Advice

**dane323** · October 21, 2012, 07:13 AM

Hey guys, i just started up a new campaign with the kingdom of jerusalem on h-vh and its goin pretty well. i managed to capture 5 or 6 rebel settlements to the north which have been bringin in some nice income. my issue is that the eygptians (were not at war...yet) are gettin very very powerful and im stuck where i am because my income is sitting at 2k a turn while i pay upkeep for one full stack while they have 3 on my borders. Also ive noticed that the building costs are very high in this mod and i dont remember it being so when i played an earlier version a while back. Any recommendations on how to proceed from here?

**Robert Guiscard** · October 21, 2012, 10:25 AM

Well, what regions do you hold and what do the Ayyubids hold? And keep in mind, your one army can destroy the three Ayyubid ones if deployed properly.

**dane323** · October 21, 2012, 02:00 PM

Well I decided to go to war with them. I took Damascus but lost Gaza and kerak. Now the scraps of our armies are just attacking each other non stop so I'm struggling pretty hard right now

L

**dane323** · October 21, 2012, 02:00 PM

Well I decided to go to war with them. I took Damascus but lost Gaza and kerak. Now the scraps of our armies are just attacking each other non stop so I'm struggling pretty hard right now

L

**Robert Guiscard** · October 21, 2012, 04:30 PM

Hmmm, you may want to start over

. Losing Gaza and Kerak leave Jerusalem and Damascus open to attack. You could try to get a Crusade, but that's no guarantee of victory. What I always find to work is to take Antioch, Ba'albek, Aleppo, and Homs right away. This way you have a solid base and you should start getting positive cash flow. Then, if the Ayyubids completely bypassed Damascus, rush it, try to take it as soon as possible. If not, try to get Edessa (al-Ruda in this version, if not, don't worry too much about it). I always wait before fighting the Ayyubids until I have a good moment to do so. I usually try and attacking them when Makuria is making good progress against them or when the Romans attack Alexandria (it happens frequently). This way, their armies are busy elsewhere and also weakened. Your field army should be able to handle whatever the Ayyubids can muster. I usually have a general, four units of Hospitaller knights (though Templars work, too; I'm just biased

), three units of Templar spearmen, two units of poulain men-at-arms, two units of Latin halberdiers, two units of Levantine crossbowmen (switch to Latin crossbowmen once you can), two units of Turkopoles, two units of Poulain lancers/Hospitaller sergeants, and finally two units of whatever you prefer (dismounted knights, more turkopoles, Norman knights/other knights, turkopole archers, etc. whatever fits your play style). If you can, build up your economy while you wait, since you have access to most of these units from the beginning.
And remember, spies and watchtowers are your best friends: use them often.
Hope this helps!

P.S: try to use Guy as your main general, since in the next couple of releases the BC team may implement a succession script. You are going to want to have a strong faction heir to minimize the impact of unruly generals

**dane323** · October 21, 2012, 05:12 PM

Thanks very much for the suggestion rob if all else fails ill revert to the save game that I made before declaring war. How do you maintain a large positive cash flow with knight (its more than 4k for dirt roads!)s having such large upkeep and buildings costing so much

**Robert Guiscard** · October 21, 2012, 07:54 PM

Originally Posted by dane323

Thanks very much for the suggestion rob if all else fails ill revert to the save game that I made before declaring war. How do you maintain a large positive cash flow with knight (its more than 4k for dirt roads!)s having such large upkeep and buildings costing so much

I take Antioch. That city alone should be enough to immensely reverse your economy (but taking Ba'albek and the other Levantine settlements will help, too) and it will provide Armored Sergeants (if you want to make a purely Levantine and Latin army without using order units) to your army. Do not sack any cities!! It will lower your reputation and make it more difficult to conduct diplomatic missions.
You also have the option of disbanding your army at the beginning and focusing on turtling for the first number of turns (but then Armenia will take EVERYTHING, including Antioch and Aleppo, and its just not fun being peaceful in a TW game

)

**dane323** · October 21, 2012, 05:47 PM

I had to revert to the save game before the war because they brought up two fill stacks from nowhere. I decided to become a vassal of the abbuyods for the time being and later on when I'm stronger ill get them

**nein** · October 21, 2012, 09:24 PM

You are playing the latest version? The ayyubids are pretty dangerous in 2.3.2... the best bet is to use your cavalry to blitzkrieg every rebel settlement in the levant. Only problem is that the ayyubids are hardwired to assault damascus, however they have a weird bug. The stack positioned near damascus can attack in the same turn it lays siege, despite having no siege equipment

You can withdraw from this siege and it stops them attacking... however they will still be at war with you.

Similar to the seljuks attacking the ERE near the start, this makes the game alot more difficult as you are denied breathing space to develop the economy and your military infrastructure. Good advice for an early full stack is to focus on medium units, with a couple of lancers to attack their rear. This is cost effective as you cannot afford to use the smaller elite units in the early part of your campaign. I would recommend taking everything BUT damascus on a next playthrough, hopefully then you will get time to develop the economy (focus on antioch it is by far the wealthiest region). Get an alliance and trade rights with the hayastan armenians first... then go on a rampage, sacking the levantine rebel settlements. Afterwards disband expensive elites and focus on economy, praying that the ayyubids do not give you

until you are good and ready

**dane323** · October 22, 2012, 02:37 AM

thanks guys! how do i post a picture so i can show you the progress ive made? Ive moved up around armenia into anatolia fighting the turks because as i said im now saladins vassal....i have antioch and all the other rebel settlements in the levant as well.

**nein** · October 22, 2012, 05:05 PM

I think all you need to do is hit print screen

whats it like being a vassal? What effects does it have?

**Robert Guiscard** · October 22, 2012, 06:40 PM

In my experience, being a vassal does nothing for you other than you will always have an "ally." But in reality, they will backstab you or just leave the alliance the moment they get the chance. I usually never accept vassalage (perhaps its my American pride) and force peace along my own terms
@dane323: use your current status to your advantage: build up your forces so you can eventually break free of Ayyubid rule, since you are going to need to eliminate them if you want to win the campaign

**nein** · October 22, 2012, 09:50 PM

Weird I thought vassalship would enslave you in some way...

**Robert Guiscard** · October 22, 2012, 11:07 PM

Originally Posted by nein

Weird I thought vassalship would enslave you in some way...

In a way, it does because, technically, you shouldn't go to war with other allies of your "liege lord" or else your alliance will break, but it functions as any other alliance except for the fact that your overlord gets to count your settlements into their settlement count. So, in a way, its making your former enemy "stronger." That is one reason I don't do it. And it is near impossible to force someone else into vassalage (I heard you can only do it if they have one settlement and you are the supreme power)

**dane323** · October 23, 2012, 04:32 AM

yea to me there is no indication that im giving them money or anything like that. ill have to bide my time with them because they are currently the number one military power in the game.....