[Artifex] General Brewster (patron: The Holy Inquisition)

[Hader]

Hader

Told ya.

General Brewster

Esteemed citizens, I have returned!

I think you all know me well enough by now. I did several mod updates but nothing really huge well I will let you yourselves be the judge of that. What I think that counts is my behavior. I behaved like citizens the last couple months to show you members of the cdec how much I really want this.

If you click in there threads there will be an explanation of what they do and are etc.
Threads detailing mod work (more in spoilers below as well): http://www.twcenter.net/forums/tags....neral+brewster

And here the links to my first and second applications. Third time is a charm?
One and Two

I thank you for your time.

Copy pasted info on modding from before:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

released modding projects :

V1650 :

The awesome mod you all heard about by now, at least I demand you know it
It's still my main project and wit ha new version (1.2) currently released.

Last time I saw there where a few problems with the roles so I will explain.
About the startpos I made the very first version where only The Netherlands had there appropriate regions, Cpt.Wsq96 hadn't bought the game back then when he did he used that starpos to make it what it is atm

About the DB stuff, Bethencourt is listed as co DB editor because when I can't resolve crashes he does it. which he has done 3-4 times, Also his Rebel shipyard mod is the base of V1650, I think that is a good 20% if not more of the mod's DB work. note that i did change some stats of course. ,Besides that I do all DB work.

about the models and textures, a few models are made by Bethencourt and adrian74, they textured those units too. carricanta made one texture (of a vanilla model). In the V1650 thread/Dutch unit pack you can see which textures are made by me. any questions please ask me instead of speculation.

Gen. Brewster's Dutch Unit Pack! :

Plain and simple the Dutch units of V1650 in a separate pack. It's a movie.pack which need no activation and includes the text of the game so you don't have 2 packs.

Ottoman Navy Pack :

This makes steam ships playable in custom and campaign battle's for the Ottomans. just activated them did not make stats etc.

Dutch Naval Expansion Pack :

considering this one last time there where some debates on it. her I made custom units but simply using vanilla models, this also is movie.pack with the text included so it doesn't get messy and everyone can understand in comparison this is like 2 hours work the ottoman mod 10 min.

Gen. Brewster's FOTS Modding Division!:

I just started this as a composition of several mods I still need to make, Now there are 4 mods in. this is remaking my own boundaries cause I'm trying to specialize on CAI(campaign AI) modding.

Eventually I will try making it a mod team.

So, I do not know you let this count but I also work as beta tester for Europe in Conflict (EiC).

The non-released mods(or released but not with my work included yet) :

The Great War (TGW)
World War II - Submod
[WIP] Lawrance of Arabia official announcement !



then there's still my guide, Changing a units 2 weapon.
Maybe some other thinks you like is that I started keeping people to stay on-topic in the TGW forum, But I think that hardly counts in your eyes.
then to clarify the Dutch thread for the last time, It was a joke.

[Aikanár]

His V1650 is now at version 1.5.

Moderation history?

Besides, even though the patron has told us so, he's missing the formalia of the Constitiution in regards to:

"...the patron sends the paragraph, along with his own, outlining why he nominated this member, ... "

Underscored for reading convenience.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

Well..."if" the application is not invalidated then...

Third time is a charm?

I think so...Welcome back....

Will go check on the solid citizen aspects and await the modding councilor's reviews...

..........

[Aikanár]

Exactly Mega.
Since the patron has not provided us with a sufficient paragraph outlining at least the constitutional minimum, I request this application being invalidated and a pm being send to the patron as well as to the applicant explaining why this has been done in order to give them the possibility to re-submit this application with a proper patron's paragraph included.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

So.....

"if" it's invalidated because of that, it can be immediatley resubmitted once the proper format is achieved, right?
Now "if" the client would have to wait another 30 days to resubmit I'd have beef with that and object.

[Aikanár]

Indeed! If an application is invalidated, it can instantly be re-submitted if the reason of the invalidation has been remedied.

[SonofPeverel]

Whatever happens I will be voting, an easy, YES on this one.

[Ybbon]

I'm not sure that a link to a discussion about the patrons paragraph counts as a paragraph? The link is 2 words for heavens sake which as paragraphs go, is certainly a model of brevity! I'll decline looking into this while we wait for any resubmission.

[Empress Meg]

One could get torn to pieces and back again trying to unravel that one. Indeed it is a rather minimalist app from the patron but do we make the potential citizen suffer because of the patron's lack of text oration? Do we, the CdeC, lower our standards in order to accomidate a worthy applicant? Which is the better?

On the one hand should we send back a letter to Hader and General Brewster and tell them to try again with a bit less duff and ask for a proper application letter? This will no doubt cause some gruff replies and possibly some rebukes from the more bellicose members of the forum. Perhaps we may even invite that dreaded, "this is why I don't want to be a citizen argument" to the party. But we will be upholding the TWCC as it does indeed say "paragraph" and further details that "the patron [...] along with his own, outlining why he nominated this member" in Sec 3, art 2.

On the other hand should we forget the TWCC's sometimes ambiguous terms and simply look at the pleb's application? It will mean forgoing some of the tedious bits of the TWCC allowing the CdeC to do what many consider its most important job. That of raising new citizens into the ranks of the forum. However it does seem to imply that we go against the letter of the TWCC.

This is merely to outline two options which are being tossed about here.

Personally, I would suggest that we take into account that the CdeC is here to make new citizens and thus we can set aside Hader's short but sweet patronization app for the Prothalamos. This is of course if the need warrants it. General Brewster awaits!

Devoirs The Empress

[Genius of the Restoration]

It's Leo's call, but I don't have a problem with the paragraph. Rather than invalidate, he could just accept a submission and edit the OP which has happened before.

I will probably vote yes. He's easily done enough work for me, I didn't have a problem with behaviour the last time and haven't found anything amiss with his behaviour this time around.

[Aikanár]

Are we above the constitution? I don't think so.
But if it's your personal prerogative that you are above or beyond or not bound by the constitution, just go ahead with this.

I would easily vote yes this time around based upon the applicants contributions, but as long as this is not a proper application according to the constitution I won't vote in this.

[Genius of the Restoration]

The reason I don't have a problem with it is because Hader could say, "I nominated him because I like him" and fulfil the technical requirement. Doing so wouldn't leave me in any better position to assess the applicant. As far as this application goes, given that this is the third time I've seen General Brewster and I thought he should have been made a citizen last time, I just don't care what is in the patron's paragraph. The requirement for a patron to say why they've patronised someone does nothing to ensure a quality application. On top of this, my philosophy is to judge only the applicant, not the application, so the reason someone acted as sponsor is entirely irrelevant to my approach. I've had a change of heart regarding this and think my previous stance on asking for it was overly legalistic when I can't really think of any benefits to enforcing the rule (my earlier post where I argued much as you are now). Personal opinion: I think it's pointless and just don't care whether it's included or not. Curator's call, as always.

[Aikanár]

The reason I don't have a problem with it is because Hader could say, "I nominated him because I like him" and fulfil the technical requirement. Doing so wouldn't leave me in any better position to assess the applicant.

True, but still this would be constitutional, while the paragraph here at hand is not.

As far as this application goes, given that this is the third time I've seen General Brewster and I thought he should have been made a citizen last time

Contributionwise I agree with you.

, I just don't care what is in the patron's paragraph.

As long as it satisfies the basic demands of the constitution.

The requirement for a patron to say why they've patronised someone does nothing to ensure a quality application.

Very true!

On top of this, my philosophy is to judge only the applicant, not the application, so the reason someone acted as sponsor is entirely irrelevant to my approach.
I've had a change of heart regarding this and think my previous stance on asking for it was overly legalistic when I can't really think of any benefits to enforcing the rule (my earlier post where I argued much as you are now).

While I agree with you regarding that only the applicants contributions and behaviour should be relevant concerning the question whether or not an applicant should receive he promotion in rank.
I cannot follow you concerning the formal check of the application against the constitution.

Following your prerogative this would be a valid application:

patron's paragraph

.

applicant's paragraph

Me & my contribs..
Because I want to.
None.

Which, of course, is only slightly different from:

patron's paragraph

Because!

applicant's paragraph

Me & my contribs..
Because I want to.
None.

The former is unconstitutional, the latter ain't.
Both do not appeal to me.

Personal opinion: I think it's pointless and just don't care whether it's included or not. Curator's call, as always.

Fair enough.

[Navajo Joe]

Hader's patron's application is not the format I would have done or would like to see, but Brewster's work is very good. I am happy to support this application

[Robin de Bodemloze]

Hader's patron's application is not the format I would have done or would like to see, but Brewster's work is very good. I am happy to support this application

Basically this. Will need to go through recent posting history to verify the behavioural aspect but I've played his VOC mod before and it's highly entertaining. The other mod contributions look good too.

As for the patron's paragraph I'm with Aik on this one. Adding "Because I feel like it" and resubmitting takes 5 seconds and such a senior member of the site should be expected to respect its constitution.

Either way it's important we don't lose sight of the important thing here which is GB's merits not Hader.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

One could get torn to pieces and back again trying to unravel that one. Indeed it is a rather minimalist app from the patron but do we make the potential citizen suffer because of the patron's lack of text oration? Do we, the CdeC, lower our standards in order to accomidate a worthy applicant? Which is the better?

On the one hand should we send back a letter to Hader and General Brewster and tell them to try again with a bit less duff and ask for a proper application letter? This will no doubt cause some gruff replies and possibly some rebukes from the more bellicose members of the forum. Perhaps we may even invite that dreaded, "this is why I don't want to be a citizen argument" to the party. But we will be upholding the TWCC as it does indeed say "paragraph" and further details that "the patron [...] along with his own, outlining why he nominated this member" in Sec 3, art 2.

On the other hand should we forget the TWCC's sometimes ambiguous terms and simply look at the pleb's application? It will mean forgoing some of the tedious bits of the TWCC allowing the CdeC to do what many consider its most important job. That of raising new citizens into the ranks of the forum. However it does seem to imply that we go against the letter of the TWCC.

This is merely to outline two options which are being tossed about here.

Personally, I would suggest that we take into account that the CdeC is here to make new citizens and thus we can set aside Hader's short but sweet patronization app for the Prothalamos. This is of course if the need warrants it. General Brewster awaits!

Devoirs The Empress

My "Deep Fried Southern - Texan Speak" take on this is that they subscribed to the letter the 1st two times out. If they wan't to be Joe Cool Like and cut corners that's their call.

However....I do respect the feelings of the board members who are not that flexible. If you'all make them re-tender without penalty then I'm cool with that. Make them wait an additional 30 though is a punitive measure I will not support.

Now If we let it ride, based on objectional oratory, the petioners may have just slit their own throats just because they are rolling stic.


I'll support whatever measure as long as compliance will initiate this review.

[Aikanár]

Make them wait an additional 30 though is a punitive measure I will not support.

Nobody has brought that up, since you only have to wait if you fail the vote, which is not the case.
If an application is invalidated it can be resubmitted in no time, without any waiting period attached to it.
If other I would not have requested that, because I want to vote yes on this application based upon the applicants contributions.
I would've voted yes based on the contributions alone in his second try, as stated there, if not the behavioural question would have been risen.

Today I don't see issues with his behaviour.

But I'm afraid, even though I have no issues with the applicants behaviour and even though he easily has reached the threshold of receiving the promotion in rank by now, I cannot vote yes for an unconstitutional application.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

Fair enough, I can respect that...

[Leonidas The Lion]

The way I see it is that the clause exists to help the applicant's case, a patron who submits what Hader has submitted only hinders his client. Question is is he worthy to be a citizen without the patron's paragraph, well that's for you guys to decide. Thus I'm tempted to allow this to proceed.

[Mega Tortas de Bodemloze]

Is that the call then...Boss..??