Stainless Steel Preview: Units overhaul

[UglySori]

regardless of RTW2, work will continue, because we have no idea how moddable Rome will be and since the combat engine is based on Shogun I'm not optimistic about the tactical aspects, which are my main interest.

Hey PB, I was curious if you could elaborate on the limitations of the Shogun combat engine as compared to MTW 2 engine as I recently got back into playing some STW 2 recently and was surprised on how few mods really survived for that game. Especially as mods like TROM 3 did not have anything a excellent as RC. I have never been a fan of how Darthmod tries to alter combat, one the other mods that is semi-active for STW2. Meanwhile SS keeps on trucking. Actually inspired to start a new campaign lol.

[paleologos]

Hey people, here's two more teasers from my Churburg style transitional armour skin, still WIP though.

Soon...

[Vissewalde rex de Gerzika]

Looks amazing!

[paleologos]

A few more Milkshape screenies...

[paleologos]

One of you guys was polite enough to rep me over my prevous post.
I thank him-or her- but it would be better if I knew who it was.
Thanks.

[Stiffler]

I was breezing through here and really like what I see. I was wondering if there was a best guess release date?

[paleologos]

I was breezing through here and really like what I see. I was wondering if there was a best guess release date?

My skins are made available as I finish them.
For this last one I am guessing some time next week.
Most of the 2D art and the UV mapping for lod0 are finished but I am trying to make the texture of a bascinet helmet visor that does not exist in vanila and it's a real b***h.
This one.


Well it won't be exactly identical but you get the general fashion.

[tudor93]

Nice, paleologos! Have some rep from me too.

[paleologos]

Nice, paleologos! Have some rep from me too.

Thanks tudor93, I appreciate.

By the way, the visors I was talking about are complete.
Here's a few milkshape screenies...



Three days for those...
Anyway I am proceeding with the UV mapping of the lower lods.

[Point Blank]

Thanks tudor93, I appreciate.

By the way, the visors I was talking about are complete.
Here's a few milkshape screenies...



Three days for those...
Anyway I am proceeding with the UV mapping of the lower lods.

Wow those are gorgeous! +rep

[Vissewalde rex de Gerzika]

Thanks tudor93, I appreciate.

By the way, the visors I was talking about are complete.
Here's a few milkshape screenies...

*snip*

Three days for those...
Anyway I am proceeding with the UV mapping of the lower lods.

How long does it take to fully make one skin?

[paleologos]

Thanks for the rep Point Blank, always grateful for my fans.

How long does it take to fully make one skin?

That one is almost impossible to answer.
If you go back to page 6 of this thread you will find that the first pictures I posted were on February 27.
You will also notice -along with some quite enthusiastic comments- how much better the lattest skin looks.
Keep in mind I am an amateur, I don't want to spend the time to learn photoshop, I find GIMP much more intuitive.
The more I work in GIMP the more I discover ways to do new things.
Ergo, what was satisfactory to me as my very best at the time it was made, may just as well begin to look mundane right after my latest breakthrough of skill.
Also remember that the best way to make photorealistic textures is to use actual photographs of the real thing.
These photos have to be found before you take on to GIMP, research takes time and some things are just much more abundant in the web.
EG, there are more photos of bascinet helmets than squamata armour in the web.
And not all these photos -however informative- are suitable for cropping and "resourcification" - if I may be allowed to use such an word.
So it all comes down to what satisfies the client and since I am not getting payed, I am the client.

PS:
Churburg style transitional armour begun to be used at about the same time that "heater" style shields begun to outfashion the teardrop style -somebody correct me if I am wrong.
Armour had begun to be effective enough against cutting blows so as to render traditional swords obsolete.
The time of the warhammer had arrived.
If I am to depict the full extend of warfare evolution in my skin-model I believe I should implement the above.
I am, however, going to make the first release with sword-mace and "teardrops" as usual.

[Akmatov]

Awesome.

Would be a pity if CA is dumb enough to close moddability. But their problem as we are blessed with such a vibrant group of modders for their older games - which are transformed into something quite extraordinary by the community of modders.

[poisoned goat]

Awesome work paleologos. Keep 'em coming!

A rather off-topic question, but do all units get new models when their armor is upgraded? If not, are you (or any other designer) intending on making more of these models? For example, I didn't notice any difference when I compared the armor levels of the Italian Foot MAAs.

[paleologos]

Someone just repped me, thanks, but I have no certain way of knowing who it was just by looking at my notifications.
I suspect it was poisoned goat but would like to be sure.
Please, leave a name when you rep me,
thanks.

Now,

Awesome work paleologos. Keep 'em coming!

A rather off-topic question, but do all units get new models when their armor is upgraded? If not, are you (or any other designer) intending on making more of these models? For example, I didn't notice any difference when I compared the armor levels of the Italian Foot MAAs.

Thanks for the boost!

A unit is the edu name entry.
It may have more than one models (that is mesh sets) for all it's upgrade levels but it is not always so.
Different models require different skins.
One skin file may include upgrades for the same model.
Think the vanila skins for partial plate and full plate.
Partial plate and full plate are different models but have enough similarities, that is the torsos, to allow the skinner to squeeze their skins in the same 1024x1024 pixel file.
That is to say one 1024x1024 pixel file with vanila pplate_fplate skins contains skins for 6 torsos, 4 sets of pplate arms and legs and another 4 sets of fplate arms and legs.
This leaves little room for helmets.
That is why helmets for vanila pplate models are located in the attachements file (the one for the shields and weapons skins), making the correct compilation of the battle_models file a tricky business.
Ergo the epedemic of related CTDs.
Personally I prefer to dedicate the entire 1024x1024 file to a single model for the sake of higher in-game resolution per figure.
Another thing to notice is that the battle system of SS takes into account metallurgical improvements such as better quality steel and greater armour thickness, so a unit can use the same pair of model-skin for more than one armour upgrades. You noticed the Italian Foot MAAs.

[poisoned goat]

Yeah I was the guy that repped you for all the fantastic work you've been doing so far!

If I am understanding this right, if there is 1 torso and 2 sets of legs, one unit can be assigned torso #1 and legs #1, while another unit can be assigned torso #1 and legs #2? In other words, parts of the model can be shared between multiple units?

I'm starting to understand why modding textures is so hideously complicated and also why there are so many battle-related CTDs.

As for the Italian Foot MAAs, their armor upgrade levels are (IIRC) full plate, improved metallurgy and gothic plate. I get the feeling that this unit doesn't get a shiny new model for the first and third upgrades =( ... or I'm blind.

[paleologos]

Yeah I was the guy that repped you for all the fantastic work you've been doing so far!

If I am understanding this right, if there is 1 torso and 2 sets of legs, one unit can be assigned torso #1 and legs #1, while another unit can be assigned torso #1 and legs #2? In other words, parts of the model can be shared between multiple units?

I'm starting to understand why modding textures is so hideously complicated and also why there are so many battle-related CTDs.

As for the Italian Foot MAAs, their armor upgrade levels are (IIRC) full plate, improved metallurgy and gothic plate. I get the feeling that this unit doesn't get a shiny new model for the first and third upgrades =( ... or I'm blind.

Thanks again!

Now, this is from EDU:

armour_ug_levels 16, 21, 23, 24
armour_ug_models Dismounted_Italian_MAA, Dismounted_Italian_MAA_ug1, Dismounted_Italian_MAA_ug1, Dismounted_Italian_MAA_ug2

This means:
A: For armour level 16 they get one model, which in the battle_models file is registered as Dismounted_Italian_MAA and according to the battle_models file it is the dismounted_armats mesh file.
B: For armour upgrades 21 and 23 both, they get Dismounted_Italian_MAA_ug1, which according to the battle_models file it is the dismounted_armats_ug1 mesh file.
C: For armour upgrade 24 they get Dismounted_Italian_MAA_ug2, which according to the battle_models file it is the dismounted_italian_maa_ug2 mesh file.
A is partial plate
B is full plate
C is late renaisance/gothic.

I hope this makes it clear.
It really is not more complicated than it has to be.
Somewhat like Lego. A variety of building blocks that sometimes can be recombined to make new models.
It has been called the frankenstein method.

[poisoned goat]

Yeah I can understand it better now. Anyway, I created a custom game to test out how these units look, and saw that the dismounted Italian MAAs indeed have 3 different models, with elaborate tunics too. Somehow, I don't recall seeing all those tunics on the MAAs when playing the campaign as Genoa....


.....

Ignore me. I'm probably being delusional here.

[paleologos]

After a bumpmap & glint related roadblock I was able to make them look the way I wanted.
The in-game screenshots are to keep you warm...
This is the cavalry...

And this is the infantry

Make patience, they are coming.

[Vissewalde rex de Gerzika]

They look great, but the helmet on the 3rd screen looks really awkward.