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    Default Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially



    For sale: a college education for $10,000 or less.


    Texas Gov. Rick Perry is renewing his call for such lower-cost undergraduate degrees, in what he hopes will be the state's signature response to the national problem of rising college tuition and student debt.


    "A $10,000 degree provides an opportunity for students to earn a low-cost, high-quality degree that will get them where they want to go in their careers and their lives," the Republican governor said in a statement last week. The governor has repeatedly urged schools to find ways to teach students more efficiently.


    Ten Texas colleges have responded to the governor's challenge, first made a year ago. Angelo State University, a 7,000-student school in west Texas, announced Wednesday it will offer a $10,000 degree starting next fall. The 10 schools educate more than 50,000 students, or roughly 10% of the undergraduates at public universities in the state, but don't include the state's flagship public universities, such as the University of Texas at Austin.


    As details of the colleges' plans have emerged, so have skeptics who question the financial and academic viability of pricing college at a fraction of the roughly $30,000 that students at Texas public universities pay on average over four years. They say reaching the $10,000 goal in some cases involves big scholarships for select students rather than real reductions in the cost of providing an education, and thus the path to a low-cost degree still isn't open to large numbers of students.


    Taylor Ball, a graduate student in education at Angelo State, said the school's reduced-rate degree doesn't cover many significant costs, including campus housing, meal plans and textbooks. "It's those other fees that really get you," she said.







    Mr. Perry's plan comes at a time when tuition is soaring; undergraduate costs at public four-year universities climbed 139% between 1990 and 2010, according to the nonprofit College Board.



    For the 2011-12 academic year, average tuition and fees across the nation were $8,244 at a four-year public university and $28,500 at a private institution, the College Board said.


    Driving recent price increases are cuts in appropriations for higher education by states as they struggle to balance their budgets. Between 2006 and 2011 state governments appropriated 12.5% less per student, according to a March report by the State Higher Education Officers.


    One result is that students are taking on increasing amounts of education-related debt. Americans owed $904 billion in student loans at the end of March, nearly 8% more than a year ago, according to the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. That compares with the $679 billion they owed on credit cards at the end of the first quarter.


    A handful of public and private schools have experimented with ways to reduce costs. The University of the South in Tennessee cut tuition by 10% two years ago. That same year, Seton Hall University, a private school in New Jersey, cut tuition 68% for certain top students to match the in-state rate for Rutgers University, a nearby public school.



    In Texas, the University of Texas at Arlington introduced a $10,000-degree track that will credit classes students take in high school and at a local community college, and incorporate a $10,000 scholarship to qualifying students.


    Texas A&M University-Commerce, near Dallas, will offer a $10,000 degree in "organizational leadership" that will award some course credits to students as soon as they have demonstrated competency in a subject, such as accounting, by passing an exam—a potentially quicker route to a degree than the usual method of awarding credits only after students have spent a certain amount of time in class.


    To offer its new $9,974 degree, starting next year, Angelo State will increase class sizes, offer courses online and will incorporate a $5,000 annual scholarship for participating students. To qualify, students must have relatively high standardized test scores and maintain a grade point average of 3.5 or better.


    The program is designed for mature students, such as those with work experience who are prepared to be focused in their pursuit of a degree, said Angelo State President Joseph Rallo, who notes that younger students often take relatively light course loads and struggle to complete their degrees in four years.


    The push for lower-cost degrees has generated widespread concern among Texas professors, who say they fear schools are sacrificing quality by seeking savings, for instance by increasing the use of adjunct professors.
    Adjunct faculty often are paid on a per-class basis and have to teach heavy loads just to earn a modest living, leaving them little time to advise and guide student outside the classroom, said Ann McGlashan, a Baylor University professor who heads the Texas chapter of the American Association of University Professors.


    Thomas Lindsay, an education expert at the Texas Public Policy Foundation, a conservative think tank in Austin, said critiques of low-cost degrees miss the broader significance—that colleges, for the first time, are broadly thinking of ways to lower their costs.


    "The governor has incentivized the sort of creativity on the part of schools that it is going to take to address the college affordability problem," he said.
    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...googlenews_wsj

    It seems like an applaudable effort at least on the governor's part (and perhaps one of the few proposals he's ever put forward that doesn't immediately put his intelligence under scrutiny), but I don't think it does anything to address the cause of one of the country's most severe inflation problems.

    In my case, I have been unable to attend college at all due to the financial implausibility of doing so. It baffles my bosses at my low-wage jobs how hard it is for people my age to gain any hold into getting an undergrad degree of any sort. Not a single one of my siblings has a college degree. We have pundits on both size who point fingers in different directions as to the cause of inflation - but who is more right? Just why the hell is tuition so goddamned out of control and why is a college education so unattainable these days? Student loan programs are an absolute scam (unless they are federal) and grants have been more and more out of reach. Scholarships don't go near covering the full cost of tuition and fees. What can we really do to fix education?

    Even in the article itself, the skeptics claim that it will be a very selective, back patting program of mostly scholarships at select universities for specific degrees and UT at Austin won't even consider participating.
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  2. #2
    torongill's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    One reason might be the fact that you could get a 200 k loan by providing the loaner with evidence that you have a pulse. With so many people taking loans, it was just stupid to think universities and colleges wouldn't get on the train and raise costs. After all, you can afford it, right? You can take a loan and you can pay it off with the awesome salary of the awesome job you'll have once you're out of college. At least that was the idea. If you think about it, the economy was booming in the late 90s and at least until 2004-2005 nobody was seeing any rocks or dark clouds on the horizon.

    How can you fix the education? First you need to fix the mentality of the people. If hard studying and hard work and good grades are made an example to follow, instead of being ridiculed as nerdiness you'll be on the right track. Second, make state colleges and universities competitive again. Level the field. Create incentives for companies that hire state college graduates on all levels. Lure professors and educators to state colleges and advertize that. Stress and stress again that in college you have to study hard and you have to motivate yourself to do better.

    But I'm not sure whether that can be done, because it will require a change of mentality and that can be done only by adversity.
    Last edited by torongill; October 09, 2012 at 05:47 AM.
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  3. #3

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Hell I even remember when the 2008 Presidential Election first started up in 2007 and many Republicans were asked how the economy was doing and they all said "The economy is doing fine right now." Yet, I did see some people trying to forewarn that we're headed for disaster - Ron Paul being one of them as I was a Paul supporter then. And then everyone hated me my concerns turned out to be validated.
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  4. #4

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    IF standards can be maintained (and that is the key) then good idea, fair play.

  5. #5
    MathiasOfAthens's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    $10,000 is a lot of money and not everyone can just get a ing loan.

    The US education system is . The schools are great but the system is .

    Education should be "free", paid for by taxes.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens View Post
    $10,000 is a lot of money and not everyone can just get a ing loan.

    The US education system is . The schools are great but the system is .

    Education should be "free", paid for by taxes.

    This is a ok plan for the situation as stands. Maybe you should go for something like we have, you DO pay your costs back, but not until you are earning above average wages. Free would be great, but some things gotta give, and student loans is one area where it can, without causing that much harm.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens View Post
    $10,000 is a lot of money and not everyone can just get a ing loan.

    The US education system is . The schools are great but the system is .

    Education should be "free", paid for by taxes.
    If one can't figure out how to get 10k for school, perhaps its best they stick to digging those ditches, the world needs ditch diggers too.

    People get a free education until they are 18. Really the issue is that too many people are getting useless degrees, not the other way around.
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    King Gambrinus's Avatar Primicerius
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by Phier View Post
    If one can't figure out how to get 10k for school, perhaps its best they stick to digging those ditches, the world needs ditch diggers too.

    People get a free education until they are 18. Really the issue is that too many people are getting useless degrees, not the other way around.
    How did you get your 10k?
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  9. #9

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by The Illusionist View Post
    How did you get your 10k?
    I filled out a form. What about you?

    Getting funding for an education that will (ostensibly) lead to a well paying career is the easiest damn thing in the world to get funding for as it's all but a guaranteed payday for the loaner(government or otherwise). As has been stated, people get crap degrees.
    Last edited by Gaidin; October 09, 2012 at 04:33 PM.
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  10. #10

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by The Illusionist View Post
    How did you get your 10k?
    I got 30k by singing a line on a standard form provided by my University.

    Its not like you need to earn it in cash first.
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    Axeman's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by Phier View Post
    I got 30k by singing a line on a standard form provided by my University.

    Its not like you need to earn it in cash first.
    It does vary widely between states though.

    My first two years in College before I transfered were entirely paid for by the state through a scholarship funded by the state *X GPA gets you X amount. 2.75 was minimum, I heard they raised that though*, 3.75 was the one I received*. Nevada paid for that scholarship because you had sane people running the state government. Then you have grants from the university that pay for certain majors plus FAFSA, which just gives out educational money like candy. I ended up getting $900 per semester after paying tuition, university fees for stuff I never used, and books for 5 classes. This is a bit ridiculous considering I could have gone out and spent it on hookers and blow.

    The problem is giving out loans like candy and not tieing money received to academic major or previous success.

    I had to take an art class because of the requirements set forth by the University, and I ended up sitting in an "art studio" drawing fruit for 3 hours a day 2 days a week, and it came out to around $600. A fine product of inflationary loans if I ever saw one. Not to mention that is what art majors are paying for, makes me quite sad.

    The world has enough women's studies and art majors, stop giving money to those students.

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  12. #12
    MathiasOfAthens's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    At least basic community level schooling should be public funding. In CA the state heavily invests in community schools so the costs are quite low. Extremely low, compared to other schools in other states.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens View Post
    At least basic community level schooling should be public funding. In CA the state heavily invests in community schools so the costs are quite low. Extremely low, compared to other schools in other states.

    is that like our Open University? Part time courses over several years?

    If so we have the same deal, £30k (roughly) in tuitions loans spread over the length of the course, but the loans are made by The Student Loans Company, a government agency (sort of) that only charges inflation as interest, and you only repay when earning a decent wage. They only get about 90% of the money back apparently, but it keeps education 'free' in that no one is barred for not being able to afford it.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens View Post
    At least basic community level schooling should be public funding. In CA the state heavily invests in community schools so the costs are quite low. Extremely low, compared to other schools in other states.
    I can agree to more public funding for community colleges and make it available for really low cost - like $100 a class or something like that. Certainly not free college education for all because then college degrees become useless for getting a real job. But something needs to be done about tuition like price capping, anything. Everyone should at least have the opportunity for access to an Associates Degree. Or a technical certification in a certain job field. (This would be insanely helpful) High school education jobs simply do not provide livable wages anymore and we need to adapt to the times.


    Quote Originally Posted by Illusionist
    Do Texans realise they have a mentally challenged governor?
    Yes. I honestly don't know a single person, not even my Bushite parents, that ever voted for him. Only reason he's been governor so long is because the Texas GOP has a fantastic monopolization political machine and has no effective opposition.


    Quote Originally Posted by Phier
    If one can't figure out how to get 10k for school, perhaps its best they stick to digging those ditches, the world needs ditch diggers too.
    Not true. It's not the same as it was 20 years ago. I've been trying for four years to get into school and state level loans are all dried up for 18 months in advance. Pell grants count your parent's taxable income against you until you are 24, regardless of if you live with them or not (which I haven't in two years). Federal level loans are getting harder to come by as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by I WUB PUGS
    Meanwhile in realityville:

    $2,000 for small electronics assembly and repair certification at my local tech school? Starting pay $40,000 base. Thank you very much, I think I will take this option. Is it monotonous? Oh very much so, but the "blue collar non-academic" is enjoying his/her life without crushing debt and is instead buying toys and enjoying his/her weekend without bill collectors calling.
    That's exactly what I'm doing. I'm going for the CompTIA IT certifications so I can get a jump into the IT field. It's cheaper and it yields results much quicker than getting an Associate's Degree.
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    Federal level loans are getting harder to come by as well.
    How come I had such an easy time? Say this about Grants, fine. Loans, you have to refuse a loan for it to be difficult to receive.
    Last edited by Gaidin; October 09, 2012 at 08:01 PM.
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  16. #16

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by Gaidin View Post
    How come I had such an easy time? Say this about Grants, fine. Loans, you have to refuse a loan for it to be difficult to receive.
    I don't know you, your family's income situation, what state you live in, etc so I couldn't possibly tell ya.

    Quote Originally Posted by motiv-8
    No ? If that's the case, things are not the same as they were 5 years ago, to say nothing of 20. I had absolutely no problem getting money for college and most of it was paid through Pell grants rather than Stafford loans.

    I think I'm having an unnatural senior moment. Was Perry the guy who said "Obama wants all Americans to go to college -- what a snob." or was it a different guy?
    Yeah, I found this stuff out while I was still in high school even. I graduated there in '07. They told me "Your father's income is too high to qualify for a Pell grant. You sure you're dad can't cover your expenses?" I laughed in her face. My dad despite having high income is forced to live very frugally because he has to support the rest of my family who are all struggling. All he was able to cover was the $600 CompTIA A+ classes I'm taking that I just qualified for when I moved to Austin. They have no such classes in the San Antonio area. Anyway, I asked what if I move out and file my own taxes as independent and she said very flatly that it doesn't matter. You are considered a dependent by this program until you are 24 regardless. ing horse- I tell you man. I grew up in the wrong generation. So I've been struggling with these low-wage jobs since high school because I can't get the kind of help that would realistically cover the expenses. Scholarships just ain't enough. The Stafford loans I won't even bother going into because of the level of BS they gave me when I applied.


    And that was Rick Santorum who said that.
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  17. #17

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    Quote Originally Posted by Future Filmmaker View Post
    I don't know you, your family's income situation, what state you live in, etc so I couldn't possibly tell ya.
    I qualify for the "cost of living" in loans which is 20k for my area, and i get about zero help from my parents, and am a full time student. And when my parents were accounted for I got zero help from them because they couldn't afford it. Guess what. I took out a loan. Things haven't changed in my 8th year of college loans from my 1st year of college loans. Except that the interest rates for the federal loans that are supposedly hard to get have gone down since they cut out the middle man banks. That changed.
    Last edited by Gaidin; October 09, 2012 at 08:19 PM.
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  18. #18
    MathiasOfAthens's Avatar Comes Rei Militaris
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    The community colleges in CA just charge some of the lowest fees for classes, there are state grants you can get as well or have the state pay for a semester or two of your school but generally the costs are lower and I wager they are lower because the state pays into the system to reduce the costs. Its a win-win.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    This isn't a bad plan.
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  20. #20
    jsktrogdor's Avatar Protector Domesticus
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    Default Re: Gov. Perry Proposes $10,000 Degree Program - Tuition Continues to Rise Exponentially

    I dont understand the point of this program? People can just ask their parents for tuition money.


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