Siege assault strategies (FoTS)

[General Maximus]

I am good at defending any type of castle in FoTS, but I am really bad at assaulting in all Shogun II expansions. In fact, I am really bad even when laying siege in campaigns.

Any tips/strategies to help me out? Like when should I lay siege, how many turns I should wait before assaulting or sallying, how many troops I should stack up, which season is best, should I use gates or not etc.

I can't seem to figure out how to avoid all those gun levies who man the walls and shoot and rout anyone daring to come closer.

Thanks.

[SupAll]

I am good at defending any type of castle in FoTS, but I am really bad at assaulting in all Shogun II expansions. In fact, I am really bad even when laying siege in campaigns.

Any tips/strategies to help me out? Like when should I lay siege, how many turns I should wait before assaulting or sallying, how many troops I should stack up, which season is best, should I use gates or not etc.

I can't seem to figure out how to avoid all those gun levies who man the walls and shoot and rout anyone daring to come closer.

Thanks.

I wouldn't assault a castle early on in FotS. With all the guns and how the castles are built, its a bit of a nightmare. However, if you're intent on assaulting, what you need are artillery, sharpshooters, and some heavy melee. Use your artillery (whether from ship or parrott guns) to destroy the walls, sharpshooters to get those pesky line infantry, and then scale with your melee troops. If the time limit is 60 minutes, take your time.

Before assaulting, I would suggest a couple turns and bombard them with naval support each time as well. I never had the opportunity to assault a castle just yet (so this is all from what I've seen) since when I besiege, the CAI tends to sally forth and I destroy them that way.

[Stellarnight]

This works for me personally in Hard Mode.

In the early game, I would only directly assault a castle if i had a numerical advantage. I usually mass spam Spear Levies since Melee is pretty much king and Garrison Levy Infantry can be overwhelmed easily.

Then there will be a stage in the game where the factions start having line infantry and sharpshooters and you have not rolled out your Parrott Guns. This is where i would siege and wait the defender to sally out. Line Infantry on the walls will tear you to shreds.

Once you have the guns, i would prefer Seigeing actually because the defenders like to stay within the confines of their castle. Focus on dangerous defenders like the Shogitai/ Katana Kachi/ Yari Kachi and if there is any artillery, engage in counter-battery action. Otherwise, focus artillery/cannon fire on one side of the enemy flank to weaken them and to prepare your troops for climbing that particular flank.

Once your Line/ Shogunate/ Foreign Infantries get strong enough i would usually get them to assault directly by climbing the walls. My Yari Kachi would burn down the gates and rapid advance in to sandwich wall defenders.

As for seasons, avoid winter. FOTS siege battles are alot more deadly as compared to Shogun 2 with rifles and such. So i would siege and await the enemy to sally out most of the time unless i see one of their stack about to reinforce the besieged castle.


Sendai is ridiculous in the early game with their -2 turn to siege trait. Every Defender practically have to sally out the next turn and you can use Yari Ki and line infantry to absolutely destroy them.

[General Maximus]

Thanks for the tips.

Many times there are situations where I 'have' to assault. For example, another army is approaching to my weak front, and I am left with only two options: quickly assault the fortress, loot and burn it, and swiftly march back to the other front to intercept the enemy; second option is to continue siege and be slowly annihilated to the last settlement. Sometimes I have to run back because winter is approaching.

One more thing is that when I used to play original Shogun II campaign, there were many battles where I assaulted and beaten up the armies more or less equal in strength to me.

[Futski]

Well, just bring a couple of big guns, blow the defenders to dust, and take the castle.
If you would like more artillery, there is a unit mod, which adds howitzers, mortars, cannons and even a fire rocket unit. They become available a between the wooden cannon/Parrott stage, so you don't have to rely on those worthless wooden cannons.

[Humble Warrior]

I use real world tactics to attack in a siege. I`ll try to starve it for as long as possible first, but if rushed...

In the early part of the game I go with both or one of these:

A, At least one wood cannons, more if possible.
B, Naval artillery support.

(I never attack without some kind of cannon or arty support. It`s too difficult to succeed otherwise and I won`t send men climbing up the walls all over in their thousands as I find it very unrealistic).

C, I then have about a third more men (at minimum than the enemy) if possible.

1. I destroy the Towers with my cannons, gates, then the defending men.
2. If I have Navy artillery, I`ll use that too.

1.Most importantly, and if I have only cannons, say, I`ll destroy the Tower first then the gate, then the men. I will gradually move my men forward, but not actually attack until nearly out of ammo.
2. I will bomb any last defending enemy troops with the last cannon rounds then attack with my men. My men will have moved to just beyond range of any surviving defenders.
3. They will use the destroyed gate to swarm in, with my cavalry and General close behind. By this point there aren`t many defenders left and the battle will be won.

p.s. i never use my men to monkey climb the walls, only Kisho ninijas are allowed to do that if I have any.

[Erwin Rommel]

I use real world tactics to attack in a siege.

I won`t send men climbing up the walls all over in their thousands as I find it very unrealistic

i never use my men to monkey climb the walls

Sigh....

If only you watched more Jidaigeki. You know? I mean media featuring the Sengoku Jidai?

It might prove valuable.....you might get to see the young Ken Watanabe as Oda Nobunaga. You know? Ken Watanabe? Sure you do, its the bald guy from The Last Samurai.



Well guess what, look at this Taiga Drama about Ken Watanabe/Oda Nobunaga....






(It clearly shows that Ken Watanabe should stick to being bald. )

[General Maximus]

Lol, his Mon got stuck in the stones.

So following Humble's tip, I stacked up 3 units of wooden cannons and some corvettes before running out of money. The problem is that you cannot naval-bomb them in inland provinces like Kai. But I still had some successes.

I didn't ever use the 'monkey' tactics except in some multiplayer matches where I had to because I was frustrated that walls are just "a useless unfilled ditch which can be crossed over easily" by monkey climbing. Basically in FoTS I just autoresolved the battle when I thought I could win, by quick saving-loading until I see good results.

And Futski's suggestion 'nearly' worked. A weird thing is that enemy has got matchlock and cannon towers in their castles when I have reached just the second development level. Another thing is that cannons cannot fire upwards like howitzers. But I cannot download mods, I think I'll first complete the vanilla 2-3 times, play multiplayer (which will be unavailable after mods) to complete satisfaction, and then think about mods.

One more thing is, how do you get Kisho Ninjas? Since there is no ninja 'resource' in FoTS, are there any other requirements? Are they intended to be a late-game unit or can be used early on?

[Humble Warrior]

One more thing is, how do you get Kisho Ninjas? Since there is no ninja 'resource' in FoTS, are there any other requirements? Are they intended to be a late-game unit or can be used early on?

They pop up at some point when you capture certain places I think, like Kyoto. Can`t remember off hand. They are usually mid to late game units. Just now when I was attacked by a Faction, they came with a sneaky unit of Kisho, so there are probably other ways to get them if you have the right buildings or maybe they just get them early for the Faction. They certainly shin up those walls fast!

[General Maximus]

They certainly shin up those walls fast!

So they still have those claws, eh?

But they usually died easily in my Sengoku era games because I couldn't figure out which direction was best for them. Usually rear or flanks in siege, I guess.

But are they a help anymore? Guns can splinter them because nowadays guns are faster than ninjas. And they were already weak to matchlocks, and rout easily because of their small numbers.

[Humble Warrior]

So they still have those claws, eh?

But they usually died easily in my Sengoku era games because I couldn't figure out which direction was best for them. Usually rear or flanks in siege, I guess.

But are they a help anymore? Guns can splinter them because nowadays guns are faster than ninjas. And they were already weak to matchlocks, and rout easily because of their small numbers.

Yea, they`re a help if you use them properly. They are able to stay hidden until real close to the enemy. They also use grenades and flashbombs that disorientate and cause a lot of hassle. If you watch over them and move them out of the way of any real fights then they`re pretty a thorn in the enemy`s side. I don`t often have time to watch the Kisho and fight the battle , but when I do I will always retreat them and even send them off the battlefield to use for next time once they`ve done their bit.

Just remember, they are ninjas, not hardened warriors, like some people seem to think. They don`t last two minutes in a decent fight.

[AgentGB]

Sigh....

If only you watched more Jidaigeki. You know? I mean media featuring the Sengoku Jidai?

It might prove valuable.....you might get to see the young Ken Watanabe as Oda Nobunaga. You know? Ken Watanabe? Sure you do, its the bald guy from The Last Samurai.



Well guess what, look at this Taiga Drama about Ken Watanabe/Oda Nobunaga....






(It clearly shows that Ken Watanabe should stick to being bald. )

always learning somthing new from yur posting! +rep

[Shea O'Gorath]

In FotS kisho ninja are available at the second last dojo I believe. And I dont know about the sengoku campaign but a fots battle the ninja unit is a slaying machine.

[Humble Warrior]

In FotS kisho ninja are available at the second last dojo I believe. And I dont know about the sengoku campaign but a fots battle the ninja unit is a slaying machine.

Had some Kisho ninjas shin up a wall and attack after using their grenades. once they did that, i slaughtered them in seconds with basic ashigura type spearmen. I have never seen them last long in a fight unless they have the element of surprise and the enemy is engaged with someone else at the same time.

[General Maximus]

And if I use them during the night battles, then?

[Humble Warrior]

And if I use them during the night battles, then?

Night battles don`t seem to make any difference at all.

[General Maximus]

Night battles don`t seem to make any difference at all.

I thought night battles made units even better at hiding, because I had an ashigaru march through and climb the walls without ever being seen. Only when they reached the flag, enemy was surprised and sandwiched.

[Shea O'Gorath]

Ive had kisho ninja rack up well over 150 kills in Fots. They went to town

[Humble Warrior]

I thought night battles made units even better at hiding, because I had an ashigaru march through and climb the walls without ever being seen. Only when they reached the flag, enemy was surprised and sandwiched.

I really don`t know. I might test one day.

Ive had kisho ninja rack up well over 150 kills in Fots. They went to town

Could be down to difficulty level, experience of unit, etc, as this affects the strength of your troops versus the AI.

[General Maximus]

Does having a powerful ship in the bombardment call range means there will be more damage during a siege?