9 of 10 Scots 'living off state's patronage'

[Irishman]

Here is an interesting story of the Scottish reliance on public services.

It seems to me to be an increasing trend around the world of purchasing votes with additional services or government provided benefits. Though the denigration of the comments by calling this a "Mitt Romney" moment, there DOES seem to be a problem both with sustainability and with corrupting forces with so many households consuming more than they produce. Do you think this poses a stability problem for the government, and even further, do you think it unfair to recognize that in some real sense, many people are not contributing to the betterment of the state?

[Phier]

It will come to a violent head 2030-2050. Money will run out.

[I WUB PUGS]

It will come to a violent head 2030-2050. Money will run out.

Oh no, Americans and Europeans are too advanced to revolt against a system built to fail.

Don't make too much money, someone else is gonna want it at some point.

The Scottish economy, no, the British economy as a whole hasn't evolved. Too few fields to work in. Surely not everyone in Scotland can work on an oil rig and not everyone in England can be a banker.

Perhaps the rise of the tech industry in Britain can help these people, but they must seek to gain those skills first. No one can make them learn a useful trade.

Neds right? Danny and Poach have informed me that Neds are a big problem and only getting worse.

[Phier]

Oh no, Americans and Europeans are too advanced to revolt against a system built to fail.

The amazing thing being there are actually people that believe this.

Maybe if the great contributors to society werent busy buying their third home on St Barth after squeezing that next efficiency level out of their sweatshoppers, the people back home would not be reliant on a state that allowed it all to happen.

For example there are many people who just blame others, without any real thought into if this is a valid reason, just because thats their default mental position. The people themselves are never at fault in their eyes.

[Shaun]

Perhaps the rise of the tech industry in Britain can help these people, but they must seek to gain those skills first. No one can make them learn a useful trade.

The problem is that there are increasingly fewer opportunities for youngsters to learn a useful trade. The British model seems to be to try and get as much people as possible to university so they can get a services sector job, and there isn't much thought towards anything else.

[Phier]

The problem is that there are increasingly fewer opportunities for youngsters to learn a useful trade. The British model seems to be to try and get as much people as possible to university so they can get a services sector job, and there isn't much thought towards anything else.

So who does the trade jobs?

[Shaun]

So who does the trade jobs?

Very few people, which probably explains the rates they can get away with charging! I think we import a lot from Eastern Europe, too.

[Thorn777]

It will come to a violent head 2030-2050. Money will run out.

Not really. There will be plentyfull money on the jet-set locations around the planet.

Being wealthy and dependent on the state you where born in is so petit riche.

The amazing thing being there are actually people that believe this.



For example there are many people who just blame others, without any real thought into if this is a valid reason, just because thats their default mental position. The people themselves are never at fault in their eyes.

Well there certainly is people that qualify for that stigma, but 9/10 of a population sure seems to prove you wrong. Seems more like something structural happening to a population, instead of millions of little rational actors deciding the poverty level is where they like to settle.

[Thorn777]

Because living on the dole spells so much fun.

Maybe if the great contributors to society werent busy buying their third home on St Barth after squeezing that next efficiency level out of their sweatshoppers, the people back home would not be reliant on a state that allowed it all to happen.

[Lord Baratheon]

Because living on the dole spells so much fun.

.

It really does,I see it every day where I live in the U.K.The culture of entitlement can not go on.Complain about 'the rich' all day but these are the people who do pay the taxes,who do bring in the money.Most of the rich and especially the middle class are actually self made people.All this dependance will come back to haunt Scotland later.The left often says that the right give tax cuts to their rich friends(is it right people were once taxed 80%,only sensible to reduce them),but the left, do they not buy votes by giving out welfare?

[xcorps]

It really does,I see it every day where I live in the U.K.The culture of entitlement can not go on.Complain about 'the rich' all day but these are the people who do pay the taxes,who do bring in the money.Most of the rich and especially the middle class are actually self made people.All this dependance will come back to haunt Scotland later.The left often says that the right give tax cuts to their rich friends(is it right people were once taxed 80%,only sensible to reduce them),but the left, do they not buy votes by giving out welfare?

Shhh. Someone is going to accuse you of hating the poor.

[I WUB PUGS]

April 29, 1992

Perhaps justified in it's origins, not so much in it's execution. Can't happen again or spread though right?

[Pielstick]

It's been mentioned in the last few days that around half the UK population take more than they contribute from the public purse. That's quite interesting.

The problem is we have an entitlement culture in this country and modern British society is almost devoid of any sense of personal responsibility.

It's a very serious problem and something that will take at least a generation to change. Whether we as a society have the stomach to do something about it is highly questionable.

[Astaroth]

It's been mentioned in the last few days that around half the UK population take more than they contribute from the public purse. That's quite interesting.

But isn't that, well, obvious? If you are poorer you are obviously going to pay less taxes and thus "benefit more" from everything the state provides. And what else would the money be "used on" aside from, well, the people (disregarding the military and bureaucracy costs)?

[Pielstick]

But isn't that, well, obvious? If you are poorer you are obviously going to pay less taxes and thus "benefit more" from everything the state provides. And what else would the money be "used on" aside from, well, the people (disregarding the military and bureaucracy costs)?

What I forgot to mention is the figures mentioned were for the population of working age. It didn't take into account the elderly or children.

I found it rather surprising that the burden of paying for everything lays on a relatively small part of the population. I suppose you're right though - maybe it shouldn't be so surprising after all.

but it may explain why 1/2 of the UK population (is there a source for that figure btw?) may be taking more from the public purse than what they contribute.

I was watching Sky News on BFBS the other night and heard it mentioned. I think it might have been during the press preview, so it was probably referencing a newspaper article.

Is that the problem, is or it because of The fact almost 40% of the UK are past retirement age or children? Our ageing population is the real culprit - lazy, healthcare consuming pensioners are expensive.

My brother's step daughter left secondary school with abysmal GCSE grades. She then went to do a hairdressing course at college - at the taxpayers' expense - which she ended up dropping out of. Not long after at the age of 17 she got pregnant by an absolutely cretinous who has fathered children with four different teenage girls and supports none of them. Despite never having done a day's work in her life or contributing a penny in taxes she went on benefits, got a council flat and everything paid for her. She got a part time job in a care home but quit it after a few weeks because she didn't like it, went back on full benefits. She then wrote to the council asking for a house because the flat was too small for her liking.

When I asked her what made her think she is entitled to all of this - despite never having had a job or paid any taxes, and suggesting that perhaps she should have been a bit more responsible and kept her legs together and not had unprotected sex at such a young age with someone she barely knew - she seemed totally convinced that it was totally acceptable for her to live at the taxpayers' expense.

As someone who actually works for a living, claims nothing from the state and put in over £700 per month in NI and income tax, it makes me rather angry.

This is the kind of thing that makes me say a large part of our population have lost any sense of personal responsibility and have a false sense of entitlement.

[removeduser_487563287433]

My brother's step daughter left secondary school with abysmal GCSE grades. She then went to do a hairdressing course at college - at the taxpayers' expense - which she ended up dropping out of. Not long after at the age of 17 she got pregnant by an absolutely cretinous who has fathered children with four different teenage girls and supports none of them. Despite never having done a day's work in her life or contributing a penny in taxes she went on benefits, got a council flat and everything paid for her. She got a part time job in a care home but quit it after a few weeks because she didn't like it, went back on full benefits. She then wrote to the council asking for a house because the flat was too small for her liking.

When I asked her what made her think she is entitled to all of this - despite never having had a job or paid any taxes, and suggesting that perhaps she should have been a bit more responsible and kept her legs together and not had unprotected sex at such a young age with someone she barely knew - she seemed totally convinced that it was totally acceptable for her to live at the taxpayers' expense.

As someone who actually works for a living, claims nothing from the state and put in over £700 per month in NI and income tax, it makes me rather angry.

This is the kind of thing that makes me say a large part of our population have lost any sense of personal responsibility and have a false sense of entitlement.

Pielstick... when I give you a statistic along the lines of 40% of the British population being out of the work force due to age... I'm not aiming for an anecdotal response. Alright. You got me. There's :wub:s in this country. What does that change to the fact we're dying under the weight of the baby boomers and their entitlement culture?

I know there's money to be saved in the benefit cheat witch hunt. I'm all for it. But it's not the major problem.

[The Last Varangian]

Pielstick... when I give you a statistic along the lines of 40% of the British population being out of the work force due to age... I'm not aiming for an anecdotal response. Alright. You got me. There's :wub:s in this country. What does that change to the fact we're dying under the weight of the baby boomers and their entitlement culture?

I know there's money to be saved in the benefit cheat witch hunt. I'm all for it. But it's not the major problem.

There's even more damn money to be made properly enforcing tax codes, but hell, the wealthy don't need to pay taxes...

[Father Jack]

The richer you are = generally the more tax you pay. The poorer you are = the less tax you pay. So if you start using publicly funded services such as your children having an education, the NHS, the police etc you could theoretically get to a stage whereby you will inevitably end up taking more from the public purse than what you contribute to it. The shortfall is then made up by those paying a higher tax rate because they earn more. This is of course hugely simplified, but it may explain why 1/2 of the UK population (is there a source for that figure btw?) may be taking more from the public purse than what they contribute. Whereas the other half pay a greater amount of tax to fill up the treasury.

Any discussion of benefit scroungers is potentially a bit of a red herring but the Department of Work and Pensions will be releasing statistics for this in November. Lets not forget the number of people who are retired and therefore may end up on the list of those taking more from the public purse than what they contribute despite the fact that many of them may have been large contributers before retirement.

[Kanaric]

Sounds like BS

The amazing thing being there are actually people that believe this.

Well some societies are too docile. The comfort level would have to decrease dramatically. Like i've been to Canada often nobody even cares about politics at all, they are a completely docile people who would need tremendous suffering to revolt unless it involves the results of a hockey game. Its kind of like in Brave New World where the lowest class people, forget what they called, start rioting over stupid but are too dumb and or docile to care about anything real.

[removeduser_487563287433]

Very suspicious figures, not only because they're unsourced, but because this is calculated on how many "public services" you use. How exactly do you define or record that? Anyway, yeah, I'd take this with a massive fist of salt.

It's been mentioned in the last few days that around half the UK population take more than they contribute from the public purse. That's quite interesting.

The problem is we have an entitlement culture in this country and modern British society is almost devoid of any sense of personal responsibility.

It's a very serious problem and something that will take at least a generation to change. Whether we as a society have the stomach to do something about it is highly questionable.

Is that the problem, is or it because of The fact almost 40% of the UK are past retirement age or children? Our ageing population is the real culprit - lazy, healthcare consuming pensioners are expensive.