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  1. #1

    Default EB Music Preview

    Greetings Europa Barbarorum fans.


    As briefly seen and mentioned in our previous preview, EB v0.8 will feature new music for our different culture groups. We have replaced *all* the music from the vanilla version of the mod at this point with new music from our composers. For a long time, we have tried to work with composers to create a soundtrack that we thought better reflected what we were doing with the mod as a whole. Many of us still really enjoy the music written for RTW itself and Jeff van Dyck did a wonderful job with that aspect of the game we believe. But we have added so much new material to the mod and we have given entire culture groups so much new material that it seems a shame to force them to share one of three basic themes: "roman" "barbarian" and "eastern"). Now we have (to generally label them) Roman, Greek, Barbarian, Nomadic, Carthaginian, Eastern, and Eastern Greek cultures. Each culture group has their own graphical user interface (GUI) and their own set of traits and units and buildings (though there is much overlap also in some of those areas). Giving each culture group its own musical style was also something we have long hoped for, but it was something until quite recently that we thought we would probably never achieve. But a few months ago we began a conversation with Morgan Casey that would ultimately lead to a collaberation with her and Nick Wylie whose results we are absolutely ecstatic about.

    Morgan and Nick worked with our historical advisors each step of the way - trying to come up with a soundtrack for each culture group (as well as a few general pieces that would have to serve for all culture groups) that would reflect different aspects of that culture while still remaining enjoyable for modern ears and audiences. If anyone has heard reconstructions of ancient Greek music, they probably understand that a 100% authentic reproduction (even *if* it was able to be achieved, and it probably wouldn't) would simply not work in the context that we needed: that of an accompanying set of themes for a computer game in today's world. As Morgan and Nick primarily work with soundtracks (take a look at their lists of influences on their myspace.com pages and you will notice many modern movie score composers), they used our advisors' suggestions of everything from instruments, to rhythms, to vocal accompaniement to create compositions that work well within the parameters of the game, but still reflect as much as we can different aspects of that culture in the music. As an example, one member recently described the Carthaginian theme's similarities to the different source music and information provided about the culture group in this way (btw, Carthaginian music itself is so difficult to reproduce that music of other similar peoples in the Levant was also heavily considered): "you will recognize a bunch of elements: the simple harmony, the rhythm, the ney-like flute, the qanun-like stringed instrument and even the un-measured section at the end. The thing, I believe, is that the composer (as he has consistently done before, btw) has produced a very successful fusion with more "western" elements, so that the music does not strike an "average listener" as "wierd". But the touches of color and, more importantly, the ethos are there, IMO. Listen to the theme once more, now picture sunset and a long line of dromedaries slowly winding their way down the sand dunes towards a distant oasis (with EB palms of course)."

    This area of the mod finally having come to fruition is something that we are all so very very pleased with that we want to share a little more of it with the fans and free up some songs that Morgan and Nick can place on their websites (before the release of 0.8 - which will include all of the new music). Needless to say, we are really happy for the music composed for us by Morgan Casey & Nick Wylie and we are very happy to suggest that folks out there take a closer look at their other work on their websites and their myspace.com pages too.

    The speed at which they have written new music for us has been amazing also, especially considering our prior situation and how hopeless we thought the situation was. The entire EB team will always be grateful for the excellent music they have produced. It fits so well with what we have been wanting to do with EB on the whole and with what we can expect our players and fans to enjoy in the mod. We wanted to express our thanks openly and give everyone a chance to hear this for yourself! On behalf of EB, thanks again to our composers for adding this crucial element to the mod that we have been hoping for for such a long time.

    Here are some buttons to link to (individually for the songs):


    Roman Music Set:





    Eastern Greek Music Set:




    And to freshen your memories:


    -----------------------------------------------------------------------

    Thanks to Teleklos Archelaou for making the graphics for this preview.

    We hope you have enjoyed this music preview.

    As always, if you have questions or comments, the best place to post them is here, where the EB team is most active:

    Europa Barbarorum ORG forum

    Europa Barbarorum TWC forum

    We give special thanks to Imageshack that provides us with a simple, foolproof, and free way to show you all these pictures each week.

    Have a great day!


    Sincerely,

    The Europa Barbarorum team.
    Last edited by Krusader; July 27, 2006 at 04:57 AM.


  2. #2

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Absolutely amazing, I love the Eastern Greek music.

  3. #3

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    All hail the preview god!
    I shouldn't have to live in a world where all the good points are horrible ones.

    Is he hurt? Everybody asks that. Nobody ever says, 'What a mess! I hope the doctor is not emotionally harmed by having to deal with it.'

  4. #4

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Before I reply, I want to say that the CA composer is actually pretty mediocre in almost all respects, and that these two have created something that is not only miraculously more appropriate, but just a heck of a lot more interesting.

    I don't want to sound ingrateful, but as an enthusiastic student of Pythagoras, Aristoxenus and Ptolemy, I have to take issue at this.

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...694414?ie=UTF8

    I hate to break it to you, but all music is based on the same mathematics (albeit different opinions on their implementation). There is absolutely no need to "modernize " anything. If you think greek music is somehow incomprehensible and boring, you've probably heard a lifeless interpretation of the "Epitaph of Seikilos" performed by slavish positivists. Imagine a rabid germanophile slowly playing the 2nd-clarinet part of the third movement of beethoven's 2nd and saying "this is classical music".

    The greeks left us no "great works", but a relatively substative "theory and practice". Imagine that you've read a book about jazz that has given you a good grasp on jazz chords and guidelines for melody and improvisation, and you have a saxophone, and you set out to play having never heard or seen a note of jazz. That's about where we are with the greeks. If we accept that a positivist attitude won't get us very far, that the hellenic "Ode to Joy" is lost to us, there is a lot we can do that is consistent in spirit. That's one of my absolute favorite CD's up there.

    Also, I think it's really unfortunate that they haven't ventured out of equal temperament (at least in the samples I've heard). Homogenous, logarhythmic intonation was invented for the purpose of free and frequent modulation (to demonstrate the superior intelligence of the Germanic race), and unless you are playing Brahms or Wagner (and their imitators and competitors in the 19th-c rise of nationalism) it is absolutely irrelevant. The problem is that equal-tempered harmonies get boring very, very quickly and you have to have more notes to keep it interesting, can't linger on any chord very long, and even then you usually have to couch everything in lots of sound effects (percussion, dozens of different timbres and timbral combinations) which is the thing I find most distasteful about the modern wave of "atmospheric" electronic composers. Equal temperament ultimately must lead to "timbre-centered" noise-music, which is the 20th-c "avant-garde" nonsense where a man in a black turtleneck slaps a weasel with a wet rope for twenty minutes. I love soundtrack composers, but I wish I could take away their cymbal rolls and their "low-brass blatts".

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...694414?ie=UTF8

    This isn't my favorite Iranian CD, but it contains important elements from a pre-Islamic Zoroastrian tradition, the most striking of which is the occasional use of "neutral" intervals. If you know what "major" and "minor" intervals are, the persians liked to sometimes use a tone somewhere in between (Islamic influences seem to lean more toward a minor mode, but I know less about this). It sounds "weird" to an "average listener", but I for one think it sounds awesome, and there are modern Iranian compositions in the Persian style that are full of vitality -- stuff that you absolutely CAN NOT play on the piano, but you absolutely CAN dance to.

    I also noticed that the nomadic theme used a couple of chinese devices fused with a central-asia feel. I heard some throat-singing used very tentatively in the background, more to remind us of herders than to play a prominent role in the music. Well,

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...694414?ie=UTF8

    Again, don't get me wrong. I understand your desire to rationalize "foreign" music as uncomfortable and unpalatable, and I wish that ethnomusicologists had more time to be videogame composers, but you are cheating yourself if you are under the impression that ancient music and "world music" need a shave and a haircut (and some lederhosen) to be enjoyable.

  5. #5
    Musopticon?'s Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    By Iahve Elohim, that is some awesome work.

    I know quite a few players who will absolutely cream over the Roman musics.

    Will Eastern Greek music be for Bactria and the Successors(mainly Seleucids)?

  6. #6

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    You guys are awsome. I liked the Eastern Hellene music better I think. I just can't wait for the barbarian, eastern, and nomadic music. Heck, I just can't wait for .80!

    Great job guys, keep up the good, no, the great work.


    Dixit ei Iesus ego sum resurrectio et vita qui credit in me et si mortuus fuerit vivet. Et omnis qui vivit et credit in me non morietur in aeternum credis hoc? John XI:XXV, XXVI

  7. #7

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    That eastern hellenic music is for Baktria, Arche Seleukeia, and the Ptolemaioi. That is their culture group.

    I maybe should note here that the Roman group was done by Morgan and the Eastern Hellenic group was done by Nick. I don't guess we came out and said that, but it's obvious from looking at their links.

  8. #8
    Musopticon?'s Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Nick has done great work. This is very different, yet appealing.

    Only thing I'm a little concerned about is that the music may be a bit too dominant on the campaign map. So my question, along with these very dynamic pieces, are there minimalistic background soundscapes(à la Roman campaign music in Vanilla) as well? Maybe with a bit of singing.

  9. #9

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Quote Originally Posted by Musopticon?
    Nick has done great work. This is very different, yet appealing.

    Only thing I'm a little concerned about is that the music may be a bit too dominant on the campaign map. So my question, along with these very dynamic pieces, are there minimalistic background soundscapes(à la Roman campaign music in Vanilla) as well? Maybe with a bit of singing.
    We are trying to force Teleklos to sing for us, but so far the guy has eluded our patro...requests. We will make him sing, one way or another.


  10. #10

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Mus: Some of the other themes are not quite as kinetic as those two. I *really* like Morgan's WesternGreek theme (which has energy but maybe is not quite as dominant I think as these two; just my opinion) and also their collaborative Nomadic Theme (which is quite different from these two), and you will definitely love Nick's Eastern and Carthaginian themes - they are much more subdued and I think just as enjoyable. The barbarian theme is pretty dark and energetic too. We will be mixing some of them together so that the campaign map (and maybe battle map) music isn't just one theme over and over. We can't give a final answer on whether or not any other music might be included at all - we are still in some talks over this.

  11. #11
    Musopticon?'s Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    @Teleklos: Ah, bright will be my morning. It's great to know that. Especially from a fellow Baktria-fan. May I ask one more question? What about win and lose music, will you have those for different culture groups?

    @Krusader:Sneaky bastard, eh?

  12. #12

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Mus: Victory and Defeat music are general for all cultures. We already had so many songs they made for us, there was no way we could squeeze another *14* songs out of them like that! But they were designed to work with all factions too, so it's not like a roman one being forced on all factions. They work well.

  13. #13
    Musopticon?'s Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Right, thanks a lot.

    Arrrr hurrr, me wants barbarian drunken choir for gallic victories!!!

  14. #14

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Wow, I'm having an EB overdose (2 previews in one month: one huge Saka preview and another with 6 music tracks!), which feels so good *makes orgastic sound*. You know what I think of your mod, and this preview only strengthens my opinions.
    "Tempus edax rerum." Ovid, Metamorphoses
    Under the patronage of Virgil.

  15. #15

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    I wanna be sincere.Eb Music looks well but isnt that amazing ,I think best songs and that fits the quality i was expecting is the NOMADIC THEME and ROMAN THEME , the others arent that good spcial mobilize themes are too short and weak,also i dont think Roman battle theme isnt enough energetic and express the eagle roman military machine.
    I think Morgan balance between historical and music nice to hear is better compared to Nick, didnt really like his themes.

    Also maybe they aren´t enough songs for each Culture,we listen 3 for romans how many more will be???? .
    Some vanila music and drums are very hard to beat, its why i suggest to mix Eb themes with really good ones RTW vanila.


    "already had so many songs they made for us, there was no way we could squeeze another *14* songs out of them like that",

    Let the fans choose


    But i wanna salute other mod music : RometotalRealism has amazing music quality , best mod so far concerning music
    Thanks for all and specially to Vlad KuryLuk , he made a superb work and i dont see anyone beating his achievments.
    Last edited by Storm_Kronos; July 20, 2006 at 02:25 PM.

  16. #16

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    I disagree with u , if u put historic 100 % music is boring and no good for its porposes , THIS IS A GAME!!!!!!!!!we need explosive themes also, leave more historic ancient music for campaign map only , for battles we need energy with cultural flavour.

  17. #17

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Holy god that is good stuff!
    The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be used until they try and take it away.
    Staff Officer of Corporal_Hicks in the Legion of Rahl
    Commanding Katrina, Crimson Scythe, drak10687 and Leonidas the Lion

  18. #18

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Storm, do you know what those individual themes are even used for? How the game uses the mobilize theme, how it uses the battle one, how it uses a tension piece (which is general in EB)? They are not all "equal" - they do what they are supposed to do individually. That one variant is "too short" is just absurd - if you know what how the system uses the different music types.

    Though I may regret it, what do you mean "let the fans choose"? The fans didn't compose a soundtrack for us.

    You continually troll this forum - stating false release dates, masquerading as an EB member, and you have been warned over it too before. We should expect no less than you trying to stir up RTR vs. EB stuff here again now. Thanks.

  19. #19

    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Teleklos u may be right , but i dunno how many themes will be in the game , im beeing sincere with my hears and feelings from what i heard till now and i was not amaze with music so far , only Nomadic theme is superb. I dont wanna be not nice with Eb composers .
    I think EB music so far isnt really at the quality EB mod is, i can say for example the RTR Mod Music > RTR mod and EB mod>> EB mod music.
    Of course EB mod is the best so far i i think it should earn better music.
    I would suggest u to heard RTR music themes from 6.0 , 6.1 and gold , The MIghty self, RTR Menu songs are amazing superb and many more.

    If u want to have my opinion i would accept music from all the music fans composers around here and comunity and after pick the best themes and of course with method.

  20. #20
    Musopticon?'s Avatar Tiro
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    Default Re: EB Music Preview

    Yeah, but: everyone else > u

    Go away.

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