody at the same time..
    - but most importantly, If player is not playing as Britain, Britain will get Maratha lands at the end of first turn. This way, AI Britain will have rich lands in India, and plenty of space to bother Mughal Empire. But, If player is playing as Britain, those provinces are given to France at the end of first turn, which means France will get rich eventually and Player will have to dislodge them from India... All in all, instead of two Indian factions fighting each other, it will be colonial war.. Of course, if you play as Maratha, nothing happens, and you can play as them..


    (only negative part about this deal is that initial briefing for British and French will not initiate as it should, anyway if you just close it, map will get back to your proper position - i think its a small price to pay, and dont doubt most people skip that briefing anyway )
    Last edited by JaM; January 26, 2018 at 03:08 PM.

  13. #1233

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    i have run into a wall with the Indian script. seems like whenever i use one condition, it causes campaign map to get stuck and unable to move anymore... so if I wont figure out a different way how to do it, i would have to remove it.

  14. #1234
    Skillreaver's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Can't wait for the 5.0 Few years ago I played this mod but unfortunately it was a short adventure.Now I'm so thirsty for realism experience in empire that I plan to play at least few campaigns with this great mod What can you tell me in general about the differences between european powers? Do they differ much? I'm going to play my first campaign as Poland.And my second question is about the compatible units retexture - is there anything that fits the units in this mod or there are only vanilla models available?

  15. #1235

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Technically, i'm trying to model them the way they were in real history, even though its not always possible as AI has its own ways.. Can tell you that Poland will be quite interesting to play, being surrounded by "wolves".. and regarding retextures, anything that adjusts the vanilla units should work fine

  16. #1236
    Skillreaver's Avatar Civis
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    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by JaM View Post
    Technically, i'm trying to model them the way they were in real history, even though its not always possible as AI has its own ways.. Can tell you that Poland will be quite interesting to play, being surrounded by "wolves".. and regarding retextures, anything that adjusts the vanilla units should work fine
    Ok thanks Yep I know that Poland won't be easy to play especially in this mod because of not so good situation in the beginning of the campaign But I'm ready to hunt this wolves down...one by one .Are there any scripted events like Great Nothern War for example because in most of my campaigns in vanilla or in other mods Sweden barely attacks or invades Poland.They often capture Moscow and then lose it on the other hand The same with russian AI that usually doesn't take the initiative at all.

  17. #1237

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    'Hi! Im finding some strange things while playing your last mod. At first I thought the mod was like that, but now I'm thinking that maybe I installed it badly, so I may ask to know what is wrong. Hope you can help me to resolve it.

    Anyway, thank you so much for all your work. Battles are so nice in this version. Economy was too easy playing with Spain but maybe that's because one of the things I mention.

    My rakes can't kill. If I select one an try to left click on a missionary nothing happens. If I move my rake o a city where there is a general the option of killing him is missing. Is that ok?

    The american indians don't have cavalry. At 1760's I haven't seen any yet and they don't have the option of recruiting it.

    The towns grow up so fast. It surprised me. In the first turn of the British I think 6 new towns/ports emerges. With Spain in the 30's all the towns where developed and thats's a big economy push.

    Maybe the original game was like that. I haven't played for a lot of time. Excuse me for this one but I'm enjoying a lot the naval battles now with your changes, but I found that the sea conditions are allways the same. I mean, the wind and sky changes, there's maybe fog, but the sea is always at calm. It never rains too, now that I think about it. I have rainy land battles but no one at sea. I don't think you changed that, but...

    Anyway I miss a little the winter turn�� It changed the rutine.

    Well, thank you so much. Hope to see soon the new version.

  18. #1238

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Thanks. regarding rakes, yes, they got the assassination removed to stop AI killing everybody, but i already have better way how to solve it, so in next version they will get that skill back. Regarding Native cavalry, i'll have a look at it, thing is, Native American tribes were different, and norther American tribes did not have access to horses at all.. yet of course, Pueblo nations are different story, they got their horses thanks to Spanish who exported large number of horses to Mexico, where they often escaped into wilds creating the herds of mustangs. I'll make sure Pueblo nations will have their horses. Also, city spawn will be definitely slower in next version.

    oh and regarding winter, thing is, if I enable it, turn will be winter - winter - summer - summer, which is very weird, I'd rather not have winter at all than this..
    Last edited by JaM; January 29, 2018 at 01:31 PM.

  19. #1239
    Goutlard's Avatar Janissary
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    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    Quote Originally Posted by JaM View Post
    ER 5.0 will also bring long time promised Eastern faction overhaul - brace yourselves for Eastern combat overhaul, with many units reworked, adjusted technology tree, bonuses, and some new cool but historical units like for example Camel Zamburak Gunners (light 1pdr gun mounted on a camel)

    Camel Gunners will be now very small unit of 12 men, each carrying small 1lber swivel gun mounted on the camel (im using grenade launcher animation and equipment, so they still fire it old fashioned way though). 1lber gun has relatively short range 120m (3:1 scale applies as for all projectiles which means it represents 360m) and limited accuracy. Yet, these projectiles will have much higher penetration than ordinary muskets, being capable killing everything in their path, same way as normal artillery.. Plus, this unit will fire 12 projectiles each salvo, making it quite effective especially against massed enemy attacks.. And of course, because this gun is operated by single men, it will take longer to reload (about 2x more than matchlock musket, about same as standard light artillery unit where whole crew is loading the gun). Camel Gunners will carry only limited number of ammo (8 rounds per men)
    Good luck with that update , I was waiting for such an update to give ER another try, after enjoying the combat system so much the first time !
    Wind from the East's Awards :

  20. #1240

    Default Re: Empire Realism - Feedback and General Discussion

    thanks. its like my longest developed version... planned to release it before Christmas, yet each day i get new ideas, adding things i want to have in.. plus, doing a lot of playtesting, increasing my game time to 1600 hours in ETW

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