Anti-Jewish pogroms 1929 in "Palestine"

[Bruriya]

Each time when Arabs and others remember "slaughter" Dir-Yasin (strongly exaggerated both Arab, and Zionist, and the international promotion ), they should remember it :

http://www.jpost.com/Features/InThes...aspx?id=199634
On August 15, 1929, when Jews again marked Tisha Be’av by sitting, as well as chanting “The Wall is ours,” the Arabs began yet another in a series of bloody massacres.
The massacres in several cities culminated in unspeakable atrocities at Hebron.
It began in Jerusalem. “Itbach al-Yahood! Itbach al- Yahood!” Slaughter the Jews. Slaughter the Jews. With knives and clubs, the mob attacked every Jew in sight, burned Torah scrolls and yanked supplication notes to God from the cracks in the Wall and set them aflame.
Attacks spread throughout the land. Jews were stabbed, shot, beaten with rocks, maimed and killed in various towns and suburbs. The chaos continued for days. With thousands of dagger- and club-wielding Arabs swarming throughout the city hunting Jews, wire services transmitted headlines such as “Thousands of peasants invaded Jerusalem and raided all parts of the city.”
Martial law was declared. Armored cars were brought in from Baghdad. British airplanes swept in to machine-gun the Arab marauders. Violence continued to spread throughout Palestine. Jews fought back and retaliated with bricks and bars and whatever they could find. Then, on August 23 and 24, 1929, Hebron became a bloody nightmare.
Arab mobs went from house to house, bursting into every room looking for hiding Jews. Religious books and scrolls were burned or torn to shreds.
The defenseless Jews were variously beheaded, castrated, their breasts and fingers sliced off and, in some cases, their eyes plucked from their sockets.
Infant or adult, man or woman – it mattered not.
The carnage went on for hours, with the Arab policemen standing down – or joining in. Blood ran in streamlets down the narrow stone staircases outside the buildings. House to house, room by room, the savagery was repeated.
One young boy, Yosef Lazarovski, later wrote of the horror: “I remember a brown-skinned Arab with a large mustache breaking through the door. He had a large knife and an axe that he swung through the doorjambs until he broke through. [He was] full of fury, screaming, ‘Allah akbar!’ and ‘Itbach al-Yahood!’...
My grandfather tried to hold my hand, then [he tried] to push me aside [and hide me], screaming, Shema Yisrael... and then I remember another Arab... with an axe that he brought down on my grandfather’s neck.”
Not a single victim was simply killed. Each was mutilated and tortured in accordance with their identities, the specific information provided by local Arabs. The Jewish man who lent money to Arabs was sliced open and the IOUs burned in his body. The Jewish baker’s head was tied to the stove and then baked. A Jewish scholar who had studied Koranic philosophy for years was seized, his cranium cut open and his brain extracted. Another man was nailed to a door. Some 67 Jews were brutally murdered...

[motiv-8]

Errrr Deir Yasin was not exaggerated at all and in fact was one of the major factors that led to the exodus of three-quarters of a million Palestinians from Israel. And it was far from the only location to suffer this way, dozens of villages were attacked and forcibly emptied of their populations, Muslim and Christian. The only thing historians are unsure of now is to what extent the violence by Israeli paramilitaries was preplanned vs. spontaneous.

What is not in dispute is that what happened in 1929 WAS spontaneous, generated generally by an extreme frustration with the political and social situation in Palestine in general but in the major cities specifically, which in 1929 also witnessed mass demonstrations and labor strikes against British rule, and more immediately by rumors of Jewish violence against Arabs and the irrationality of the mob co-opted by who was indisputably a terrible human being in the form of Mufti al-Husseini. It was NOT a situation in which Jews went to pray and were then suddenly murdered, by any means. Frankly that article is complete nonsense, a prime example of propaganda that obfuscates history and serves to heighten the conflict rather than what it claims to do, to "help remember." Apparently the author couldn't bother remembering the hundreds of Jews that were protected by Arab families during the riots.

What happened in August of 1929 in Hebron was terrible, and indeed led to the arrests of well over a hundred Arabs and 34 Jews, including over a dozen death sentences for members of both communities, but to compare it to Deir-Yassin and insinuate it had the same impact, while simultaneously being so utterly dishonest and biased as to put the word slaughter in quotations as if it didn't really happen, is completely disgusting. This kind of crap doesn't belong in the Academy.

[Bruriya]

1. Deir Yasin was not exaggerated at all and in fact was one of the major factors that led to the exodus of three-quarters of a million Palestinians from Israel.

2. And it was far from the only location to suffer this way, dozens of villages were attacked and forcibly emptied of their populations, Muslim and Christian. The only thing historians are unsure of now is to what extent the violence by Israeli paramilitaries was preplanned vs. spontaneous.

3. What is not in dispute is that what happened in 1929 WAS spontaneous, generated generally by an extreme frustration with the political and social situation in Palestine in general but in the major cities specifically, which in 1929 also witnessed mass demonstrations and labor strikes against British rule,

4. and more immediately by rumors of Jewish violence against Arabs... What happened in August of 1929 in Hebron was terrible, and indeed led to the arrests of well over a hundred Arabs and 34 Jews, including over a dozen death sentences for members of both communities

5. Apparently the author couldn't bother remembering the hundreds of Jews that were protected by Arab families during the riots.

1. The university of the Palestinian city Bir-Zeit investigated this case, and found that there were 80 victims, including armed. Inhabitants Dir-Yasin, as well as many other "peace" Palestinian villages, attacked Jews during war for Independence - and Jews somehow answered them.

2. You "forgot" that Arabs in December 1947 declared war to the Palestinian Jews, promising not only to destroy future Jewish state, but also to arrange the second Holocaust "We will dump all Jews in the sea!" - there was their slogan. And after that Arabs dare to reproach Zionists!!
By the way, Arabs were afraid that Jews will revenge for numerous murders and attacks in previous years. You don't know, this fear played what role in flight of Arabs?

3. "Poor" Arabs whom "frustration with the political and social situation" "forced" to kill the Jewish children and women to hammer people to death (and it isn't so easy), to rape women and little girls! In 1929 anti-Jewish riots were not only in Hebron (as you think), but in many cities and Country settlements. By the way, Jews of Hebron were from to - the Zionist Jewish population of the Country, they didn't want to have something in common with Zionism. But it didn't prevent Arabs to kill and torture them (as well as "old" Jews in other cities - Jerusalem, Tsfat, Tverya.) To Arabs was almost all the same, what Jews to kill - Zionists, without - ideological refugees or "dhimmi"

4. Arabs projected the cruel feelings and desires on Jews (so was in 1920, and too without any real aggression from the Jewish party.) And in 1929 there were not, and 17 death sentences Jews to 3 Jews. It was the shame of Englishmen - to punish the Jews who were protecting (!) and tribespeople, but to leave without punishment the vast majority of Arab thugs. In one Hebron it was necessary to execute hundreds people! (and thousands to put in prison.)

5. In Hebron there were 19 Arab families of rescuing Jews - and thousands thugs, one hundred murderers + female robbers. That is, in this Row was many times more villains, than righteous persons. You do what conclusions from this?

[removeduser_487563287433]

Is the OP arguing that Israeli abuses are justified due to Palestinian abuses?

[Bruriya]

Is the OP arguing that Israeli abuses are justified due to Palestinian abuses?

What do you call "Israeli abuses"?
In reality, Jews in "Palestine" showed excessive restraint at the Arab anti-Jewish violence of 1920-1930. The left Zionist management during the Arab mutiny (with continuous murders of PEACE Jews) 1936-39, diligent demanded from Jews not to revenge ("havlagah")
The Russian writer Solzhenitsyn spoke: "the wolfhound is right, and the cannibal - isn't present". Arabs in the Arab-Israeli conflict behaved generally as "cannibals", and Jews - as "wolfhounds".

[removeduser_487563287433]

What do you call "Israeli abuses"?

What's my scope?

[mishkin]

Thanks god motiv-8 is here.
And dont know what else the OP expects from us.
(Better in VV, maybe?)

[motiv-8]

Is the OP arguing that Israeli abuses are justified due to Palestinian abuses?

Not only that, but the article used to back this argument also attempts to tie the Hebron riot in 1929 to every other incident in the history of the Arab-Israeli conflict, up to the Intifada, to construct a false narrative in which Arabs, reduced in this portrayal to irrational and inhuman machines of death, have been driven solely by religious hatred towards Jews who only wished to have a place to pray. It's frankly terrible, it's a complete manipulation of facts and history by someone writing for Israel's widest published paper. No wonder Haaretz just published the findings of a survey showing a third of Israelis support stripping voting rights from Arabs, half of them would turn a blind eye to forcible expulsion of Israel's Arab population, and a majority believe their homeland is an apartheid state. With stuff like this poisoning the public discourse it's practically a given.

[removeduser_487563287433]

Not only that, but the article used to back this argument also attempts to tie the Hebron riot in 1929 to every other incident in the history of the Arab-Israeli conflict, up to the Intifada, to construct a false narrative in which Arabs, reduced in this portrayal to irrational and inhuman machines of death, have been driven solely by religious hatred towards Jews who only wished to have a place to pray.

Standard.

[Bruriya]

No wonder Haaretz just published the findings of a survey showing a third of Israelis support stripping voting rights from Arabs, and a majority believe their homeland is an apartheid state. With stuff like this poisoning the public discourse it's practically a given.

I don't understand, how you dare to condemn the Israeli apartheid. You the Muslim You should know, how Jews lived in the Muslim countries. Contempt (to which your religion learns), heavy discrimination, humiliations, frequent riots (at usual impunity of thugs), violent addresses to Islam. Israel treats Arabs living under its power much better (fight against the Arab terror isn't counted, it is protection.) But Arabs and Aryans, instead of that what to praise this generosity, condemn us for "apartheid".
For example, Arabs of Hebron remembered that local Jews "didn't lift the head too highly", that is were humiliated, how Islam demands for "dhimmi". Unless it would be unfair to impose to local Arabs the same status? (but Israel didn't make it.)

half of them would turn a blind eye to forcible expulsion of Israel's Arab population

We should leave here those who regularly kills us and helps murderers who wants to destroy Israel and who at the next war willingly will strike to us in a back? You consider, what we haven't the right to protect ourselves, what should obediently allow to kill us how it is many centuries was in the Muslim and Christian countries?!

[Morbius Sire]

Hmm, odd thread.

I don't understand, how you dare to condemn the Israeli apartheid. You the Muslim You should know, how Jews lived in the Muslim countries. Contempt (to which your religion learns), heavy discrimination, humiliations, frequent riots (at usual impunity of thugs), violent addresses to Islam. Israel treats Arabs living under its power much better (fight against the Arab terror isn't counted, it is protection.) But Arabs and Aryans, instead of that what to praise this generosity, condemn us for "apartheid".
For example, Arabs of Hebron remembered that local Jews "didn't lift the head too highly", that is were humiliated, how Islam demands for "dhimmi". Unless it would be unfair to impose to local Arabs the same status? (but Israel didn't make it.)

We should leave here those who regularly kills us and helps murderers who wants to destroy Israel and who at the next war willingly will strike to us in a back? You consider, what we haven't the right to protect ourselves, what should obediently allow to kill us how it is many centuries was in the Muslim and Christian countries?!

You do know that prior to Israel inception, many Jews lived peacefully in Arab countries?

Most of these crimes, or hate towards them was created from the violent events happening in the holy land.

A significant proportion of Jews left due to political insecurity and the rise of Arab nationalism, and later also due to policies of some Arab governments, who sought to present the expulsion of Jews as a crowd-driven retaliatory act for the exodus of Arab refugees from Palestine

[1][2]


Since you're defending Israel, can you explain these two articles?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...rabs-poll.html
And this:
http://web.archive.org/web/200612300...extbooks6.html
I know both these two cover recent years, but my point is that both sides are wrong in their stance/opinions. Nobody's an angel, not israelis, not jews, and not arabs.

[Primo]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...rabs-poll.html

The poll surveyed 503 people.

It's population is 7.913.900. I don't think this poll has any worth. If you ask only certain people (i.e. those that you know will say what you want) in America about whether they would prefer communism, you could make a perfectly correct, yet absolutely irrelevant poll stating that "90% of Americans prefer communism", even though it's not true.

[Morbius Sire]

It's population is 7.913.900. I don't think this poll has any worth. If you ask only certain people (i.e. those that you know will say what you want) in America about whether they would prefer communism, you could make a perfectly correct, yet absolutely irrelevant poll stating that "90% of Americans prefer communism", even though it's not true.

Yeah, the sample number taken for that poll is extremely small but i would assume that would be accounted for in the actual polling/calculations. The main reason i had used that poll is mainly because it is one of the few poll addressing the subject. Add to that, this poll should at least represent some of the more nationalistic or extreme israeli civilians.

I had found this opinion piece earlier, but I was weary about posting it even if the opinion is well referenced.

[removeduser_487563287433]

It's population is 7.913.900. I don't think this poll has any worth. If you ask only certain people (i.e. those that you know will say what you want) in America about whether they would prefer communism, you could make a perfectly correct, yet absolutely irrelevant poll stating that "90% of Americans prefer communism", even though it's not true.

I think you'll find that's a fairly typical size for any poll. Unless you have an objection to the sampling method, 503 people is certainly enough.

[Bruriya]

You do know that prior to Israel inception, many Jews lived peacefully in Arab countries?
Most of these crimes, or hate towards them was created from the violent events happening in the holy land.

You have big problems with understanding of the read. You quoted my words: "Jews lived in the Muslim countries. Contempt (to which your religion learns), heavy discrimination, humiliations, frequent riots (at usual impunity of thugs), violently addresses to Islam. " You call it "Jews lived peacefully in Arab countries"?!!

Since you're defending Israel, can you explain these two articles?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...rabs-poll.html

Considerable part of this "racism" - the answer to the Arab terrorism and judeophobia ,that Arabs more or less deserved. As to the rest - Arabs still consider laws dhimmi fair. Means, they especially should consider fair softer discrimination, which part of the Israeli Jews wants for Arabs.

I know both these two cover recent years, but my point is that both sides are wrong

You consider, what Jews even after the Holocaust should remain in Europe hating us, and not to dare to create the state where we could protect ourselves? It is tremendous impudence, even if you aren't German, Romanian, or Lithuanian, or from other people which were actively participating in the Holocaust

[Treize]

The Ottomans in the late 19th century 'confiscated' all the land that Palestinian farmers lived and worked on for many generation, all of a sudden declaring it to be state property. They proceeded to sell it to a select group of rich landowners (as I recall mainly in Beirut). These sold about 8% I think it was of he Palestine area to Jewish settlers and these kicked the Palestinians off the land their families had owned for generations to replace them with settlers. This pissed them off for obvious reasons.

But besides that, you expect the Palestinians to be friendly towards large numbers of foreign immigrants who came to Palestine with the sole purpose of creating a 'Jewish state' in their homeland and even expell them, the natives? Really?

[Dr. Croccer]

But besides that, you expect the Palestinians to be friendly towards large numbers of foreign immigrants who came to Palestine with the sole purpose of creating a 'Jewish state' in their homeland and even expell them, the natives? Really?

It's basically the equivalent of Latinos emigrating to the US because they think it's Aztlan until they become 35% of the population and get the best half of the country.

It's utterly absurd to see people who normally oppose immigration defend this, which is unjustifiable unless they have some prejudice against the Palestinians.

[Treize]

It's basically the equivalent of Latinos emigrating to the US because they think it's Aztlan until they become 35% of the population and get the best half of the country.

...and drive out 80% of the people from 80% of the land... And occupy the remaining 20%...

It's utterly absurd to see people who normally oppose immigration defend this, which is unjustifiable unless they have some prejudice against the Palestinians.

Yes exactly, I agree, the same people who cry rivers about immigrants, muslims and whatnot; who preach this Eurabia nonsense and write silly hateblogs (with the sidebars usually lined with Israeli flags lol) consider the only immigrants who actually did bring great harm upon the native population of a region, in the modern day and age, as heroes who we need to support and give guns and coin.

Silly isn't it? Hypocrisy to the max. A great way to prove that they actually aren't real nationalists/patriots but rather just petty islamophobes.

[Bruriya]

The Ottomans in the late 19th century 'confiscated' all the land that Palestinian farmers lived and worked on for many generation, all of a sudden declaring it to be state property. They proceeded to sell it to a select group of rich landowners (as I recall mainly in Beirut). These sold about 8% I think it was of he Palestine area to Jewish settlers and these kicked the Palestinians off the land their families had owned for generations to replace them with settlers. This pissed them off for obvious reasons.
But besides that, you expect the Palestinians to be friendly towards large numbers of foreign immigrants who came to Palestine with the sole purpose of creating a 'Jewish state' in their homeland and even expell them, the natives? Really?

You "forgot" that Arabs didn't live in "Palestina" since the time of Neanderthal men They in VII century took away it from Byzantium and at Jews because they thought: "God allows to take away to us any country froms Kafirs(non-Muslims -B.)" Why you don't consider as invaders of the Arabs who have grasped absolutely another's country, but consider as invaders of the Jews who have returned to the country of their ancestors? It is even not double, but threefold injustice.
Considerable part of the "Palestinian" Arabs by 1947 there were descendants of recent immigrants of 19-20 centuries. Read, for example, researching: http://zionismontheweb.org/Palestinian_Israel_Conflict/
Arabs from other countries, Caucasians, the Balkan Muslims, Nubians, Kurds, Turks - and they thought that they have the rights to this country, BUT Jews - aren't present

[justicar5]

You "forgot" that Arabs didn't live in "Palestina" since the time of Neanderthal men They in VII century took away it from Byzantium and at Jews because they thought: "God allows to take away to us any country froms Kafirs(non-Muslims -B.)" Why you don't consider as invaders of the Arabs who have grasped absolutely another's country, but consider as invaders of the Jews who have returned to the country of their ancestors? It is even not double, but threefold injustice.
Considerable part of the "Palestinian" Arabs by 1947 there were descendants of recent immigrants of 19-20 centuries. Read, for example, researching: http://zionismontheweb.org/Palestinian_Israel_Conflict/
Arabs from other countries, Caucasians, the Balkan Muslims, Nubians, Kurds, Turks - and they thought that they have the rights to this country, BUT Jews - aren't present

Yes, yes they had. Gene analysis of palestinians and jews show that palestinians are a) closely related to Jews, and b) more closely related to the Phenocians and other pre-biblical peoples, with some sub-saharan African thrown in, than they are to other Arabs. Jews do not show this heritage, almost as if *gasp* the Jews had become a diaspora (and have Caucasian etc genetic influences) after approx 70 AD when the Romans kicked them out, and the Palestinians had stayed.