CA going in the wrong direction

**SleepySteve** · August 13, 2012, 05:29 PM

I dislike the fact that CA is putting out new games faster and faster, busting out cheap DLC unit packs with unique units that should have been in the base game, and just generally releasing unfinished products. However I do not blame CA.

I blame the people who pay for those ridiculous DLC packs, and froth at the mouth the second a new game or expansion pack is announced. Seriously guys, as gamers we are enabling the dev's to shortchange us more and more. Just an example is how in shogun 2 all of the factions have basically the same units, and the factions play, look and feel the same. The very annoying arguement for this is "well it is just one nation so why would there be variety?" Well that sounds good until you look at the fact that the unit packs made each faction have special exclusive units.... So there obviously was room for variety, and it was left out of the base game to make more money. This is only one of the many many examples.

Most people just dont think about what they are spending their money on, and we are causing the games we love to be dumbed down, sold out, shortchanged, and ruined. These games are becoming the COD of strategy gaming. Just food for thought, from someone who is very frustrated by rampant consumerism. So I am begging you, PLEASE think about what you are purchasing and the value you are getting for your money. Thanks guys.

**~~removeduser_4536284751384~~** · August 13, 2012, 05:37 PM

I don't think CA has sped up development at all, although I hear they will after R2.

And I don't see the difference between a couple of DLC and an expansion pack.

**Fallenempire** · August 14, 2012, 04:05 AM

Originally Posted by irelandeb

I don't think CA has sped up development at all, although I hear they will after R2.

And I don't see the difference between a couple of DLC and an expansion pack.

where did you hear that?

**Larkin** · August 13, 2012, 05:38 PM

People want Total War. It's supply and demand. The entire basis of western economies.

People not buying DLCs will never stop a developer putting out DLC packs. Look at that train sim with $1000 worth of DLC. I doubt they have more than a few thousand players, but that won't stop them releasing DLC.

Shogun 2 came out on March 15th 2011. Napoleon came out on February 23rd 2010. It's curently August 2012 and there's no release date for Rome II yet.

I really don't think more than 2 years in development is "rampant consumerism". And don't class things like FOTS as a Total War game, they're expansions. PC games have had expansions since the dawn of time.

**stradar1** · August 13, 2012, 05:45 PM

/thread again

**SleepySteve** · August 13, 2012, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by stradar1

/thread again

Your saying that the thread deserves to be blocked/closed? Why? because I am trying to have an intelligent conversation with people, and express my concerns about a game series that I have owned every installment of?

**stradar1** · August 13, 2012, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

Your saying that the thread deserves to be blocked/closed? Why? because I am trying to have an intelligent conversation with people, and express my concerns about a game series that I have owned every installment of?

I own every single total war game down to the first game shogun total war. But this thread to be honest is pointless its just another thread of whineing.

**oppaiO_O** · August 13, 2012, 05:46 PM

to each its own....and i think a one to two year wait till next release is a good idea and Larkin dude made some good points.... i personally didn't buy any dlc. well except blood pack, fots, and want rise but other than that wont buy any thing but theres people out there who want to so like i said to each its own....

**Humble Warrior** · August 13, 2012, 05:51 PM

CA`s been going in the wrong direction for quite a while on some issues. We can only speak up on the issues we see as wrong and hopefully direct them the correct way.

So we must protest. Nothing may happen, but at least we stood up and made our voice heard. But it`s a long job requiring persistence and endurance.

**stradar1** · August 13, 2012, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

Your right Humble warrior, that's really all I am trying to do. If I seem like I am being a jerk I very much so apolgize to everyone. This issue transcends gaming to all aspects of life, these behaviors ultimately affect us all in a negative manner, so I get kinda fired up about it...

Anyways I think ca is doing just fine my only issue is the DLC. Everything else is just fine with me.

**SleepySteve** · August 13, 2012, 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by stradar1

You know you can edit your post without haveing to double post you know lol. Anyways I think ca is doing just fine my only issue is the DLC. Everything else is just fine with me.

Honestly dude I am not sure how to do that... LOL I try to keep everything as simple as possible, my phone is miserably slow where I am and doesn't function too well on the net. (Darn not living in 100,000 plus pop region lol)

**stradar1** · August 13, 2012, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

Honestly dude I am not sure how to do that... LOL I try to keep everything as simple as possible, my phone is miserably slow where I am and doesn't function too well on the net. (Darn not living in 100,000 plus pop region lol)

Are you at work on your phone on here? If not do you even have a pc with internet?

**Humble Warrior** · August 13, 2012, 06:02 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

Your right Humble warrior, that's really all I am trying to do. If I seem like I am being a jerk I very much so apolgize to everyone. This issue transcends gaming to all aspects of life, these behaviors ultimately affect us all in a negative manner, so I get kinda fired up about it...

Indeed it does. I understand..

**SleepySteve** · August 13, 2012, 05:52 PM

Just a few thread titles off th first page
"what extra's will we get in the collectors edition"
"what's the quickest way to get rome 2 in hand"
"special units"

SIGH....

"I don't think CA has sped up development at all, although I hear they will after R2.

And I don't see the difference between a couple of DLC and an expansion pack."

Did you even read what I wrote? My main point was how a lot of the DLC should have, and could have been in the base game, and how CA and it's fanboy's make no sense whatsoever with their reasoning on why all the factions have almost units and appearances.

And yeah Larkin supply and demand is no new concept, I just wish people would DEMAND better products, if they did we would get them simple as that. Don't give a company your money for a cheap, run of the mill product and they will make a better one. I just wish people would stop being sheeple and cash cows. Thats Honestly what most people are nowaday's, just mindless consumers who know only know one thing, you got it consumerism.

Originally Posted by Humble Warrior

CA`s been going in the wrong direction for quite a while on some issues. We can only speak up on the issues we see as wrong and hopefully direct them the correct way.

So we must protest. Nothing may happen, but at least we stood up and made our voice heard. But it`s a long job requiring persistence and endurance.

Your right Humble warrior, that's really all I am trying to do. If I seem like I am being a jerk I very much so apolgize to everyone. This issue transcends gaming to all aspects of life, these behaviors ultimately affect us all in a negative manner, so I get kinda fired up about it...

**Larkin** · August 13, 2012, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

And yeah Larkin supply and demand is no new concept, I just wish people would DEMAND better products, if they did we would get them simple as that. Don't give a company your money for a cheap, run of the mill product and they will make a better one. I just wish people would stop being sheeple and cash cows. Thats Honestly what most people are nowaday's, just mindless consumers who know only know one thing, you got it consumerism.

If you don't think Total War is the best strategy series in existence then I don't know what you're doing here.

You seem to think that if people don't buy the game, they will go back to the drawing board and make a better one - they won't. Indeed, how are people to know if a game is good or not without buying it first to play it?

No Total War has held a flame to Rome or Medieval II yet, it's true. But that hasn't stopped them being damn good games. FOTS is good enough as a standalone expansion to compete with other full games, regardless of the fact some units are samey.

You just seem to be waving a textbook Liberal agenda against consumerism without really understanding it. People aren't being "sheeple" when it comes to Total War. We're being fans.

**SleepySteve** · August 13, 2012, 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by Larkin

If you don't think Total War is the best strategy series in existence then I don't know what you're doing here.

You seem to think that if people don't buy the game, they will go back to the drawing board and make a better one - they won't. Indeed, how are people to know if a game is good or not without buying it first to play it?

No Total War has held a flame to Rome or Medieval II yet, it's true. But that hasn't stopped them being damn good games. FOTS is good enough as a standalone expansion to compete with other full games, regardless of the fact some units are samey.

You just seem to be waving a textbook Liberal agenda against consumerism without really understanding it. People aren't being "sheeple" when it comes to Total War. We're being fans.

Your not really following me here... I can't really articulate any clearer what I am talking about. But I'll try real short and sweet like. People buy the base game, it's purposefully incomplete, lacking in content, so that DLC can be released and sold giving people what they wanted all along for example unique units.

I am more so focusing on the DLC model. If people don't buy those unit packs, C.A. wont release them. If enough people don't buy the game, CA will include more stuff in the next installment to attract peopleto buy it...

If you are satisfied by the value you get from the games and don't see the merit in what I am saying I am fine by that. Also I follow no political ideology, or party, nor do I have a lack of understanding when it comes to consumerism.

Originally Posted by stradar1

Are you at work on your phone on here? If not do you even have a pc with internet?

I am out and about right now, and yes I have a desktop and laptop with high speed at home.

Originally Posted by stradar1

I own every single total war game down to the first game shogun total war. But this thread to be honest is pointless its just another thread of whineing.

It may seem pointless to you, but its not being as this is a public forum where people are supposed to communicate and share their views...

**stradar1** · August 13, 2012, 06:20 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

Your not really following me here... I can't really articulate any clearer what I am talking about. But I'll try real short and sweet like. People buy the base game, it's purposefully incomplete, lacking in content, so that DLC can be released and sold giving people what they wanted all along for example unique units.

I am more so focusing on the DLC model. If people don't buy those unit packs, C.A. wont release them. If enough people don't buy the game, CA will include more stuff in the next installment to attract peopleto buy it...

If you are satisfied by the value you get from the games and don't see the merit in what I am saying I am fine by that. Also I follow no political ideology, or party, nor do I have a lack of understanding when it comes to consumerism.

I will Agree with you on one thing.....DLC is the obomination of all PC games out there. I for one never buy DLC. So I agree DLC needs to end but it will not.

**Larkin** · August 13, 2012, 06:31 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

Your not really following me here... I can't really articulate any clearer what I am talking about. But I'll try real short and sweet like. People buy the base game, it's purposefully incomplete, lacking in content, so that DLC can be released and sold giving people what they wanted all along for example unique units.

I am more so focusing on the DLC model. If people don't buy those unit packs, C.A. wont release them. If enough people don't buy the game, CA will include more stuff in the next installment to attract peopleto buy it...

If you are satisfied by the value you get from the games and don't see the merit in what I am saying I am fine by that. Also I follow no political ideology, or party, nor do I have a lack of understanding when it comes to consumerism.

That just plain isn't true. CA will release DLC as much as they like, regardless of how many people buy it.

Some DLC is fantastic. Consider Bethesda's DLCs. Some of those take days to finish.

FOTS, ROTS - those are both DLCs. If they were included in vanilla - indeed, if CA created a "perfect" game right from the off - wouldn't they then stand back from it and go "nah, we're done."

With DLC, there's always the option to spice up the game with more variety. You don't have to buy it.

Even the best games sometimes need a little extra. You just seem to be hunting for the epitome of video gaming rather than accepting that what we've got is pretty damn awesome.

Not like CoD, on the other hand. That stuff really has become gimmicky crap.

**SleepySteve** · August 13, 2012, 07:08 PM

Originally Posted by Larkin

That just plain isn't true. CA will release DLC as much as they like, regardless of how many people buy it.

Some DLC is fantastic. Consider Bethesda's DLCs. Some of those take days to finish.

FOTS, ROTS - those are both DLCs. If they were included in vanilla - indeed, if CA created a "perfect" game right from the off - wouldn't they then stand back from it and go "nah, we're done."

With DLC, there's always the option to spice up the game with more variety. You don't have to buy it.

Even the best games sometimes need a little extra. You just seem to be hunting for the epitome of video gaming rather than accepting that what we've got is pretty damn awesome.

Not like CoD, on the other hand. That stuff really has become gimmicky crap.

Your absolutely correct that game dev's will release DLC all they want. Again all I am hoping is for people to think about the marketing decisions the Dev's make, and to ask if something is really worth the money they throw at companies.

Also correct on the point that I don't have to buy DLC, unless it has value that equals it's price. That's why I have only purchased FOTS, as it is a decent expansion pack. Another example of BS DLC, how about the blood pack? A game that is all about war, death, and violence that was released without blood... So little kids parent's can buy it. And guess what? You pay the Dev's for a blood DLC that gives you this feature. A feature that CLEARLY should have been in the base game. A feature that was excluded from the game at your expense.

Originally Posted by Areo_Hotah

I don't like your attitude of 'blame the people who buy the DLC', I don't like these faction dlc's or blood pack dlc's either but still, to be annoyed because someone wanted to buy it?

I am annoyed by the fact that people pay money for something that should be in the base game, yes yes I am. The fact that they are willing to purchase it enables the Dev's t continue those practices, which means everyone gets less content and value for their money. But your opinion is yours, and mine is mine, and I respect your opnion.

**Huberto** · August 14, 2012, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by SleepySteve

People buy the base game, it's purposefully incomplete, lacking in content, so that DLC can be released and sold giving people what they wanted all along for example unique units.

Yes too true, but as you've discovered, many people on this forum have a hard time accepting CA and SEGA's complicity here. However, if more of us continue to point it out on a regular basis and demand better perhaps this will change.

We're up against an entire industry model on this but it can be overcome.

+rep