Conquistadors's cannibalism

[PikeStance]

I challenge you, find something there that isn't real, in an important page.

Take this for example, I suppose you will find that BBC is a highly important source.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british...adors_01.shtml

And now take a look at Wikipedia, on the same subject:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conquistador

Which one does teach us more about it?

But it's normal, today it's full of reactionary people such as yourself, struggling to advance in the field of knowledge and think that Wikipedia is not a good place to study since their whole pages aren't better than 3 lines written by a bloody with a P.hD. For once, the world's greatest books and teachings can be gathered at one place, just one place so the entire world can study, read, help, improve, learn. Are there problems? Sure, nothing is perfect, but why aren't you helping us realise this dream, instead of sitting on your arse and mocking the hard work of others?

What exactly is the point of your tirade? I am sure a lot of people are informed about a many topics on wikipedia. However, it isn't a a valid source for serious discussion. This isn't mocking the site; its just how it is. For example; Encyclopedia Britannica is one of the most respected publications, but it is still not a primary or secondary source for information. I am not mocking the publication, but simply stating what it is (or specifically what it isn't).

To conclude, this as gone long enough--- about 3/4 post on this point. Wikipedia is not and will never be considered a source (both primary and secondary). I personally, will never accept it as such--- that's me. If you want to use it, by all means do, but don't expect me or any other serious academic to take it as a legitimate source. BTW, I also do not know of ANY history teacher that considers wikipedia as valid either- First day of orientation there is always one person who opens; "ok, I have to say this to get it off my chest, I do not think we should accept wikipedia as a valid source for research papers," and like that a collective sigh of relief is heard. As far as College professors are concerned, well,... I wouldn't be quick to put it in your citation page...if you know what I mean

---

[Kaiser Nonsense]

What exactly is the point of your tirade? I am sure a lot of people are informed about a many topics on wikipedia. However, it isn't a a valid source for serious discussion. This isn't mocking the site; its just how it is. For example; Encyclopedia Britannica is one of the most respected publications, but it is still not a primary or secondary source for information. I am not mocking the publication, but simply stating what it is (or specifically what it isn't).

Precisely, it is not a source, it's a gathering of sources. I could as well write the same text written on Wikipedia to you, and state other sources, which they do.

Take this for example, it is a list of sources on the page Conquistador.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

References

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40. ^ Ricklefs, M.C. (1991). A History of Modern Indonesia Since c.1300, 2nd Edition. London: MacMillan. p. 26. ISBN 0-333-57689-6.
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43. ^ a b c Ricklefs, M.C. (1991). A History of Modern Indonesia Since c.1300, 2nd Edition. London: MacMillan. p. 24. ISBN 0-333-57689-6.
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47. ^ a b Skidmore, p. 27.
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52. ^ Boxer, p. 100.
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56. ^ Bueno, pp. 80–81.
57. ^ Facsimiles of multiple original documents relating about the events in Brazil in the 17th century that led to a Dutch influence and their final defeat
58. ^ Calmon, p. 294.
59. ^ Bueno, p. 86.
60. ^ Andrea, Alfred J.; Overfield, James H. (2005). "Letter by Christopher Columbus concerning recently discovered islands". The Human Record. 1. Houghton Mifflin Company. p. 8. ISBN 0-618-37040-4.
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63. ^ The numbers for Grijalva's expedition are as given by Bernal Díaz, who participated in the voyage. See Díaz del Castillo (1963, p.27).
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Further reading

• Chasteen, John Charles (2001). Born In Blood And Fire: A Concise History of Latin America. New York: W. W. Norton & Co.. ISBN 978-0-393-97613-7.
• Innes, Hammond (2002). The Conquistadors. London: Penguin. ISBN 978-0-14-139122-9.
• Kirkpatrick, F. A. (1934). The Spanish Conquistadores. London: A. & C. Black.
• Wood, Michael (2000). Conquistadors. London: BBC Books. ISBN 978-0-563-48706-7.

[Petrucci]

You went too much off topic. Pls return to it if you have any valid information.

[TWWolfe]

I know that on sailing ships, resorting to cannibalism when people ran out of supplies was common enough that many crews would often make sure to point out they HADN'T when they recieved supplies. Also, they differentiated between cannibalism just out of survival and cannibalism simply for the sake of eating people. Its not unheard of that the Conquistadors might have resorted to it, though more than likely they would have eaten natives rather than ther own fellows.

[Diocle]

I've read these three pages, and I didn't find not even one link to a book or some kind of source belonging to the XV, XVI or XVII centuries, speaking of Cannibalism among the Conquistadores.

[Ludicus]

I've read these three pages, and I didn't find not even one link to a book or some kind of source belonging to the XV, XVI or XVII centuries, speaking of Cannibalism among the Conquistadores.

Indeed. How could they be cannibals?
For example, in the Pacific,
"Mendaña´s men had met one of the few cultures that practiced ritual cannibalism. When they were offered the severed arm and shoulder of a child, the Spanish were disgusted and quietly buried the body parts with a Christian ceremony"
page 53, "Exploring the Pacific" Martha Veil.

[Petrucci]

Indeed. How could they be cannibals?

Despair make man do unimaginable things.Just think about the context of their conquest

[TheNasoRomaLost]

Despair make man do unimaginable things.Just think about the context of their conquest

If you wish to think they were cannibals out of identification with the Aztecs and Inca that is understandable but I have not seen any evidence presented in this thread for them being cannibals while I have seen evidence against it while I know evidence against it myself such as the Noche Triste (Cortez' men tried to intervene against human sacrifice they became besieged when they tried to escape hundreds drowned trying to escape the rivers, and you were responding to someone who posted their actual reaction to cannibalism.

Perhaps the OP could produce the source that claims cannibalism because I know of no source academic or otherwise to say so.

Lets also face it; the Incan Empire was destroyed by a civil where which invited other natives to attack and a few hundred spaniards where there, and Montezuma's massive human sacrifice fetish provoked all non-Aztecs to attack him at the same time while a few hundred spaniards were there.

[Petrucci]

If you wish to think they were cannibals out of identification with the Aztecs and Inca that is understandable but I have not seen any evidence presented in this thread for them being cannibals while I have seen evidence against it while I know evidence against it myself such as the Noche Triste (Cortez' men tried to intervene against human sacrifice they became besieged when they tried to escape hundreds drowned trying to escape the rivers, and you were responding to someone who posted their actual reaction to cannibalism.

Perhaps the OP could produce the source that claims cannibalism because I know of no source academic or otherwise to say so.

Lets also face it; the Incan Empire was destroyed by a civil where which invited other natives to attack and a few hundred spaniards where there, and Montezuma's massive human sacrifice fetish provoked all non-Aztecs to attack him at the same time while a few hundred spaniards were there.

Qouteing me

I find some trace in book of the Frederick Alexander Kirkpatrick "The Spanish conquistadors".

Aztec were not the only one to preform human sacrifice. Many perhaps the most of them did.

[Hresvelgr]

Qouteing me

Aztec were not the only one to preform human sacrifice. Many perhaps the most of them did.

Their neighbors and vassals who so famously rose up against them and joined Cortes largely performed the same kinds of human sacrifice the Aztecs did. What made them so angry at the Aztecs was that the Aztecs were militarily superior to them and had been winning most of the wars against them. They did sacrifice more people than the Tlaxcallans and others, but that was primarily because the Tlaxcallans generally lost and losers don't exactly take home many prisoners. If the shoe had been on the other foot we'd surely be droning on about the cruel oppression of the Tlaxcala Empire against the poor Mexica and how the Mexica (the people commonly referred to now as the Aztecs) were innocent and all that crap.

[Ludicus]

Despair make man do unimaginable things.Just think about the context of their conquest

There is no historical evidence.

[Petrucci]

There is no historical evidence.

Despair make man do unimaginable things.Just think about the context of their conquest

Are you talking about first or second sentence? In case its the first one , my answer is hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah.
In case its the second one , I already said where did my evidence came from.

[Ludicus]

my answer is hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah.

Try another forum; "this forum is for the pursuit of honourable discussion and the fostering of academic debate. All members are welcome but they will be held to a higher standard of civility"
--
Is there any historical evidence of Conquistadors's cannibalism? books, primary or secondary sources?

--

I find some trace in book of the Frederick Alexander Kirkpatrick "The Spanish conquistadors"

Please quote the passage...
---

Despair make man do unimaginable things

Survival cannibalism is innate in humans.Yesterday, today and tomorrow.

[Petrucci]

Try another forum; "this forum is for the pursuit of honourable discussion and the fostering of academic debate. All members are welcome but they will be held to a higher standard of civility"
--
Is there any historical evidence of Conquistadors's cannibalism? books, primary or secondary sources?

--

Please quote the passage...
---

Survival cannibalism is innate in humans.Yesterday, today and tomorrow.

If you can't find example in history where man in despair did unimaginable things then you do not deserve to participate in this forum. Fair and square.
I returned book to the library , I can't find passage now , but here's the link of the book feel free to investigate http://books.google.rs/books?id=XntO...page&q&f=false

[PikeStance]

If you can't find example in history where man in despair did unimaginable things then you do not deserve to participate in this forum. Fair and square.
I returned book to the library , I can't find passage now , but here's the link of the book feel free to investigate http://books.google.rs/books?id=XntO...page&q&f=false

Hey, the book may be inaccessible, but .... What is/ are the primary source(s) the book uses to make its argument? Of course the primary source(s) may also be inaccessible, but we might be able to find an analysis of them somewhere.


....

[Petrucci]

Hey, the book may be inaccessible, but .... What is/ are the primary source(s) the book uses to make its argument? Of course the primary source(s) may also be inaccessible, but we might be able to find an analysis of them somewhere.


....

I think some Spanish report dating 17th century.

[Celtibero]

Wikipedia has more content than half of your pissing stained sources, content there is made by high knowledge people, professionals of the area, be it history or another area. Everything written in Wikipedia has a link to a source to said fact. It's a huge gathering of public knowledge maintened by hundreds of thousands of people who give their sweat to make it work. So unless you have any proof of why should people not study through there, I suggest you swallow your pride and start reading Wikipedia's pages.

While I agree wikipedia is good as a general reference page, I must tell you no respected scholar or expert on ancient history is wastes his time writting an article for wikipedia. And very few researchers with access to scholarly publications on ancient history waste their time writting for wikipedia. If you want scholarly information, read academic journals, essays scholars, etc. Those have information you wouldn't imagine exists. The are experts on every field of military history, just to name a topic. For example, yesterday i was reading a paper on the roman auxiliary units raised in the iberian peninsula, and it had around 1000 pages. Their sources arent based on mainstream publications, they mostly use epigraphic evidence, and analyze it trough hermeneutics and exegesis.

[Celtibero]

I think some Spanish report dating 17th century.

I doubt we would write about acts of cannibalism committed by our own people. So, unless someone can provide reliable sources, this will seem to me like another example of the "black legend" made by other europeans to discredit the spanish conquistas.

[Petrucci]

I doubt we would write about acts of cannibalism committed by our own people. So, unless someone can provide reliable sources, this will seem to me like another example of the "black legend" made by other europeans to discredit the spanish conquistas.

Might be, that's the reason why I came to this forum to read your opinions about it. But don't be so sure we wouldn't write about bad things our own people did. Remember how Civil wars starts, and like all wars they need casus belli too.

[Celtibero]

Might be, that's the reason why I came to this forum to read your opinions about it. But don't be so sure we wouldn't write about bad things our own people did. Remember how Civil wars starts, and like all wars they need casus belli too.

Thats a good point. There were spaniards who denounced the conquista, such as de Las Casas, a dominican priest if I remember well. However, they focused in the treatment of natives, and as far as I know never tried to accuse any conquistador of cannibalism. It just seems going to far, and Spain didnt't suffered a civil war until the carlists wars.