[Citizen] LolIsuck (Patron: General Brewster)

[Aikanár]

@Diamat:
I thought nothing else

Concerning the ES articles I think it's worth heading

I'm just gonna comment here, ES articles (not to downplay the ES or it's writers) are hardly articles. They barely consist of a paragraph more often than not, and I think you're far better off judging on time spent than amount of articles. You can do 9 articles in 1-2 editions.

since obviously the amount of characters are not breathtaking.

Can somebody familiar with ES writer's SOPs can shed a little light on how much effort it is to craft such a thing, that is, if that is possible without being liable to an SND.

I imagine that one has to find the mod first, then you should get familiar with it, if it's released play it, dig through release, preview and comment threads in order to build yourself an opinion about the mod, right?

[Aikanár]

Hm, I know this statement of his but the fact that he has decided to submit his application should indicate that he himself thinks that he's ready now. Of course it could be like a shot in the blue like oh lets try it out and nvm if it doesn't work out this time. But without a confirmation of the applicant I'd like to give him the benefit of the doubt that he has changed his mind and thinks himself ready.

That being said, that does not imply that he may be

[Aikanár]

Alright, he obviously posts a lot, sometimes a bit spammy but I think he does not push the limit too much, hence I can live with that. He's obviously not a prolific modder. His contributions on that field are not released yet, still he is involved in it which I find commendable. Judging from his last 500 posts (which he has posted in one and a half months lol) he's a 100% community man. Yes, I've not yet found him participating in D&D debates or writing stunning long articles, but he is active in content and does contribute, even if the articles are not 10k characters in length.

His strong side definitely is his involvement in the community in the TD and Rome II fora and the Q&A, mind you that's only judging from his last 500 post. What I recognised is that he's next to always a real nice fellow and that he cares about others and that he has fun in doing so.

Some examples of the kind of posts that he's offering to the site here, here, here and here, as well as this, this, this and that, furthermore there, there and here. Then there's this, that, that and this and that and this one.

The quota might not be outstanding but I'm looking forward to the other 8.000 posts.

I think this is not a classic applicant, but he surely contributes to TWC. The question is, whether or not it will suffice in the end.

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

I wish to comment on the Eagle Standard contributions. As Shanky hinted, although 9 articles sounds a lot, we should put it into perspective. This is the average length of one article:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

War of the West might be one of the most promising mods for Medieval II Total War.
Their goal is to create historically correct unit rosters and they’re succeeding in it
as Lord Hamilton keeps pumping out these stunning units.
After previews of England and the Lordship of the Isles the team now brings us:

No more savage men in blue kilts running around with huge axes looking for a barber.
Instead, we get a historically correct, more Norman influenced unit roster with fancy French names.
These units are one by one all masterpieces, some of the most realistic units I have ever seen. The variation within the units is high and the details are just stunning so you don’t get the feeling you are commanding a clone army. Besides this lovely unit roster the Scotland preview also includes two unique characters in the persons of William Wallace and Robert the Bruce.

No more Mel Gibson in a ragged kilt screaming freedom, this Wallace has decided to ride to battle in an expensive armour and with a proper retinue. He is still eager to kill some Englishmen, it’s your task to not make him end up on the scaffold again.

If you thought the preview was good news than you’ll probably be rejoiced to hear that War of the West has released a custom battle demo, see the article about it in this very same edition of the Eagle Standard.

To see the Scotland preview follow this link.

This is not to demean the effort he put into this. On the contrary, I think it's great work. It shows that he is capable and consistent. However, it should not be confused with 9 Helios articles, which are much longer and require much more work. Still, great work.

I'd consider that a longer article for the ES, considering the length of a standard mod coverage.

@Diamat:
I thought nothing else

Concerning the ES articles I think it's worth heading since obviously the amount of characters are not breathtaking.

Can somebody familiar with ES writer's SOPs can shed a little light on how much effort it is to craft such a thing, that is, if that is possible without being liable to an SND.

I imagine that one has to find the mod first, then you should get familiar with it, if it's released play it, dig through release, preview and comment threads in order to build yourself an opinion about the mod, right?

I've asked the ES editor if I can post something about this, just to be on the safe side.

And thanks for those links.

[M D]

Ok weighing in with a very much out of date ES experience,

I think ES Contributions are hiding how much work actually goes into them, the research alone takes up a lot of time, arranging interviews/chats with the developers, then usually finding a way to think negatively to weigh a mod in a balanced way and then finally condensing these many hours of work into a small article. Just my view, but I remember how hard it was to do interviews because you did your research, found a mod, cleared with the section editor, then played a bit, wrote some good questions, question the developer and then edit it into the finished article

[Aikanár]

A cheers Shank and yes that's the right way to go, it should not result in an SND!

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

A cheers Shank and yes that's the right way to go, it should not result in an SND!

Okay, after speaking to the Editor, I am not allowed to share the information about the pre-release input into ES articles.

[Legio]

Okay, after speaking to the Editor, I am not allowed to share the information about the pre-release input into ES articles.

Indeed: Staff Non-Disclosure. The Editor, by not giving his consent to the publication of Content matters (how it is run, etc.), has upheld this.

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

@MD But I don't see any questioning of the developer in his articles?

@Aik No worries.

[M D]

Yes but behind the scenes I am sure there was

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

I'll get round to asking the mod developers of some of the articles he covered to see.

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

I'll get round to asking the mod developers of some of the articles he covered to see.

Again due to SND I cannot post these, apologies for the inconvenience.

Back onto the application I think we've established that he is a friendlily, supportive community member, however to quote "The applicant's attiude is very nice, but that is not a contribution, that is a prerequisite!", and this is something I bear in mind.

I'll continue looking through, but with a bronze quill, a few more ES issues under his belt, and another published piece of credited mod work I feel he'd of sailed through.

[Aikanár]

I really have a problem with this case. After having read all posts of the applicant dating back as far as July 2011, I recon that he has improved his posts meaning that the examples provided in my last post can seldom be found in earlier posts in 2011 and early 2012.

He has obviously done some modding and some research and beta testing, but just some and not really quantifyable or even measurable or judgebale since it's just not released. Hence I cannot count this. He's definitely not a debater. He is not a prolific writer either. His ES articles are ok but all in all that's not really that much.

On the other hand he clearly is a community man and is well received! He posts in good spirit and next to always shows a smile on his face.

Three months ago I would have voted no on lolIsuck, no doubt about that. Today I find myself contemplating whether or not to grant him a yes vote in spes.
But if I'd do so, I'd feel obligated to dish out the badge to every member like him. Maybe they deserve it, I'm not sure. I'm not sure either if that is what I think Citizenship should be a reward for.

To be even more clear, if I would vote yes on this, then it would definitely not be as a reward, since he has done too little for that. It would be a friendly pat on the shoulder.

I don't think I can do this in this case, since I at least need something that somewhat would justify my faith .. the ES articles are a starter, but they are just that.

[Lord William]

Did nobody pull up the moderator history? I would like to see if he is hiding any other issues.


what I understood from his application is that most of his projects are on hold (it is possible they never start up again), he is providing research for one mod which is nice but I would like to see the information he is producing and is it of quality. Mapping is unfinished though when completed would make a good addition to the application. Now we come to the ES articles, I love them and as a former ES writer I think he has produced some fine work though it has only been 2 issues. if he had just 1 or 2 more articles this would be an easy yes, but I am currently leaning towards no though I still have hope that his research my bring him to a yes

[Aikanár]

@moderation:
not until now. Looks like no moderation issues or moderation staff has forgotten about the QP since it was so silent here for so long.

[Robin de Bodemloze]

It shouldn't count in any case I feel. We don't count unreleased modding work so it's only fair to do the same for writers.

Still struggling with this one. Contribution-wise it's a no, but he does clearly play a positive part in the community.

[Shankbot de Bodemloze]

It shouldn't count in any case I feel. We don't count unreleased modding work so it's only fair to do the same for writers.

It was in question to the work he did prior to the release of the currently release articles, but I get where you are coming from.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

Yesterday, 09:53 AM / [Citizen] LolIsuck (Patron: General Brewster)

Hmmm... only one more day til the vote option is upon us, and overeager, ictchy fingered councilors, might just pull the trigger on votes before true vision and justice is had. Guess I better get my ghetto, shooting from the hip, Redneck, Trailer White Trash butt into gear. The argument here looks to be shaping up as...

Still struggling with this one. Contribution-wise it's a no, but he does clearly play a positive part in the community.

Master ABS jacked my meds again, Aik's sauntering around here with my favorite coffee mug{contaminating it with Earl Grey tea no less}, and Major thinks that I have'nt detected the electronic whoopy cushion, that lies astride my easy chair. Woe and olfactory aungiush will be his for I had corndogs and Texas Garlic chili smoothered in cream corn for lunch! *

Perhaps today's the day that we once again shall take up the soapbox pulpit. Maybe my redbull/slurpee shake will give me wings, then again maybe it will make me go grab my Hello Kitty Teddy-Baar, and embrace glorious slumber and dreams of CdeC heydays long since gone.

{And with a whole body shiver, shakes off the monmentary daydream, cuz the timer for the hotpockets just went off}.


* His desk is but a few paces from mine, would'nt ya know.

[Lord William]

It shouldn't count in any case I feel. We don't count unreleased modding work so it's only fair to do the same for writers.

Still struggling with this one. Contribution-wise it's a no, but he does clearly play a positive part in the community.

It's not really the same though, mod work that hasn't been posted hasn't been completed whereas writers have completed their work once they submit to the editor it has hasn't been published

[Robin de Bodemloze]

It's not really the same though, mod work that hasn't been posted hasn't been completed whereas writers have completed their work once they submit to the editor it has hasn't been published

An unpublished article benefits no-one.