Page 1 of 8 12345678 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 166

Thread: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    Protector Domesticus
    Citizen

    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    4,045

    Default The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    The US is gonna get a 51st State!

    In a way, this is almost as important as the election itself.

    Congress (both the Republicans and Democrats) would have to be almost suicidal to stop this, especially for the GOP dominated House. The slap in the face it would represent to the Hispanic community would destroy their electoral chances for decades, and if IIRC the official platforms of both parties already support the Statehood route.

    Source


    By Associated Press, Published: November 6

    SAN JUAN, Puerto Rico — Puerto Ricans faced a fundamental question on Election Day: Should they change their ties with the United States?

    Citizens in the U.S. island territory cannot vote in the U.S. presidential election, but many were excited to participate in a referendum on whether to push the territory toward statehood, greater autonomy or independence.

    Car horns blared and party flags waved after polling stations closed following what election officials said was a high voter turnout. During the day, many voters carried umbrellas against the blistering tropical sun as temperatures neared 90 degrees Fahrenheit (31 degrees Celsius).

    The two-part referendum first asked voters if they wanted to change Puerto Rico’s 114-year relationship with the United States. A second question gave voters three alternatives if they wanted a change: become a U.S. state, gain independence, or have a “sovereign free association,” a designation that would give more autonomy for the territory of 4 million people.

    With 243 of 1,643 precincts reporting late Tuesday, 75,188 voters, or 53 percent, said they did not want to continue under the current political status. Forty-seven percent, or 67,304 voters, supported the status quo.

    On the second question, 65 percent favored statehood, followed by 31 percent for sovereign free association and 4 percent for independence.

    “Puerto Rico has to be a state. There is no other option,” said 25-year-old Jerome Lefebre, who picked up his grandfather before driving to the polls. “We’re doing OK, but we could do better. We would receive more benefits, a lot more financial help.”

    But 42-year-old Ramon Lopez de Azua said he favored the current system, which grants U.S. citizenship but prevents Puerto Ricans from voting for president unless they live in the United States, and gives those on the island only limited representation in Congress.

    “Puerto Rico’s problem is not its political status,” he said. “I think that the United States is the best country in the world, but I am Puerto Rican first.”

    Both President Barack Obama and rival Mitt Romney said they supported the referendum, with Obama pledging to respect the will of the people if there was a clear majority. Any change would require approval by the U.S. Congress.

    Puerto Rico held non-binding referendums in 1967, 1993 and 1998, with statehood never garnering a clear majority and independence never obtaining more than 5 percent of the vote.

    The island also was electing legislators and a governor, with Gov. Luis Fortuno of the pro-statehood New Progressive Party seeking a second term. Fortuno, a Republican, was challenged by Alejandro Garcia Padilla, whose Popular Democratic Party favors the status quo. With 817 of 1,643 precincts reporting late Tuesday, Garcia had 427,604 votes, or 48 percent, while Fortuno had 422,506 votes, or 47 percent.

    ___

    Associated Press writer Ben Fox contributed to this report.

    Copyright 2012 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.
    My only question is...what happens to the House if Puerto Rico gets added? The House has a maximum of 435 representatives, if they add a new state, are they gonna have to take redistrict the USA and hold the House elections again?

    The of course there's the effect of how 2 more members of the Senate will effect things like filibustering.

    This really is a great surprise. I always thought the referendum was being held at a later date. What's even better is that there's already a few designs out there for what the new "51st Star Flag" should look like:


    Last edited by Caelius; November 07, 2012 at 01:36 AM.

  2. #2
    Jaketh's Avatar Praeses
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    8,973

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    The more the merrier. I'm all for expanding the United States and adding them as a state.

  3. #3

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    I love this, long, long overdue and I'm exceptionally glad that this happened now. This isn't almost as big as the election, this is as big, lets not beat around the bush here.

    Redistricting might be a small pain, but it shouldn't be that difficult to figure it all out.

    I'd expound on my thoughts more but... 3 AM.

    Patronized by the mighty Heinz Guderian

  4. #4

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by frozenprince View Post
    I love this, long, long overdue and I'm exceptionally glad that this happened now. This isn't almost as big as the election, this is as big, lets not beat around the bush here.
    It's far bigger. The election is meaningful for only 4 years and considering that you still have two diametrically opposed parties controlling their halves of the Congress it's not even that meaningful. A new state on the other hand is a fundamental and enduring change to the entire nation.

    The only real change from the election is the possible Supreme Court nomination. Assuming someone does retire/die during this tenure that institution will likely then be used to sneak about and push through/repeal laws that otherwise wouldn't have the neccessary support. Supreme Court activism by both sides needs to be reigned in.

  5. #5
    I WUB PUGS's Avatar OOH KILL 'EM
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Nor ☆ Cal
    Posts
    9,149

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Good news for Dems considering the Puerto Rican vote delivered Orange County Florida to them.

    I just assumed this would always happen, I just always thought it was Puerto Ricans themselves holding it off, which I guess they were. This should be fast tracked and be in place by next Congressional Election.

    Definitely the 1st flag design.

  6. #6

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    So 35% of those who voted favored statehood.

    Maybe I am missing something, but that's not even a plurality as 47% voted for the status quo.

  7. #7
    Akar's Avatar I am not a clever man
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    a 7/11 parking lot with Patron and LaCroix
    Posts
    20,034
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Second one is clearly better in every way.

  8. #8
    Protector Domesticus
    Citizen

    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Posts
    4,045

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Sphere
    So 35% of those who voted favored statehood.

    Maybe I am missing something, but that's not even a plurality as 47% voted for the status quo.
    Wha?

    65% voted for Statehood.

  9. #9
    Tuor's Avatar Senator
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Arkansas, USA
    Posts
    1,261

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Great stuff here. I'm really excited for the Puerto Ricans and wondering why this isn't being covered non-stop in the news right now.

    I'm hoping that them becoming a state will restart the language debate in the United States. I think having a state with a Spanish-speaking majority could influence the status of language teaching and recognition in our country for the better.

  10. #10
    Copperknickers II's Avatar quaeri, si sapis
    Citizen

    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    The Carpathian Forests (formerly Scotlland)
    Posts
    12,641

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    I think less than 3% of Puerto Ricans have English as their first language, and around 85% are not fluent in it. I have to say, I do not think Puerto Rico can be considered an American state, when it is culturally Latino, but then again soon Latinos will be outnumbering white people in other states. It can't be long now before some kind of Spanish-English creole starts to develop in the US.
    A new mobile phone tower went up in a town in the USA, and the local newspaper asked a number of people what they thought of it. Some said they noticed their cellphone reception was better. Some said they noticed the tower was affecting their health.

    A local administrator was asked to comment. He nodded sagely, and said simply: "Wow. And think about how much more pronounced these effects will be once the tower is actually operational."

  11. #11
    Col. Tartleton's Avatar Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Cape Ann
    Posts
    13,053

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Copperknickers II View Post
    I think less than 3% of Puerto Ricans have English as their first language, and around 85% are not fluent in it. I have to say, I do not think Puerto Rico can be considered an American state, when it is culturally Latino, but then again soon Latinos will be outnumbering white people in other states. It can't be long now before some kind of Spanish-English creole starts to develop in the US.
    Well frankly the Spanish won the colonial battle. They took almost all the land and all the people. America north of the Rio Grande was an empty expanse with the exception of the odd stone age nomadic tribal confederacy. America became a dumping ground for European exiles, refugees, and traders. Which happens to mean the most resourceful hard working people with something to prove in the world banding together in a somewhat tolerant environment for Cultural Learnings of America for Make Benefit Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan.

    Spain-Portugal went after Mexico and South America where all the people were and converted them to their language, religion, and culture.

    As a result the majority of Americans are Latino, not Germanic. The pre Columbian demographics will eventually re-balance for the most part I figure. The only question is whether the USA will be able to absorb Latin America or be absorbed by it. I think we a good thing going here.
    Last edited by Col. Tartleton; November 07, 2012 at 11:07 AM.
    The Earth is inhabited by billions of idiots.
    The search for intelligent life continues...

  12. #12

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Copperknickers II View Post
    I think less than 3% of Puerto Ricans have English as their first language, and around 85% are not fluent in it. I have to say, I do not think Puerto Rico can be considered an American state, when it is culturally Latino, but then again soon Latinos will be outnumbering white people in other states. It can't be long now before some kind of Spanish-English creole starts to develop in the US.
    'spanglish' is widespread here among the younger crowd. the older generation generally doesn't touch english.
    reminds me of south Florida when i used to live there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wartotalworldguy View Post
    Anyways lets see what congress decides about it
    if you're talking about US congress, nothing for now. the legislation here needs to be continued past a simple non-binding referendum.
    Last edited by snuggans; November 07, 2012 at 11:10 AM.

  13. #13
    Border Patrol's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Irvine, California
    Posts
    4,286

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Copperknickers II View Post
    I think less than 3% of Puerto Ricans have English as their first language, and around 85% are not fluent in it. I have to say, I do not think Puerto Rico can be considered an American state, when it is culturally Latino, but then again soon Latinos will be outnumbering white people in other states. It can't be long now before some kind of Spanish-English creole starts to develop in the US.
    Are you talking about Spanglish? It's already a thing. Spoken mostly by illiterate nuts that refuse to integrate. Culture has literally zero bearing on the United States. Americans never have been and never will be a people. Louisiana Creoles and Nuevo Mexicano Criollos have very little if anything in common for instance, aside from cooking up some amazing foods. Puerto Ricans are most certainly in that club, and I for one wil be applauding statehood if it comes through.
    Proud Nerdimus Maximus of the Trench Coat Mafia.

  14. #14
    Col. Tartleton's Avatar Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Cape Ann
    Posts
    13,053

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Border Patrol View Post
    Are you talking about Spanglish? It's already a thing. Spoken mostly by illiterate nuts that refuse to integrate. Culture has literally zero bearing on the United States. Americans never have been and never will be a people. Louisiana Creoles and Nuevo Mexicano Criollos have very little if anything in common for instance, aside from cooking up some amazing foods. Puerto Ricans are most certainly in that club, and I for one wil be applauding statehood if it comes through.
    Exactly. We're a group of people not a people.
    The Earth is inhabited by billions of idiots.
    The search for intelligent life continues...

  15. #15
    Acco's Avatar Дијана
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Minsk, Belarus
    Posts
    3,500

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Col. Tartleton View Post
    Exactly. We're a group of people not a people.
    "Americans" aren't technically a separate ethnic group, but they do tend to function as an ethnicity. American nationalism/patriotism (primarily civic- and ideal-based) has proven strong enough to overcome cultural differences.

  16. #16
    manofarms89's Avatar Senator
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    La Puente, California, United States of America
    Posts
    1,325

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by Border Patrol View Post
    Are you talking about Spanglish? It's already a thing. Spoken mostly by illiterate nuts that refuse to integrate. Culture has literally zero bearing on the United States. Americans never have been and never will be a people. Louisiana Creoles and Nuevo Mexicano Criollos have very little if anything in common for instance, aside from cooking up some amazing foods. Puerto Ricans are most certainly in that club, and I for one wil be applauding statehood if it comes through.
    Speaking Spanglish has nothing to do with how integrated someone is. Both sides of my family speak it and both sides have been here for just over one hundred years.

  17. #17
    Border Patrol's Avatar Protector Domesticus
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Irvine, California
    Posts
    4,286

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Quote Originally Posted by manofarms89 View Post
    Speaking Spanglish has nothing to do with how integrated someone is. Both sides of my family speak it and both sides have been here for just over one hundred years.
    So? My family has been here since the conquest. Hell I don't speak enough Spanish to find my way home. I'd say you guys have some catching up to do.
    Proud Nerdimus Maximus of the Trench Coat Mafia.

  18. #18

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Nevermind, the article was misleading.

    A second question gave voters three alternatives if they wanted there were to be a change:
    Still this seems like a rather odd referendum. Why not statehood yes/no?

    It is a distinct possibility that the majority who took part in the poll are against statehood.
    Last edited by Sphere; November 07, 2012 at 02:08 AM.

  19. #19

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    I thought Canada was the 51st state?

    I guess welcome aboard Puerto Rico. Honestly I always felt either make them a state or grant them independence, this territory nonsense seems pointless

    but... what percentage of them actually speak English? If a large percentage of them dont speak english thats going to alienate them to a degree
    Last edited by Fluttershy; November 07, 2012 at 01:59 AM.

  20. #20
    MacCarthy's Avatar Miles
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Bluegrass State
    Posts
    315

    Default Re: The American Flag will soon be obsolete: Puerto Rico votes for Statehood!

    Notice the reasoning, “We’re doing OK, but we could do better. We would receive more benefits, a lot more financial help.”

Page 1 of 8 12345678 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •