Best Missile Faction?

[Maklodes]

In the context of a campaign, where you can't have a unit until you've upgraded the buildings enough to produce it, maintenance cost of units, matters, etc, I'd say Milan. Their Genoese crossbow militias are easily mass-produced from minor cities and can be maintained for as much as peasant archers -- and that's when they're not stationed in cities.

In the context of a custom battle, where units are simply bought on a given budget, I'd say Russia.

[lolIsuck]

The eastern factions have the most variety, I'm guessing the Turks have most with several horse archers, pretty decent archers, javelinmen (they're in vanilla right?) and if you count Naffatun as missiles than that one too. In late game they get Janissary units.
Best western faction is of course England with their longbowmen.

[lolIsuck]

Yea, Russia is a great faction, they have awesome-looking units too.

[Aymer de Valence]

It depends. Infantry missile units I would choose England, but for overall missile power I would undoubtedly choose the Mongols. The hail of arrows their horse archers create is just insane; not to mention how annoying they are to catch!


Seeing as though you said variety, I'd still choose the Mongols or Russia etc. Foot archers and horse archers; something that England lacks. I believe Russia also gets crossbowmen (peasant crossbowmen?) so they are always nice too.

[FountainGuard]

England is the obvious choice for foot archers, with Milan not too far behind, but as for variety, Russia and the Turks have great foot archers and horse archers, with the foot archers being just a bit worse than England. Mongols have great horse archers, big surprise, but I didn't find their foot archers to be worthy of great praise or anything. There is my input.

[CrazyShadowDami]

England is the obvious choice for foot archers, with Milan not too far behind, but as for variety, Russia and the Turks have great foot archers and horse archers, with the foot archers being just a bit worse than England. Mongols have great horse archers, big surprise, but I didn't find their foot archers to be worthy of great praise or anything. There is my input.

Longbowmen got better bows, but dismounted dvors have an advatage of having an axe, a shield, and heavy armor. wouldnt be suprised to see it take on dismounted fedual knights in meele, and we shouldnt even mention the fact that they can put a volley or two of arrows in them before charging. Same goes with dvor cavalry, their shields and heavy armor make them completely invurneralbe to light cavalry, the only unit in the game that can kill horse archers. which means that they can only be killed by other missile units. But of course, we are talking about missile combat, not meele, but they still have dat big armor.

I dont know if Russia has the best missile troops, but they are certainly by far the most underrated faction in the game.

[FountainGuard]

Longbowmen got better bows, but dismounted dvors have an advatage of having an axe, a shield, and heavy armor. wouldnt be suprised to see it take on dismounted fedual knights in meele, and we shouldnt even mention the fact that they can put a volley or two of arrows in them before charging. Same goes with dvor cavalry, their shields and heavy armor make them completely invurneralbe to light cavalry, the only unit in the game that can kill horse archers. which means that they can only be killed by other missile units. But of course, we are talking about missile combat, not meele, but they still have dat big armor.

I dont know if Russia has the best missile troops, but they are certainly by far the most underrated faction in the game.

I agree, they are the most underrated.

[Aeratus]

Turks have the most variety, but Russians have the best foot archer, and Moors have the best missile cavalry (camel gunners).

[CrazyShadowDami]

Turks have the most variety, but Russians have the best foot archer, and Moors have the best missile cavalry (camel gunners).

man, you just made me renember my biggest fear... something that gave me weeks of trauma, nigtmares, headaches, and phobias. something so annoying.... that god himself cant find a proper word to explain.

now excuse me, i must go and cry in a corner.

@fountainguard now imagine if SEGA lisened our debate about composite bows.... they would be very powerfull... maybe still slightly less damage than longbowmen, but their axes, armor and shields and general meele capablity make up for it (they even have skirmish mode disabled by default)

[FountainGuard]

man, you just made me renember my biggest fear... something that gave me weeks of trauma, nigtmares, headaches, and phobias. something so annoying.... that god himself cant find a proper word to explain.

now excuse me, i must go and cry in a corner.

@fountainguard now imagine if SEGA lisened our debate about composite bows.... they would be very powerfull... maybe still slightly less damage than longbowmen, but their axes, armor and shields and general meele capablity make up for it (they even have skirmish mode disabled by default)

Maybe make longbow with AP and composite without, but higher missile damage? This probably belongs in the other thread.

[CrazyShadowDami]

[/B]
Maybe make longbow with AP and composite without, but higher missile damage? This probably belongs in the other thread.

i was just mentioning it

[FountainGuard]

i was just mentioning it

Yeah.

[Maklodes]

[/B]
Maybe make longbow with AP and composite without, but higher missile damage? This probably belongs in the other thread.

I don't mean to aid further digression from the point of this thread, but FYI, that's already mostly the case. Longbowmen (English, Welsh mercenary, and Free Company mercenary) have 6 missile damage, lower than basic desert archers and Turkish archers at 7. Yeoman and retinue longbowmen come in at 8 missile damage, still lower than Byzantine Trebizond archers, Ottoman infantry, Sicilian Muslim archers, or Venetian archers at 9. Scots Guard match them at 9, but still don't match Janissary archers (10) or dismounted dvor (11).

[FountainGuard]

I don't mean to aid further digression from the point of this thread, but FYI, that's already mostly the case. Longbowmen (English, Welsh mercenary, and Free Company mercenary) have 6 missile damage, lower than basic desert archers and Turkish archers at 7. Yeoman and retinue longbowmen come in at 8 missile damage, still lower than Byzantine Trebizond archers, Ottoman infantry, Sicilian Muslim archers, or Venetian archers at 9. Scots Guard match them at 9, but still don't match Janissary archers (10) or dismounted dvor (11).

Yeah, I realize that now.

[Sitalkes]

Yeah the Jannisary archers are fantastic but the Longbowmen are armour-piercing so they do a lot more damage to armoured troops

[CrazyShadowDami]

If I were to choose between longbow dudes and the Janissaries, I'd choose the Janissaries, because they are Highly trained (which means they won't get tired fast) and have 11 morale, they can hold themselves well in melee.

highly trained means how well do they mantain their formations. a unit that is "untrained" looks like a bunch of peasants, more like a group of barbarians than a military unit, while a "highly_trained" unit look like some elite badass mo-fos.


"hardy" and "very hardy" is what defines stamina

[FountainGuard]

Thanks for clarifying, I didn't knew that. Okay, what about the disciplined trait? I thought that was for maintaining their formations. And where could I see those attributes In-game? I only look on m2tw.warlore.org for those.

Pretty sure disciplined is their likeliness to route.

[CrazyShadowDami]

Thanks for clarifying, I didn't knew that. Okay, what about the disciplined trait? I thought that was for maintaining their formations. And where could I see those attributes In-game? I only look on m2tw.warlore.org for those.

discipline is for morale shocks. aka.., general dying, loosing lots of troops, fire arrows, etc... there is also "impatient", which makes them randomly attacking enemies, without your command. too look for unit attributes
the best way is to follow this modding tutorial:

http://medieval2.heavengames.com/m2t...ls/index.shtml

even if you dont want modding, this will help you look at stats of units, and this tutorial explains every single letter than there are in the files. but, of course, you can change the stats if you want. have you ever dreamed of your jannies to have range over the entire battlefield, killing every enemy with one shoot, being completely unroutable and immortal? here you go...

and yes, the files can be open while you play the game, alt+tab and there you go. also, some, but not all stats will appear if you simply right-click on the unit

[PrestigeX]

I think since you've asked about the best 'missile faction' (and not, who has the best missile unit or two...)
I would say,
France
Hungary
Moors
Spain / Portugal.

france - 2 generic crossbows , 1 elite heavy armor steel xbow (aventurier- capable of good melee), 1 elite heavy bow (scot guard capable of melee), dismounted french archers - Mounted French Archers (who are about as good as sipahi, high quality Horse archers), gun powder troops

hungary - cheap H.a., and elite H.a , bosnian archers, PAvise Xbow Militia, guns with serpentine too
the only solid H.A. / Cavalry faction equal as eastern or western array of cav PLUS they have pavise xbow miltias , no one else has that really....

Moors -- Jezails, desert archers, jav-infantry, 2 kinds of Jav-Cav , Cav-Xbows, special 'moorish peasant xbow' that has the steel crossbow and is cheap (like cheap mercenary crossbowmen, highly excellent)

Portgual / Spain -- good guns , Pavise Xbows , Jinettes, javelines, mounted xbows -- esp cuz of their jinettes and the gunpowder troops.

[CrazyShadowDami]

and where are russian dvors with heavy armor, kite shield and axes >