Greek tax inspectors besieged in island's police station after detaining restaurant manager-tax evader

[Manuel I Komnenos]

The source is currently Greek, when I find it in English I will post it.

The story: Tax inspectors arrived in the island of Hydra, which is near Attica and began inspecting various businesses. One restaurant owner was caught for tax evasion and was led to the local police station. Many civilians arrived at the scene and blocked the entrance to the police station. The inspectors were forced to remain in the station until the morning, when special police units arrived from Athens to free them. Citizens and various representatives of the Municipality threw accusations against the police and asked "how did they dare to set foot on the island?".

This is just a typical example of tax evasion from the restaurant/bar/store sector. What I want to point out with this thread is that we're being bombarded by the news about how the public servants are responsible for this situation, how lazy and ineffective they are and how much money they do cost to the state. While some of those accusations hold some truth in them, people forget that a public servant's wage is immediately taxed by the state before being given to him. For example, if the wage of a public servant is 1000 euros, he gets like 950 euros and the rest is held by the state. At the same time, restaurants, bars and stores, especially in the various tourist destinations evade taxes in a huge level. In some cases they don't even hand receipts and in others they hide their true income. While the common citizen saw his wage being chopped and the taxes rise, some people still continue to steal and make money. It seems that in some sectors and places there's a whole culture of tax evasion which needs to be battled fiercely.

[NotYetRegistered]

I would like to say ''only in Greece'', but, you know, there have been riots over smaller things.

[Manuel I Komnenos]

I would like to say ''only in Greece'', but, you know, there have been riots over smaller things.

Believe me, that's what many of us said about the incident. Groups of people act like a state within a state. It's absolutely unacceptable.

[boofhead]

Expat Greeks also engage in this sort of thing quite a lot, e.g. wholesale and retail fruiterers in Australia. I guess they bring the attitude from their homeland. To be fair, Greeks aren't the worst.

[Stavroforos]

There can't be respect for the law and for authority in a country where corruption, bureaucracy, and poor government are the norm.

Don't be fooled, Greece isn't a European country, we're basically something more like rural Afghanistan.

[Manuel I Komnenos]

There can't be respect for the law and for authority in a country where corruption, bureaucracy, and poor government are the norm.

Don't be fooled, Greece isn't a European country, we're basically something more like rural Afghanistan.

Why this can't be changed? I mean there are plenty of us who dislike this situation and would like to live in an efficient state where tax evasion is monitored and punished severely.

[Dr. Oza]

There can't be respect for the law and for authority in a country where corruption, bureaucracy, and poor government are the norm.

Don't be fooled, Greece isn't a European country, we're basically something more like rural Afghanistan.

Thats honestly how i felt when i visited Athens, Kos, Kalymnos and Rodos this year. Italy was the same. Fortunately, however, I found civilization in murica' a few months later.

[athanaric]

This attitude towards the state and the common cause isn't limited to Greece, but it seems to be most common there. I wonder whether it comes from 500 years of foreign occupation. I'm also wondering whether these tax evaders are delusional enough to consider themselves patriots (because they are the opposite of that, effectively stealing from their countrymen).
IMO, any foreign country where such people set foot in order to evade taxation should seize their assets and return them to their country of origin.

There can't be respect for the law and for authority in a country where corruption, bureaucracy, and poor government are the norm.

Don't be fooled, Greece isn't a European country, we're basically something more like rural Afghanistan.

And you're gonna change that by being criminal yourself? Great thinking.

[Stavroforos]

And you're gonna change that by being criminal yourself? Great thinking.

I'm not excusing anything, I'm saying that almost everyone in this country is ing stupid. Government, police, military, ordinary people.

[neoptolemos]

I'm not excusing anything, I'm saying that almost everyone in this country is ing stupid. Government, police, military, ordinary people.

Including yourself I suppose Stav.

[Stavroforos]

Including yourself I suppose Stav.

I'm not excluding myself.

[neoptolemos]

I'm not excluding myself.

Good to know.
There is no point moaning then.You are living in the right place.
Too bad that while I am living in UK,I really miss this "stupid" country.

On topic though.
I have argued many times in the past on who is tax-evading in Greece.Businessmen are among the ones who declare less income than they have and avoid or postpone the VAT payments to the state.At least until now....

[Holger Danske]

So what is actually being done to solve this issue? (tax evasion)

[Manuel I Komnenos]

So what is actually being done to solve this issue? (tax evasion)

They are trying to figure which pensions are handed to those who actually paid for that money. We've had cases of islands with 300+ people who earned disability pensions, mostly for blindness while most of them were fine. You see, that's again a case of an island, acting like a state within a state. What I'm trying to point out is that various politicians from those areas, gave plenty of bonuses in return for votes.

Other than that the inspections are supposedly more common. Funnily enough, I went to a cafe-bar in Athens, which is one of the biggest out there (covers almost a whole park). This bar has thousands of customers every day and the drinks' cost starts from 5 euros. They didn't hand a receipt and had to ask for it! And that's one of the ing biggest businesses in Athens.

[AqD]

So what is actually being done to solve this issue? (tax evasion)

I purpose next time they bring the army to collect tax.

[boofhead]

Maybe now is the time for the government to institute a massive TV ad campaign, shaming tax evaders and outlining the part it has played in Greece's economic situation.

They could also name and shame people convicted of it on the news every night.

This sort of thing has worked to change the culture in Australia regarding many things, e.g. smoking, drink driving, drinking, drugs, seatbelts etc etc

[Emperor Arcturus Mengsk]

Maybe now is the time for the government to institute a massive TV ad campaign, shaming tax evaders and outlining the part it has played in Greece's economic situation.

They could also name and shame people convicted of it on the news every night.

This sort of thing has worked to change the culture in Australia regarding many things, e.g. smoking, drink driving, drinking, drugs, seatbelts etc etc

Man.. Dude... that would make even the rocks laugh

The government.... NEA DIMOKRATIA...PASOK...DHMAR... to institute an anticorruption advertisement....

HAHAHHAHAHAHAAHAA

[boofhead]

Man.. Dude... that would make even the rocks laugh

The government.... NEA DIMOKRATIA...PASOK...DHMAR... to institute an anticorruption advertisement....

HAHAHHAHAHAHAAHAA

LOL fair enough. Maybe someone else can fund it

How else do you propose to change something that has become a cultural trait for many, unless you in your face challenge it?

[Emperor Arcturus Mengsk]

LOL fair enough. Maybe someone else can fund it

How else do you propose to change something that has become a cultural trait for many, unless you in your face challenge it?

Even thought it's oversimplifying a complex issue, I believe there are two kinds of tax-evaders.

There are the ones who do it because simply they don't have enough,

and there are the ones who do it out of greed. . . .

That's why it's really hard to do something extreme like jail everyone inspectors catch trying to avoid taxes at this current time of deep economic reccesion.

For me it would be unnacceptable to put people in jail at during the reccession without taking into account if it was need or greed that made them do it!

Also I think the issue needs to be worked from the top and then go down, for this to happen there needs to be strong political will.

I mean we might vote for whoever promises he will do things right, but then really we can't know that he was lying and was taking bribes from Siemens? (What they were giving in return we will never know, also we will never know who those politicians were, Germany refuses to give the man responsible back to Greece, : DDDDDDDD )

How on earth can we know that?

The only solution for corruption not just in Greece but everywhere first and foremost needs a clean leader,
but those tend to get assasinated :|

[athanaric]

The only solution for corruption not just in Greece but everywhere first and foremost needs a clean leader,
but those tend to get assasinated :|

An answer to that would be to raise a generation's worth of incorruptible, hard-working, and patriotic young people. You guys need some "protestant work ethos" down there, the kind of thing that made Northern European countries so successful during early modern times.
The laid back attitude and the acceptance of antisocial behaviour like cheating, tax evasion, etc. seems to be a problem all around the Mediterranean these days. I'm wondering where this came from.