About to lose Americas campaign - suggestions?

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

As the Apachean tribes in a short Americas campaign on normal difficulty I had 19 regions and needed 20 to win.

The Tlaxcalans had 8 regions after eliminating the Tarascans. They also made the Aztecs their vassals and got another 6, total 14 regions. With 15 they would win the campaign. I only need one region to win ahead of the Tlaxcalans. I sent an emissary to the Chichimecs who are down to one settlement but I had no option to make them vassals. I have 153000 coins reserve. If Vera Cruz falls to the Tlaxcalans at the end of turn, I will lose the campaign.

What would you do?

[EΣXHATON]

Is buying any settlement from another faction an option? Can your emissary reach anyone else?

[totalwar_legend]

I'd attack the Tlaxacalans. Take their regions. Easy solution. If you've got that kind of money, put it into troops.

[Highlander of Scotland]

but he only has a single turn. How about warparth or buy off the talaxicans, also do they win the game? Or just go back to a previous save and move a diplomat to them and buy one off them.

[tudor93]

Will it really matter if the "You are victorious" message won't appear? Because, other than that, nothing else will happen if you "lose" the campaign (where "lose" = another faction will accomplish its goals before you); you will still be able to continue your campaign.

[Incredible Bulk]

Become a vassal people might leave you alone for a bit

[Kaiser Nonsense]

How do you actually lose a vanilla game?

[Incredible Bulk]

How do you actually lose a vanilla game?

By sucking very very bad at the game

[Kaiser Nonsense]

By sucking very very bad at the game

I agree, I even remember my first campaign as the English, I won, but in the last turn. I even became someone's vassal, I don't remember who, I was excommunicated, I was checking the save file some days ago, many cities without even a single unit, nothing being constructed in many cities, riots everywhere, a Crusade was even called on me, the Papal States had attacked me, settlements being garrisoned by town milita during the year of 1520, but still, I managed to destroy Scotland and France and win the short campaign. That was my first campaign, and I was very noob.

[Rero]

By sucking very very bad at the game

TWC is known as a friendly forum, consider being more positive.

[Kaiser Nonsense]

TWC is known as a friendly forum, consider being more positive.

Sir Geoffrey de Villehardouin is no new member, he knows we are friendly but we do piss about with each other. ;p

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

How do you actually lose a vanilla game?

I am on turn 48 and only a settlement away from winning. It's not a blitz campaign, though I have conquered half the map in a weekend. But I could have probably lost around game turn 30 when the Tlaxcalan-Aztec coalition was formed. It is enough for two computer factions to combine and if the non-vassal only needs 15 regions, which is not much, and they have that between them, you lose.

Warpath: Good suggestion, I've now called one. With the Tarascans gone, the only ones who could attack the Tlaxcalan-Aztec coalition are the Mayans who are completely cordonned off by the Spanish and have their hands full. They did not join the warpath. Funnily-enough the Tlaxcalan-Aztec coalition are my allies, so I have not joined the warpath myself but I only need units to take one last settlement and if I could take it before the Tlaxcalans can intervene, I may win. It seems like an option.

I'd attack the Tlaxacalans. Take their regions. Easy solution. If you've got that kind of money, put it into troops.

Even if you recruit all the units you can every turn and build all the buildings you can build, which is what I am doing, you still end up with a sizeable surplus. Because the best units from practically all those settlements are boy scouts that cost nothing and the buildings are just tents. In any case, last night I was only an end of turn away from defeat.

but he only has a single turn. How about warparth or buy off the talaxicans, also do they win the game? Or just go back to a previous save and move a diplomat to them and buy one off them.

Buy settlements: Indeed, the only way to really spend Apache money is to buy off your enemies' settlements but at a rate of 20,000-30,000 per settlement for those willing to sell. But the settlements practically immediately rebelled and the Tlaxcalan-Aztec coalition have armies all around them. So a couple more of these and I'll be bankrupt and my enemies stinking rich. Indians have no ships, no cavalry and no mercs, available armies are too far away to occupy the settlements I buy, and there's plague on the way there - no big deal, just annoying to be losing units of hard won experience to plague attrition, when they cannot be easily retrained unless I bring the plague back home. As for buying units, every settlement of mine can build one-two units per turn maximum and for some of them it's a very long treck to the Tlaxcalans - say by foot from Florida to Mexico city. It's one of the weirdest campaigns.

[Vampiresbane]

How do you actually lose a vanilla game?

I'd say out of all the options (main game and xpacs), the Americas campaign and the Tuetonic campaign can be some of the most difficult situations. The Indian factions can be incredibly hard to finance a good sized army with so little income (especially if you didn't use or have access to warpath) while both the Tuetons and Lithuanians have trouble with so many enemies surrounding them.

So it can be fairly easy to lose in those cases, especially if you're playing Vh/Vh.

[Dude with the Food]

Apache can be especially hard to win the campaign. Not because they have a challenge with enemies (it's easiest for them) but because you're so far removed. You finally beat the French when they emerge and are about to head south when somebody gets vassilized by somebody who immediately wins. You need to attck earlier.

[Kaiser Nonsense]

I'd say out of all the options (main game and xpacs), the Americas campaign and the Tuetonic campaign can be some of the most difficult situations. The Indian factions can be incredibly hard to finance a good sized army with so little income (especially if you didn't use or have access to warpath) while both the Tuetons and Lithuanians have trouble with so many enemies surrounding them.

So it can be fairly easy to lose in those cases, especially if you're playing Vh/Vh.

Aye, Teutonics are hard, that I believe, their economic is lame, and they can only construct castles.

[fredtrotter]

You can actually recruit cavalry and guns as the Apache. What you need to do is fight Spanish/English/French armies a couple of times and you can steal their tech.
If you were to buy one of their territories, wouldn't that delay the Tlaxcalan-Aztec coalition by a few turns, enough for you to conquer another territory so you win?

[Incredible Bulk]

That's strange your having a hard time on normal difficulty level, how many previous campaign experience you have?

[Geoffrey of Villehardouin]

That's strange your having a hard time on normal difficulty level, how many previous campaign experience you have?

Sure I asked for feedback and knew nothing about warpath. What would you do with more experience? Might be helpful to know. I was nowhere near the Tlaxcalans. My main two armies were near Florida at the time (around turn 30 or so) when the Aztecs made themselves vassals to the Tlaxcalans. If between them they had just one more settlement they would have won right there and then.

You can actually recruit cavalry and guns as the Apache. What you need to do is fight Spanish/English/French armies a couple of times and you can steal their tech.
If you were to buy one of their territories, wouldn't that delay the Tlaxcalan-Aztec coalition by a few turns, enough for you to conquer another territory so you win?

Only the Spanish were in the campaign at the moment and the nearest Spanish were out of reach in Vera Cruz. But thanks for the tip. Maybe next time. Yes, buying a couple of settlements seems the only practical option. It would bring my number of settlements over the victory condition. Other diplomacy ideas are welcome.