So who is Varys really working for?

[Mount Suribachi]

SPOILERS AHEAD (you have been warned!)



OK, this has been bothering me for a while. Just whose side is Varys really on?

A quick re-cap of what we know

* He worked for the previous Targaryen ruler but did nothing to stop his death
* He is in league with Ilyrio to support Dany Targaryen and bring her back to westeros with a Dothraki horde to re-take the throne
* His mate Ilyrio gave her 3 dragon eggs (did they expect them to hatch or not?)
* But he also has Ser Jorah in his pay spying on Dany.
* He encourages and then enacts King Roberts order to assassinate Dany, only foiled by a moment of concience from Ser Jorah (was he behind the attempt that Barristan/Whitebeard foiled as well? I can't remember)
* He encourages Ned to admit to a crime he didn't commit, so he could take the black and prevent war, not knowing the Joff would kill him anyway (unless he had whispered in Joff's ear that it would be the "manly" thing to do? )
* He helps Tyrion escape, who then goes and kills Tywin against Varys's wishes, pushing Cersei over the edge
* But he's happy with crazy Cersei, telling Kevan what a "great job" she was doing of sending the realm to rack and ruin
* Right before he kills Kevan

So I'm confubbled right now. Basically he's trying to cause as much chaos in Westeros as possible, whilst aiding the Targaryen's in exile,so it would seem he is trying to pave the way for their return. Except he tried to have Dany killed. More than once

So then I'm thinking - aha! He's an agent for The Others, sowing chaos and paving the way for their conquest. Except his partner Ilyrio gave Dany 3 dragons.....

His stock of answer when asked who he works for is always "for the good of the realm", how is all this good for the realm?

[Brenden_Tully]

Make sure you write spoiler on the title

[Mount Suribachi]

Make sure you write spoiler on the title

Can't see how to edit title, but added spoiler warning at top of post. Although anyone reading threads in here who hasn't read all the books is just asking to be spoiled IMO....

[Boriak]

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

In Book 5 it seems he wants to put Aegon on the throne. He also goes to great length to decrease Lannister power, that's also why he saved Tyrion: Tyrion is ready to fight his own family and he is a well-learned person.

[Mhaedros]

I'm guessing he betrayed the Mad King cause he was mad, but planning to bring back his children to Westeros if they turn out not to be mad.

[Mount Suribachi]

I'm guessing he betrayed the Mad King cause he was mad, but planning to bring back his children to Westeros if they turn out not to be mad.

But why try to have her killed at Roberts request?

In Book 5 it seems he wants to put Aegon on the throne

Yes, he and Ilyrio are helping both Aegon + Dany, possibly to marry them? But then why did he try to kill Dany...? My head hurts

[Gallus]

Varys is working for Varys

[Mount Suribachi]

Varys is working for Varys

I dunno, Littlefinger is clearly working for Littlefinger. Varys however, as a Eunuch, and a foreign one at that, is unlikely to ever be able to sit the Iron Throne

[Gallus]

I dunno, Littlefinger is clearly working for Littlefinger. Varys however, as a Eunuch, and a foreign one at that, is unlikely to ever be able to sit the Iron Throne

I don't think he necessarily wants to sit the Iron Throne, I think he does what is good for him at that moment. He wants to keep all options open so he won't be on a losing side. Helping his "friend" Ilyrio is just a bonus.

[Pinkie Pie]

* He worked for the previous Targaryen ruler but did nothing to stop his death
Not much is known about his work with Aerys only that he insisted he did not open the gate for Tywin and told him Rhaegar was trying to gather support to take the throne.

* He is in league with Ilyrio to support Dany Targaryen and bring her back to westeros with a Dothraki horde to re-take the throne
He was actualy in league with Ilyrio to bring Viserys not Daenerys back to the Seven kingdoms.

* His mate Ilyrio gave her 3 dragon eggs (did they expect them to hatch or not?)
This was more likely Ilyrio's way of currying favour, I seriously doubt anyone could know the eggs would hatch.

* But he also has Ser Jorah in his pay spying on Dany.
Having a spy with the consent of the council is much easier than having to keep the spy secret from everyone.

* He encourages and then enacts King Roberts order to assassinate Dany, only foiled by a moment of concience from Ser Jorah (was he behind the attempt that Barristan/Whitebeard foiled as well? I can't remember)
He told Ilyrio to tell Jorah that Daenerys was in danger so he also helped stop the assassin. When the entire council went with the assassin he could not go against them, doing so would only weaken his position.

* He encourages Ned to admit to a crime he didn't commit, so he could take the black and prevent war, not knowing the Joff would kill him anyway (unless he had whispered in Joff's ear that it would be the "manly" thing to do? )
He needed a war to happen but he had to try to keep the kingdom from starting said war before his plans were ready.

* He helps Tyrion escape, who then goes and kills Tywin against Varys's wishes, pushing Cersei over the edge
After Tyron escaped Cersei had the jailor's, the one in charge of the Black Cells, quaters searched and found a coin pointing towards the Tyrells. Jaime threatened to kill Varys and as he can not aid any Targaryens while he is dead he had no choice. The description of the jailor happens to fit one of Varys' disguises so I would think he left the coin there on purpose to turn Cersei's eyes towards the Tyrells.

* But he's happy with crazy Cersei, telling Kevan what a "great job" she was doing of sending the realm to rack and ruin
Cersei is the best queen for his plans exactly because she never forgets a slight real or imagined and is obsessed with killing the Tyrells.

* Right before he kills Kevan
Kevan was setting to rights everyone that Cersei ed up.

Based on all of that I would say he was helping the Targaryens. He did not send an assassin after Daenerys, he only agreed one should be sent. If he had said no to the idea Robert would have sent one anyway and he would be watched very closely.

[Mount Suribachi]

He told Ilyrio to tell Jorah that Daenerys was in danger so he also helped stop the assassin.

If thats the case, then it all makes a lot more sense - can you remember where we find this detail?

[Prophet1331]

Like martin said, Varys was telling the Mad King how some bannermen are disloyal and that his son Rhaegar is working against him.
So he was sowing discord even in the Targaryen era, however he was the one who told Aerys not to open the gates when Tywin came.

Seems Varys is either oscillating between his plan and his duty (helping the one he serves to keep a good image that he is loyal and then works behind his back) or

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

He might be working to get the Blackfyres back as a theory suggested. Does anyone know if Varys was in anyway involved with the war of the Ninepenny kings? Or if he came to Aerys' court before or after that war, when the last male Blackfyre died out.

Above all Varys is a very good actor and liar, I'm pretty sure there were times when he seemed surprised on how events turned out but in fact knew everything from the start. (No doubt Varys liked the idea of smuggling the dwarf to Ilyrio and then to Dany or Aegon to help them with strategy and info on the Lannisters. Killing Tywin was a bonus)

[Lordinquisitor]

I think varys wanted tyrion to kill tywin, or was at least happy about it. This shattered the realm again, making it easier for aegon to march in. That`s also why he killed of kevan- As he said, he was doing too good a job of keeping the realm together.

[Pinkie Pie]

I do not think it was specifically stated within the books but Ilyrio meets Varys in the cellars not long after Robert commands them to kill Daenerys so it is safe to assume it was him that told Ilyrio about the attempt.

Not long after the assassination asttempt by the wine seller Jorah told Daenerys that the message was from Ilyrio and that it stated her life was in danger.

[Mount Suribachi]

I do not think it was specifically stated within the books but Ilyrio meets Varys in the cellars not long after Robert commands them to kill Daenerys so it is safe to assume it was him that told Ilyrio about the attempt.

Not long after the assassination asttempt by the wine seller Jorah told Daenerys that the message was from Ilyrio and that it stated her life was in danger.

Re-reading AGOT, you are correct that Ilyrio sends a letter to Ser Jorah.

After Ned has stormed out of the small council meeting refusing to sanction Danys killing, LF comes to see him telling Ned he had to convince Robert not to hire the Faceless Men (not wanting to have to find the coin for it no doubt) and tells him Instead Varys will quietly let it be known that we'll make a lord of whoever does in the Targaryen girl....titles are cheap, the Faceless Men are expensive. If truth be told I did the Targaryen girl more good than you with all your talk of honour. Let some sellsword drunk on visions of Lordship try to kill her. Likely he'll make a botch of it, and afterward the Dothraki will be on their guard. If we'd sent a Faceless Man after her she'd be as good as buried.

When Ser Jorah stops the assassin, she asks him how he knew - I did not know Khaleesi, not until the man refused to drink, but once I read Magister Ilyrio's letter I feared........A letter to Viserys from Magister Ilyrio. Robert Baratheon offers lands and Lordships for your death or your brothers.

So I've pretty obviously missed this first time round. Varys pretends to authorise Dany/Viserys's killing, warns Ilyrio, who warns Ser Jorah, who stops the killing.

I like Varys the Kingdom-wide Procrastinator theory. He was trying to delay the bloodbath of the War of the Five Kings

This is correct, in the meeting between Varys and Ilyrio that Arya witnesses Ilyrio is urging Varys to slow everything down, Varys says things are in motion now that he cannot stop and urges Ilyrio to hurry. Later on when Ned is in the dungeon, when Varys visits him Ned asks what he really wants and Varys replies peace. If there was one soul in all of Kings Landing who truly wanted to keep Robert alive it was me. What he doesn't add is "for now" heh

And thankyou to those who pointed out that Varys was actually working to put Viserys back on the throne, not Dany, an important distinction that many (including me!) forget. Dany was merely the bargaining chip to get Viserys his army. But that raises another question for me.

Since the appearance of young Aegon, many have gone "oh look, they're going to marry him to Dany and start a new Targ dynasty" but since the original plan was for Viserys to win back the Iron Throne, how does that fit in with raising (or creating ) young Aegon in secret?

[Ori]

Since the appearance of young Aegon, many have gone "oh look, they're going to marry him to Dany and start a new Targ dynasty" but since the original plan was for Viserys to win back the Iron Throne, how does that fit in with raising (or creating ) young Aegon in secret?

Viserys and Daenerys didn't come into Illyrio's home until a year before AGoT (if I'm remembering it correctly) and by that time Viserys had already gotten himself into the mindset that he was the rightful heir to the Iron Throne and he was quite mad, something Illyrio and Varys would've known quite clearly. Telling him that they had found Aegon Targaryen (who has a better claim than Viserys) would've caused a lot of complications, I suppose you could put it. Viserys would've probably called him a fraud and spilled a lot of bad blood between him and Illyrio, which just would've messed things up.

Also, if something had happened to Viserys they could use Aegon as a back-up plan. He could've fulfilled Viserys' role with the Dornish Princess (personally I think he still will) and claimed the Iron Throne just as well.

Or he's just a fraud they came up with when they heard Viserys' had died. After all this was a nice network of intrigue that they had spent perhaps years on. Why let Viserys' madness ruin it all? And if Aegon is never found out as a fake then he serves his purpose just as well.

[McDoogle22]

Several times throughout all of the books it is mentioned how Dragon eggs are amongest the most expensive items in the known world. Their price could buy an immense army yet Illyrio, a Magistar of Pentos has willingly spent such a fortune on a little girl in a realm he will never live in? Sounds suss to me.

I know Illyrio and Varys are close as brothers, but why spend such a fortune on eggs instead of the army?

Varys protected Tyrion because they developed a friendship while Tyrion was Hand, Varys saw the intelligence and the use of Tyrion, specially once he had obviously turned on the Lannisters. Truly, very few others could match Tyrion for Stratergy, However Tyrion is also one of Martins Favourite characters, thus he will always get a break... despite losing his nose

[achudnow]

* He worked for the previous Targaryen ruler but did nothing to stop his death
As martin said, this is not the case, though I can see why you originally put this. I'm not quoting it word for word, but I just read the books again, so this is fairly accurate:

"Aerys had the eunuch whispering into his ear during the whole rebellion. Then, when Tywin Lannister was before his gates, the one time he should have listened to Varys, he heeded Pycelle, who urged him to open the gates as Tywin must be his loyal servant, coming to defend the capital."

Again, not nearly word for word, but that's basically how it went. It's unclear whether Varys wanted Aerys to remain on the throne, or if he just wanted to delay the Mad King's fall for some reason, possibly to give Viserys and Daenerys more time to escape Dragonstone and flee to Essos. Other evidence suggests the latter is the case.

* He is in league with Ilyrio to support Dany Targaryen and bring her back to westeros with a Dothraki horde to re-take the throne
Though it is true the original plan was for Viserys to lead the Dothraki to take Westeros, Varys was quick enough to amend his original Arriane Martell x Viserys + Khal Drogo x Dany plan to the Quentyn Martell x Dany plot. Either way, this would ensure Dorne accepted Viserys or Daenerys (though by Doran's "Fire and Blood" mini-speech it was pretty obvious he was already going to), and quite possibly other Westerosi lords would have bent the knee under threat of a Dothraki and Dornish or just Dornish invasion with Viserys or Daenerys as it's figure-head.

* His mate Ilyrio gave her 3 dragon eggs (did they expect them to hatch or not?)
No one could have predicted the hatching. It's possible Illyrio already had the eggs through some other source than simply purchasing them. Still doesn't explain why he didn't just sell them if this was the case, but that may be a question we never have answered. We'll have a lot of questions like this when the series ends, I guarantee you. Martin is not one to explain every little detail. It's also possible that he wanted Dany herself to sell the eggs for an army, so it would seem like it was Dany actually leading things, instead of Illyrio doing it all for her, which is a bad image for a new Queen, though it's unfortunately an image she has since developed.

* But he also has Ser Jorah in his pay spying on Dany.
Of course he does. Varys is Varys, why would he not have an informant standing next to Dany, whispering in her ear? Say you're betting a large amount of money on an investment in the real world. Wouldn't you keep track of that investment?

* He encourages and then enacts King Roberts order to assassinate Dany, only foiled by a moment of concience from Ser Jorah (was he behind the attempt that Barristan/Whitebeard foiled as well? I can't remember)
Misdirection, in my opinion. He endorses the assassination plan, enacts it, but rigs it to fail. No one (except possibly Petyr, though I doubt it) sees the truth, and Varys further clouds his true motives.

* He encourages Ned to admit to a crime he didn't commit, so he could take the black and prevent war, not knowing the Joff would kill him anyway (unless he had whispered in Joff's ear that it would be the "manly" thing to do? )
I like Varys the Kingdom-wide Procrastinator theory. He was trying to delay the bloodbath of the War of the Five Kings (though it probably would have been called something different if Eddard had been sent to the wall) until Viserys (and later Dany, because Viserys would have died regardless of Eddard's loss of height) could invade Westeros and claim the Iron Throne.

* He helps Tyrion escape, who then goes and kills Tywin against Varys's wishes, pushing Cersei over the edge
Jaime did threaten him, but why would Varys want Tyrion as his possible enemy? The only time Cersei managed to out-wit Tyrion was when he was full-on unconscious from his wound at the Blackwater. Isn't that telling? Hehe.

* But he's happy with crazy Cersei, telling Kevan what a "great job" she was doing of sending the realm to rack and ruin
Varys didn't particularly want to have Kevan killed, so he tried to make Kevan think that Cersei was doing a stellar job.

* Right before he kills Kevan
But when Kevan starts to fix the gaping holes Cersei has left in the realm's stability, Varys' hand is forced and he has to slay Kevan. Varys doesn't seem to be a particularly honorable man, but for some reason he did the honorable thing, pulled an Eddard Stark, and crossbow'd Kevan himself.

[Stannis Baratheon]

I agree with quite everything achudnow wrote. Varys most definitely wanted for Tyrion to kill Tywin, it fit perfectly into his plans to drive the realm into chaos, as we saw in AFFC. It is clear that his "it would be most unwise" is thinly weiled "yes, yes, do it!", if he wanted to prevent it he wouldn't have mentioned anything about Tywin.
And Varys did the deed himself in last chapter so GRRM could at least try to decrease the huge, awful number of cliffhangers at the end of ADWD, imagine if we just found out over some random epilogue character that Kevan and Pycelle were killed by an unknown killer.

[achudnow]

The only thing I have to say about that, Stannis, is that Kevan's death was from his own POV, so we would have known regardless of whether Varys did it or not. But I agree with everything else you said.