Advice on Mid-High Range PC

[Ahiga]

This is right now the options I am looking at for the mid-high PC. We'll buy it, then I'll give it to my brother (whose got a 3-4 year old horrible system) when Conroe comes out, and we'll prepare a system with Conroe.

I know I made a topic earlier, but for my own PC I am holding back on a purchase until Conroe is released. In the mean time, I'm putting together a PC that I will use and then hand to my brother (He's a gamer but not as hardcore as me, and does need an upgrade). It will be mid to high, instead of ultra-high as was currently aimed for. The price range I'm looking at is a limit of 2300, without monitor, speakers, mouse and keyboard. I want it to be able to run oblivion with AA and HDR, though it doesn't have to be an extreme amount. Something that will be able to run games that are comming out on middle or high graphics. Cooling is a biggie. I want to make sure the case and fans are powerful enough to keep it from overheating. That's a big question. Are the fans good fans and the case a good case for cooling?

Case: Thermaltake Soprano ATX Mid Tower Case w/Clear Side Window No PS Black (VB1000BWS) - Three fans in the case sounds good. Rest of the details seem right, but is there a better option to consider if I want more cooling or room? http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merch...ct_Code=100551
Power Supply: Either Antec True Power 2 550 SLI ATX 2.01 550W Power Supply OR Thermaltake Toughpower W0103RU ATX 2.2/EPS 600W SLI Power Supply w/PFC (Mirror Finish) - Which would be a better purchase, given I may do SLI?

Case Fan: Thermaltake 120X120X25mm Case Fan Ball Bearing or Antec 80mm SmartCool Case Fan (761345-75008-0) or Antec 80mm Case Fan Quiet Fan 2600 RPM - Why is the 120x120 one cheaper, when it has a faster airflow?

Motherboard: Still going AMD since the later PC will be Conroe. Asus M2N32-SLI Deluxe nF 590 Wireless Ed. Audio/GBLAN/IEEE1394a/PCIE/SATA3G/DDR2/ATX 64 (Socket AM2) - There is another named Abit Fatal1ty AN9 32X nF 590 SLI Audio/GB-LAN/IEEE-1394a/PCI-E/SATA3G/DDR2/RoHS/ATX 64 (Socket AM2) Ten dollars cheaper. Is there a reason? I think I'd just go with Asus but the only thing I could tell is that Asus has more expansion PCI-E slots.

CPU: Going to get back to you on this. May be an issue, but right now it will either be FX-62 dual core 1MB per core (Socket AM2) or an AMD Athlon 64 X2 +4600 Dual core 512k per core (The problem is that the +5000s are out of stock). Would going with a Athlon 64 X2 4600+ Dual core 512k Per core 90nm (SocketAM2) be a dramatic leap back, or is it not too far from the top of the line AMD's out there? Basically, is it Ultra high, high, or medium?

Memory: I was told a gamer doesn't need more than 1 gig right now. I'm not so sure about that, but I can go with 1 gig of Corsair (I can't go with 2 gigs of the RAM speed I wanted) and just get another stick later on. Is Corsair the best bet? My problem is that all the RAM listed by Monarch really doesnt' seem that powerful in CAS latency and Bandwith, which I was told are the things I should look for in RAM (Low CAS, high Bandwith). This card:
CORSAIR XMS2 1GB (2 x 512MB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM Unbuffered DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) has too high a CAS (5) compared to the best RAM offered in the hardware guide topic here (Which was 3, I think). They seem weak on RAM and I think I want to call them and see what I can do. Maybe just go with low ram then immedieantly get a major upgrade for it.

Should I go for DDR2 (800) 6400 - 2 GB (2pcs 1 GB) Patriot (PDC22G6400LLK) if I don't go foward with that waiting?

hard Drive: Western Digital Caviar RE2 400 GB SATA 16MB Cache 7200 RPM (WD4000YR) Might go with another 120 GB

Video card: Asus GeForce 7900 GTX 512MB DDR3/PCI-E/HDTV-Out/Dual-DVI (Retail Box) - The other option would be the Radeon X1900XTX. Does that (The X1900XTX)
A) Not work with an SLI system, even if it's the only card
B) Seem better than the 7900 GTX
C) Heard SLI is not really needed unless you have a wide screen monitor (Doubt I will upgrade to it), and if I needed the boost of running SLI I'd be better off with a new card rather than buying another of the presumably older videocard. Would I really need SLI to run future games like MTWII on high graphics with a rig like this? Or one one 7900GTX 512 MB or X1900XTX 512 MB be able to do that?

Sound card Creative Labs X-FI Xtreme Music 7.1 24-bit sound card - I need something to run 7.1, I heard creative labs isn't that good but it's the only option besides omitting any card. Considering my current speakers are still creative and I'll be using them with this PC, I might as well go with creative, or am I wrong?


All in all, how does this system sound? What should I think about fixing, and is there any instance where I could perhaps downgrade a little and maintain a high level system (In case this is ultra high, which I don't really need: Just a system to run Oblivion on max or near max, and future games of 2006 and early 2007 on full graphics)

[Timmius]

This is right now the options I am looking at for the mid-high PC. We'll buy it, then I'll give it to my brother (whose got a 3-4 year old horrible system) when Conroe comes out, and we'll prepare a system with Conroe.

I know I made a topic earlier, but for my own PC I am holding back on a purchase until Conroe is released. In the mean time, I'm putting together a PC that I will use and then hand to my brother (He's a gamer but not as hardcore as me, and does need an upgrade). It will be mid to high, instead of ultra-high as was currently aimed for. The price range I'm looking at is a limit of 2300, without monitor, speakers, mouse and keyboard. I want it to be able to run oblivion with AA and HDR, though it doesn't have to be an extreme amount. Something that will be able to run games that are comming out on middle or high graphics. Cooling is a biggie. I want to make sure the case and fans are powerful enough to keep it from overheating. That's a big question. Are the fans good fans and the case a good case for cooling?

Case: Thermaltake Soprano ATX Mid Tower Case w/Clear Side Window No PS Black (VB1000BWS) - Three fans in the case sounds good. Rest of the details seem right, but is there a better option to consider if I want more cooling or room? http://www.monarchcomputer.com/Merch...ct_Code=100551
Power Supply: Either Antec True Power 2 550 SLI ATX 2.01 550W Power Supply OR Thermaltake Toughpower W0103RU ATX 2.2/EPS 600W SLI Power Supply w/PFC (Mirror Finish) - Which would be a better purchase, given I may do SLI?

Case Fan: Thermaltake 120X120X25mm Case Fan Ball Bearing or Antec 80mm SmartCool Case Fan (761345-75008-0) or Antec 80mm Case Fan Quiet Fan 2600 RPM - Why is the 120x120 one cheaper, when it has a faster airflow?

Could be many reasons why it's cheaper, like maybe noise generation. But what I'm wondering if why you want to choose between 120mm and 80mm. Isn't that simply a matter of what fits where?
And get a proper fancontroller. Saves you a lot of noise

Motherboard: Still going AMD since the later PC will be Conroe. Asus M2N32-SLI Deluxe nF 590 Wireless Ed. Audio/GBLAN/IEEE1394a/PCIE/SATA3G/DDR2/ATX 64 (Socket AM2) - There is another named Abit Fatal1ty AN9 32X nF 590 SLI Audio/GB-LAN/IEEE-1394a/PCI-E/SATA3G/DDR2/RoHS/ATX 64 (Socket AM2) Ten dollars cheaper. Is there a reason? I think I'd just go with Asus but the only thing I could tell is that Asus has more expansion PCI-E slots.

Maybe you could take a look at this one. -click-
A bit cheaper, and still enough for your needs.

CPU: Going to get back to you on this. May be an issue, but right now it will either be FX-62 dual core 1MB per core (Socket AM2) or an AMD Athlon 64 X2 +4600 Dual core 512k per core (The problem is that the +5000s are out of stock). Would going with a Athlon 64 X2 4600+ Dual core 512k Per core 90nm (SocketAM2) be a dramatic leap back, or is it not too far from the top of the line AMD's out there? Basically, is it Ultra high, high, or medium?

An FX processor is highly overpriced if you ask me. An X2 +4600 is at least half the price. And with a bit of overclocking you should be able to get near to FX-62 performance.

Memory: I was told a gamer doesn't need more than 1 gig right now. I'm not so sure about that, but I can go with 1 gig of Corsair (I can't go with 2 gigs of the RAM speed I wanted) and just get another stick later on. Is Corsair the best bet? My problem is that all the RAM listed by Monarch really doesnt' seem that powerful in CAS latency and Bandwith, which I was told are the things I should look for in RAM (Low CAS, high Bandwith). This card:
CORSAIR XMS2 1GB (2 x 512MB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM Unbuffered DDR2 800 (PC2 6400) has too high a CAS (5) compared to the best RAM offered in the hardware guide topic here (Which was 3, I think). They seem weak on RAM and I think I want to call them and see what I can do. Maybe just go with low ram then immedieantly get a major upgrade for it.

Should I go for DDR2 (800) 6400 - 2 GB (2pcs 1 GB) Patriot (PDC22G6400LLK) if I don't go foward with that waiting?

All DDR2 RAM has that high latency. It's normal, so the RAM you've chosen is good

hard Drive: Western Digital Caviar RE2 400 GB SATA 16MB Cache 7200 RPM (WD4000YR) Might go with another 120 GB

I would definately get a raptor. Leave the FX-62 and with that money get an extra raptor. It's noticably faster than a normal HD.

Video card: Asus GeForce 7900 GTX 512MB DDR3/PCI-E/HDTV-Out/Dual-DVI (Retail Box) - The other option would be the Radeon X1900XTX. Does that (The X1900XTX)
A) Not work with an SLI system, even if it's the only card
B) Seem better than the 7900 GTX
C) Heard SLI is not really needed unless you have a wide screen monitor (Doubt I will upgrade to it), and if I needed the boost of running SLI I'd be better off with a new card rather than buying another of the presumably older videocard. Would I really need SLI to run future games like MTWII on high graphics with a rig like this? Or one one 7900GTX 512 MB or X1900XTX 512 MB be able to do that?

Personally I think buying a 7900GTX is silly. It's exactly like the 7900GT, only with a bit higher clockspeed. Most GT's can easily achieve the same speeds.

Sound card Creative Labs X-FI Xtreme Music 7.1 24-bit sound card - I need something to run 7.1, I heard creative labs isn't that good but it's the only option besides omitting any card. Considering my current speakers are still creative and I'll be using them with this PC, I might as well go with creative, or am I wrong?

The X-fi is currently the best gamers soundcard there is. So no going wrong there. But do be sure you have some nice speakers to back it up though.

All in all, how does this system sound? What should I think about fixing, and is there any instance where I could perhaps downgrade a little and maintain a high level system (In case this is ultra high, which I don't really need: Just a system to run Oblivion on max or near max, and future games of 2006 and early 2007 on full graphics)

It's a very decent system. Especially when you follow up my advise

[westy159]

About the RAM

While 1GB is the reccomended amount for gamers right now, games are benefiting greatly from 2 gigs (BF2 came out last year and the loading speed is reduced by a few minutes by having another gig). To be more future proof Id say buy 1 gig now and get another piece soon after, but dont go for a 4 x 512mb setup!

[Ahiga]

Hmm, I might go with the Patriot Dual channel one I listed them, it's 2 gigs from 2 1 gig cards.

I should mention that I am not putting together this PC myself but rather using Monarch to put it together. The links I just opted on using were newegg as they have more details on the tech. Timmius, I think I'm going to go for the Radeon for now because I've gotten confirmation that any Nvidia card will not work with HDR + aa at the same time in Oblivion as well as some up and comming games. Do you think this will be able to run Oblivion on Max, as well as other games?

I'm told I should go for crossfire, but I cannot seem to get a crossfire system to run with Am2 socket - I'd need to downgrade to either an Intel comparison (Not conroe) or a 939 pin, and I'd not want to do the latter or the former unless there's an Intel that matches the second (+5000) or third (+4600) highest AMD.
The RAM I mentioned, do you mean the patriot or the corsair?

[Timmius]

Hmm, I might go with the Patriot Dual channel one I listed them, it's 2 gigs from 2 1 gig cards.
Timmius, I think I'm going to go for the Radeon for now because I've gotten confirmation that any Nvidia card will not work with HDR + aa at the same time in Oblivion as well as some up and comming games. Do you think this will be able to run Oblivion on Max, as well as other games?

Nothing can run oblivion at maxed out setting atm. Only then your talking about insane resulutions with a lot of AA and FSAA. When we're talking about normal resolitions (1600x1200 for example) I think 2, or even 1, X1900XT should do just fine
For the rest of the games: Everything will run really smooth for at least a year and probably after that too. Depending on what dx10 will do off course.
[quote]

[italiano]

I'd need to downgrade to either an Intel comparison (Not conroe) or a 939 pin, and I'd not want to do the latter or the former unless there's an Intel that matches the second (+5000) or third (+4600) highest AMD

There are 3 conroe chips faster than the fastest AMD, the cheapest of which costs 1/3rd the AMD.