What if a certain duel including the Mountain had ended differently?(spoilers of course)

[TheDude117]

I have really been enjoying these what if threads lately so I will pose this one: What if Oberyn Martell killed the Mountain during Tyrion's trial by battle. The first most immediate effect would be that Tyrion would not have to flee King's Landing immediately, thus most likely not killing his father (maybe Shae, but after the trial, I doubt he will be that forgiving.) Tyrion would most likely still not be welcome in King's Landing, so he might go back to Dorne with Oberyn Martell. They would likely try to Crown Myrcella queen, despite Doran's caution. This would probably split the Seven Kingdoms into another civil war. It would most likely drive another wedge between the Reach and Westerlands, of course with Tyrion being saved by the man who crippled Mace Tyrell's son. And so on and so on...

[jomas]

Aside from the fact that he did kill the mountain...
But to be honest, it would probably heavily favor the Lannisters, Tywin would manage to keep things together and prevent such happenings and possible stop the gold cloak invasion.
Wasn't Myrcella's rise due to Tywin being killed? I think Doran would not allow such hi-jinks with Tywin alive, knowing that he could not go on the offensive. I really think Tyrion tore apart any hope for the continuation of a Lannister/Baratheon kingdom however.

[deusvult6]

I really think Tyrion tore apart any hope for the continuation of a Lannister/Baratheon kingdom however.

Not entirely, but mostly. Varys, however, hammered in the last nail for that coffin. I'm sure Cersei will quickly oblige him.

[ButtSwag]

As much as I hate it, Oberyn's death was a good thing. Tywin died as a result, ruining the Lannisters and Cercei got what she deserved.

[Lordinquisitor]

Since i believe in the theory that Oberyn did poison Tywin things would have worked out quite similar, i think.

[Mount Suribachi]

Wasn't Oberyn meant to take a place on the Small Council?

Obviously Tywin isn't just Hand, he will become the Kings ward - King in all but name, Cersei was queen in all but name.

Cersei will be married off and sent from KL - who she would be married to though...?

Obviously no Faith Militant, and I doubt Tywin would be so stupid with the Iron Bank as to send them running to Stannis.

Would Jaime still be sent to sort out the Riverlands?

Tyrion is an interesting one. I doubt Tywin is going to want to keep him around, but he won't send him to Casterly Rock. He can't go and claim Winterfell either without Sansa. Maybe he would still send him to The Wall.

[Gallus]

He did kill the Mountain, you probably mean "what if he defeated him?"
Well, Tyrion wouldn't have killed Tywin, but I believe that either Varys or Oberyn would have done it anyway. Tyrion would never have met Aegon and so Aegon would have gone to Dany instead of Stormlands.

[deusvult6]

That would've been awkward:

"Hi Aunty. Oh, what? You're already married? I was going to ... well nevermind. Do you want to go conquer Westeros with me?"
"No, I've decided to rule this cess-pit instead."
"Huh. Welp, I guess I'll see you later then."

[HannibalExMachina]

changed title, ware your spoilers.

[TheDude117]

Thanks for changing the title kinda new to starting these threads... I still think that things might have played out kind of similarly... Varys is still a Targaryen agent (maybe) so he is probably still going to try to kill Tywin... similar to what he did with Kevan in aDwD... or Oberyn already poisoned him like previously stated... so if Tywin was poisoned and died and if Tyrion went back to Dorne with the Red Viper crowning Myrcella would still kinda be probable... of course it depends if whether or not the Red Viper feels that the death of Tywin and the Mountain would be enough for vengeance or if he wanted to take the whole of House Lannister down with him

[Louis XVI]

Is the theory that Oberyn already poisoned Tywin not known yet on these forums?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Tywin Lannister: Dead Man ?

“Where will I find my lord father?”
“In the solar with Lord Tyrell and Prince Oberyn.”
Mace Tyrell and the Red Viper breaking bread together? Strange and stranger.
—Jaime and Ser Meryn Trant, upon Jaime’s return to King’s Landing

“Widow’s blood, this one is called, for the color. A cruel potion. It shuts down a man’s bladder and bowels, until he drowns in his own poisons.”
—Grand Maester Pycelle, during Tyrion’s trial

“To be sure, I have much to thank your sister for. If not for her accusation at the feast, it might well be you judging me instead of me judging you.” The prince’s eyes were dark with amusement. “Who knows more of poison than the Red Viper of Dorne, after all?”
[…]
“Your father,” said Prince Oberyn, “may not live forever.”
Something about the way he said it made the hairs on the back of Tyrion’s neck bristle. Suddenly he was mindful of Elia again, and all that Oberyn had said as they crossed the field of ashes. He wants the head that spoke the words, not just the hand that swung the sword. “It is not wise to speak such treasons in the Red Keep, my prince. The little birds are listening.”
“Let them. Is it treason to say a man is mortal? Valar morghulis was how they said it in Valyria of old. All men must die. And the Doom came and proved it true.”
—Prince Oberyn Martell and Tyrion, in Tyrion’s cell

He found his father where he knew he’d find him, seated in the dimness of the privy tower, bedrobe hiked up around his hips.
[…]
For once, his father did what Tyrion asked him. The proof was the sudden stench, as his bowels loosened in the moment of death. Well, he was in the right place for it, Tyrion thought. But the stink that filled the privy gave ample evidence that the oft-repeated jape about his father was just another lie.
Lord Tywin Lannister did not, in the end, gold.
—from Tyrion’s assassination of Tywin during his escape from the black cells

The King’s Hand was rotting visibly. His face had taken on a greenish tinge, and his eyes were deeply sunken, two black pits. Fissures had opened in his cheeks, and a foul white fluid was seeping through the joints of his splendid gold-and-crimson armor to pool beneath his body.
[…]
Red-eyed and pale, Cersei climbed the steps to kneel above their father, drawing Tommen down beside her. The boy recoiled at the sight, but his mother seized his wrist before he could pull away.“Pray,” she whispered, and Tommen tried. But he was only eight and Lord Tywin was a horror. One desperate breath of air, then the king began to sob.“Stop that!” Cersei said. Tommen turned his head and doubled over, retching. His crown fell off and rolled across the marble floor. His mother pulled back in disgust, and all at once the king was running for the doors, as fast as his eight-year-old legs could carry him.
“Ser Osmund, relieve me,” Jaime said sharply, as Kettleblack turned to chase the crown. He handed the man the golden sword and went after his king. In the Hall of Lamps he caught him, beneath the eyes of two dozen startled septas. “I’m sorry,” Tommen wept. “I will do better on the morrow. Mother says a king must show the way, but the smell made me sick.”
This will not do. Too many eager ears and watching eyes.“Best we go outside, Your Grace.” Jaime led the boy out to where the air was as fresh and clean as King’s Landing ever got. Twoscore gold cloaks had been posted around the plaza to guard the horses and the litters. He took the king off to the side, well away from everyone, and sat him down upon the marble steps. “I wasn’t scared,” the boy insisted. “The smell made me sick. Didn’t it make you sick? How could you bear it, Uncle, ser?”
—Jaime, Cersei, and Tommen, during Tywin’s funeral.

I’m just saying: means, motive, opportunity.

So Tywin would die anyway (if it is true)

[ccllnply]

Is the theory that Oberyn already poisoned Tywin not known yet on these forums?

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Tywin Lannister: Dead Man ?

“Where will I find my lord father?”
“In the solar with Lord Tyrell and Prince Oberyn.”
Mace Tyrell and the Red Viper breaking bread together? Strange and stranger.
—Jaime and Ser Meryn Trant, upon Jaime’s return to King’s Landing

“Widow’s blood, this one is called, for the color. A cruel potion. It shuts down a man’s bladder and bowels, until he drowns in his own poisons.”
—Grand Maester Pycelle, during Tyrion’s trial

“To be sure, I have much to thank your sister for. If not for her accusation at the feast, it might well be you judging me instead of me judging you.” The prince’s eyes were dark with amusement. “Who knows more of poison than the Red Viper of Dorne, after all?”
[…]
“Your father,” said Prince Oberyn, “may not live forever.”
Something about the way he said it made the hairs on the back of Tyrion’s neck bristle. Suddenly he was mindful of Elia again, and all that Oberyn had said as they crossed the field of ashes. He wants the head that spoke the words, not just the hand that swung the sword. “It is not wise to speak such treasons in the Red Keep, my prince. The little birds are listening.”
“Let them. Is it treason to say a man is mortal? Valar morghulis was how they said it in Valyria of old. All men must die. And the Doom came and proved it true.”
—Prince Oberyn Martell and Tyrion, in Tyrion’s cell

He found his father where he knew he’d find him, seated in the dimness of the privy tower, bedrobe hiked up around his hips.
[…]
For once, his father did what Tyrion asked him. The proof was the sudden stench, as his bowels loosened in the moment of death. Well, he was in the right place for it, Tyrion thought. But the stink that filled the privy gave ample evidence that the oft-repeated jape about his father was just another lie.
Lord Tywin Lannister did not, in the end, gold.
—from Tyrion’s assassination of Tywin during his escape from the black cells

The King’s Hand was rotting visibly. His face had taken on a greenish tinge, and his eyes were deeply sunken, two black pits. Fissures had opened in his cheeks, and a foul white fluid was seeping through the joints of his splendid gold-and-crimson armor to pool beneath his body.
[…]
Red-eyed and pale, Cersei climbed the steps to kneel above their father, drawing Tommen down beside her. The boy recoiled at the sight, but his mother seized his wrist before he could pull away.“Pray,” she whispered, and Tommen tried. But he was only eight and Lord Tywin was a horror. One desperate breath of air, then the king began to sob.“Stop that!” Cersei said. Tommen turned his head and doubled over, retching. His crown fell off and rolled across the marble floor. His mother pulled back in disgust, and all at once the king was running for the doors, as fast as his eight-year-old legs could carry him.
“Ser Osmund, relieve me,” Jaime said sharply, as Kettleblack turned to chase the crown. He handed the man the golden sword and went after his king. In the Hall of Lamps he caught him, beneath the eyes of two dozen startled septas. “I’m sorry,” Tommen wept. “I will do better on the morrow. Mother says a king must show the way, but the smell made me sick.”
This will not do. Too many eager ears and watching eyes.“Best we go outside, Your Grace.” Jaime led the boy out to where the air was as fresh and clean as King’s Landing ever got. Twoscore gold cloaks had been posted around the plaza to guard the horses and the litters. He took the king off to the side, well away from everyone, and sat him down upon the marble steps. “I wasn’t scared,” the boy insisted. “The smell made me sick. Didn’t it make you sick? How could you bear it, Uncle, ser?”
—Jaime, Cersei, and Tommen, during Tywin’s funeral.

I’m just saying: means, motive, opportunity.

So Tywin would die anyway (if it is true)

It was already mentioned in this thread

[Louis XVI]

It was already mentioned in this thread