TATW Realism+ /Final/ [TATW 3.2]

[DaVinci]

Downloading 2.45 now.

2.4 is looking good. The OoG can't be taken down as quickly because there's a big garrison in Carn Doom. I'm fighting a 2 front war now against Isengard and the OoG. Had a pyhric victory against Isengard outside of Duneard against dome GOOD units (their Pikemen and Uruk Hai are tough). Almost lost Gandalf! I'm on turn 59 now and still have to take out the OoG to become Arnor. Still a way off.

Just a suggestion--let us have a little more time to get deeper into a campaign before you release 2.5 if that's the final. This way we can give you a better idea of the whole picture.

Then prepare Eriador for more stressing stuff in v2.45.
You asked for more power (again) for Isengard, that's the case in 2.45

And yes, 2.45 stays actually for longer, as i said in my "edit" release post above.
I'll explicitely wait for your experience reports before i touch the submod again for v2.5, and not only one or two reports.

Eriador vs Isengard battles: You'll have actually to apply a lot of tactical action and cleverness to win such battles, where Isengard deploys its heavy Uruk-Hai units. Use archers to soften them up, and then mobility of them, plus especially mobility of your cavalry, and the morale and steadiness of your infantry to fix Isengard's forces, and (ie. at least one) ballista/s help to reduce the heavy Isengard stuff from far. The consistence of your forces is very important here.

[Zimmy]

Going to try this out tonight, looks wonderful.

[Aringtoit]

Hey DaVinci,

Started 2.45. Everything's going fine but there were Eldar Archers in an Isengard stack that was attacking me. Should they be there??

It's looking good though!

[DaVinci]

Hey DaVinci,

Started 2.45. Everything's going fine but there were Eldar Archers in an Isengard stack that was attacking me. Should they be there??

It's looking good though!

Bribed certainly by Grima (Isengard's diplomat), he is pretty active with bribe-trials, and Isengard is obviously rich enough to pay ... once i left Aragorns Dwarven and Elven compagnions alone at Helms-Deep to help Rohan in case of an Hornburg-attack, and they were bribed by this diplomat.

And no, Isengard can't recruit Elven Eldar's, nor any other Elvens, but Rohan can recruit Eldar Archers in Helms-Deep (very very rarely, as lore-proper reinforcement), and that's probably the area where the unit was bribed (took away Rohan's nearly best foot unit with this act ...evil power ).

Edit: Possibly, to avoid such a bribe, i could make this special Elven-Rohan unit a character-recruitment (general) for final v2.5, issue is only that he (the general) would get a Rohan-like name and general model, not an Elven-name and general model, but this is perhaps better than to see Elvens fighting for Isengard. Alternative via scripting, i could spawn such Elven unit only when Helms-Deep is sieged.

[Aringtoit]

It was Wormtongue! Damn him.

No problem with him being able to bribe. I kind of like that in fact. Just wanted to make sure it wasn't a glitch. Thanks.

[DaVinci]

Right, Wormtongue ... confused with Grima.

[skullripper]

i was wondering how come i can't upgrade by smiths past a leather tanner, the only time i can udpgrade past a leather tanner is in a citadel or huge city.

[Zimmy]

I finally got to this submod today, and I can say that I adore it. I tried a few turns as Gondor and love the new recruitment, although it bugs me at turn 2 AI Aragorn is always killed by Isengard while trying to move to Eriador.

[DaVinci]

I finally got to this submod today, and I can say that I adore it. I tried a few turns as Gondor and love the new recruitment,...

Nice to hear.

...although it bugs me at turn 2 AI Aragorn is always killed by Isengard while trying to move to Eriador.

Are you sure about that (did you observe that with toggle_fow, or how?), very strange at least ... never ever happened in my many campaign-tests as a non-Eriador faction, incl. Gondor. Gandalf, Aragorn, Gimli and Legolas, if steered by AI, always went back into their faction regions, alive and kicking.
Also, in turn 2, Isengard AI shouldn't really be able to kill Aragorn with his two attached units (Elves and Dwarves), and Aragorn himself starts with a huge load of hitpoints, besides his strong Grey Company bg's (no starting unit of Isengard, or with turn 2, is normally strong enough via autocalc). I'll check that out once more in a next test as Gondor, because that would bug me, too.
However, if you are sure and have observed that (with toggle_fow), reasons could be: Another camp-difficulty (and battle-difficulty) as the recommended one which is M or ie. custom-changes for the starting faction-standing (because Eriador is not at war with Isengard at start nor in turn 2, except Isengard's few starting units and few recruited ones with turn 2 would attack indeed Aragorn's little army when passing through Isengard's regions).
Edit: What i assume is that you only believe that Aragorn died in turn 2 because you see the message "Eriador's king died" in turn 2 (which is not about Aragorn's death, just play Eriador and you'll see).

[Zimmy]

Well, at turn 2 "The King of Eriador is dead" happens. Or is that just an event replacing the leader?

[DaVinci]

Well, at turn 2 "The King of Eriador is dead" happens. Or is that just an event replacing the leader?

So it is, see my edit above ... you responded while i edited still.

[Zimmy]

Oh, I posted one minute before you edited. Heh! Also, why can't I build a Town Watch/later tiers in West Osgiliath? It's not built already either.

[DaVinci]

Oh, I posted one minute before you edited. Heh! Also, why can't I build a Town Watch/later tiers in West Osgiliath? It's not built already either.

Basicly it needs the large_barracks event message, this is for all higher tier barracks the case (it's a TATW vanilla requirement which i haven't touched).
As for the both Osgiliath settlements, the Gondor and also the Mordor player shall not be able to spam units instantly, i guess, that's the reason why there are no barracks at start and as well the lore-background of the Osgiliath "ruins".

And in detail, for certain settlements, i would need to look into the tech-tree, if West-Osgiliath requires something special, can't remember now ... i'll take a look soon.

[DaVinci]

Possible unit addition for final version 2.5

I have permission from danova to use any material from The Last Kingdom (TLK) mod.

You guys perhaps can check the excellent TLK mod out to make a few unit suggestions, ie. 3 additional units, ie. good Men faction or evil Men "subfaction" (ie. Dunlendings- or Rhudaur-like) or mixed for the TATW Realism+ submod.
Please, if you do so, propose the TLK model and an according role/name/faction for the TATW Realism+ submod, if possible with "authentic" lore-background, or just at least a lore-plausible addition.
Consider possible recruitment gaps in rosters or regions (just not a unit-role/faction, which is already there).
Possible is also, that i replace some TATW unit models such as the ones from the rebel/slave faction with TLK models and/or that i add the one or other merc-pool unit.

Besides units, i might implement the one or other TLK building (for the tech-tree alone though, not 3d), currently i think of immersion-increasing items like hill-graveyards (which are a theme in the Tolkien lore) - also here you can make (other) suggestions.

By all that, see also, those additions shall not shake drastically the current achieved balance.

Edit: Before you think "oh, i wanna play/playtest v2.45 for a good time prior to final v2.5" (as discussed in some posts above), don't worry there is a lot of time, my RL hinders me to put out v2.5 in forseeable time, it'll take actually quite some time, and i'll probably wait for some according proposals and anyway for v2.45 experience-reports.

(And btw., for historical-realism mod interested ones from the TLK period (Viking invasion vs. Alfred the Great period on the british isles), there is a TLK submod created by me calling 'The Danelag').

[skullripper]

if you make a dunland faction i have some suggestions for dunland units (probably base on germania and gaul from rtw)

1. dunland beserkers(two handed maul maybe ), dunland savages (2 handed axes), Dunland hill skirmishers+archers (savage looking skirmishers and archers)

[DaVinci]

if you make a dunland faction i have some suggestions for dunland units (probably base on germania and gaul from rtw)

1. dunland beserkers(two handed maul maybe ), dunland savages (2 handed axes), Dunland hill skirmishers+archers (savage looking skirmishers and archers)

Sorry, i won't make another separate faction. Dunland is viewed by me as subfaction within Isengard as in TATW vanilla. So you can make unit suggestions for additional Dunlending units - please use solely the TLK mod as template, as described in my post above. To get an idea about TLK units, check out their stickied faction previews, which contain units (and they are germanic and celtic).

I just downloaded this sub-mod but I can't figure out how to install it?
I moved the zipped file to my MTW2 folder and unzipped it there but I don't thing that needs to be done cause it only adds a readme file and 2 more 'zipped' files...

I'm really bad with computers so if someone can tell me how I can install this submod I'll be grateful

You are on the way to install it correctly. You've unzipped the main dl file, which gives you the readme and the two zip-files (one is only the TATW vanilla backup, titled), the other one (titled) is the submod file.

This latter zip file is the one you shall unzip (calling "TATW Realism+ ..."), you'll get a mods folder, now you can browse to the M2TW folder and paste there that mods folder;
alternative: move (paste) the "TATW Realism+" zip file into the M2TW folder, unzip the "TATW Realism+" zip file within the M2TW folder (right-click on zip file, command "extract here").

In both cases you have to overwrite all files which are offered for overwriting, ready.

(If you wanna uninstall the submod "TATW Realism+", make the same steps, but with the "TATW vanilla backup" zip file).

Sounds complicate and long? It isn't, it is easy and quick if you did it a few times (same install-procedere with every mod that comes not with an exe-setup, because they are all compressed with .zip or .rar or other compress file formats, and exe-setups aren't always accidentfree as well).

The first post gives you the same install-instructions in other short terms.

[Eönwë]

I just downloaded this sub-mod but I can't figure out how to install it?
I moved the zipped file to my MTW2 folder and unzipped it there but I don't thing that needs to be done cause it only adds a readme file and 2 more 'zipped' files...

I'm really bad with computers so if someone can tell me how I can install this submod I'll be grateful

[Eönwë]

So I unzip, and than unzip the new file again in The Third Age folder? Or in the MTW2 Folder? and overwrite all?
Doing that right now!

Edit: I think it works now, got different names in custom battles for the units of Arnor!
But no Arnor Pikemen, Infantry, Hollowsteel archers or dismounted Arnor Knights...

I know this mod is all about realism and downloaded it because it was focused on Eriador/Arnor but the map and the units are still the same?
Or can I recruit more when actually playing a campaign?

[DaVinci]

So I unzip, and than unzip the new file again in The Third Age folder? Or in the MTW2 Folder? and overwrite all?
Doing that right now!

Edit: I think it works now, got different names in custom battles for the units of Arnor!
But no Arnor Pikemen, Infantry, Hollowsteel archers or dismounted Arnor Knights...

I know this mod is all about realism and downloaded it because it was focused on Eriador/Arnor but the map and the units are still the same?
Or can I recruit more when actually playing a campaign?

The custom battle mode shows not the same units which are available in campaign (is also valid for TATW vanilla, btw.), as answer to that question.
In campaign are much more (at least valid for TATW Realism+) ... current v2.45 is not 100% round in this regard, few extra units are still available in custom battle for certain factions which will be disabled in v2.5 (i just forgot to disable them for custom battles), so only faction standard units are accessable in custom battle mode in this submod. Background is that this submod is a campaign mod, that's what i offer, a new TATW campaign experience.

The TATW Realism+ installation is correct placed, if the initial splash file (the first screen picture) of TATW says "TATW Realism+" in white/grey letters, and this indicator is positioned in the left bottom corner. The usual "TATW 3.2" indicator must be there as well.
You have to consider as well, that if you have used/installed other TATW submods, that this is most likely incompatible (this is pretty certain! except for pure music submod files or alternative pure UI's/frontend graphics submods). Just make sure you apply the TATW Realism+ install-instructions, actually the instructions say everything that is needed, and when you proceed like that, it works as planned

This said, i'll look that i simplify the zip file structure or make it more transparent for the next release (v2.5).

[Eönwë]

The installation is fine, I'm just dumb...

I got it right this time, thanks for the help! The indicator is there

As for the mod, I'm starting with Eriador right now!