Baktra Discussion (and some Sweboz)

[Stath's]

So, before 4 weeks i asked you which my next campaign shall be. Many suggested Sweboz among others, i played with them, but got tired from all the infantry and no cavalry. Eliminated Aedui and Arvernii and now facing Romans, i put this campaign on hold.

And i started with my dear Baktria. Playing with Rome.exe in the past i have reached Arvela and Seleuceia, but now playing with Alex.exe (VH/H ) Seleucids made some crazy things.

I conquered Persepolis and attacked with 3 Argyraspidai in a stack with 13 good units.

My strategy from the start was betray Seleucids, take Alexandreia Ariane, Prophthasia (then peace for a while, so i took Alexandropolis, maybe that was a mistake and i should have pushed west).

After that, i took Karmana and Persepolis and -bang- Argyraspidai

So 2 questions:

1) With Baktra, do you betray Seleucids immediately?

2) When you besiege a city, do you attack or wait for them to starve and sally? (i always wait)

[The Kybrothilian]

2) I kind of act here according to my character's traits and the army. If he's a siege expert, and his army has a lot of assault infantry, then assault.

Otherwise I'll starve them out.

[Stath's]

Maybe with Baktra, that was the mistake. Maybe i should have attacked Ariane and Prophthasia and not waited. And then, not going to Alexandropolis and losing time there would be the right thing to do. That way my upkeep would have been lowered and Seleucids would not have so much time in their hands.

[Antiokhos Euergetes]

I have always been fascinated with Baktria and the Indo-Greeks, but have never really played a very long campaign I think it is because I would like more of a challenge in India

[Stath's]

Yes, i always think it would be great if the Taksashila exist in EB1. But still, to take the 3 Indian cities is very hard.

[andrew.murphy1]

Yes, i always think it would be great if the Taksashila exist in EB1. But still, to take the 3 Indian cities is very hard.

Mmmm, if you know what you're doing, taking the Indian cities can be a breeeze...

Normally, I take 3 pantodapidoi phalangitai, 2 peltastai and 4 persian archers and go east. I leave the faction leader in Baktra, let my heir lead the army and have the 3rd FM govern Kophen (the settlement just east of Baktra) once I've taken it.

I then train a couple of units of cheap toxitai and get my Basileus to build forts the other side of the two crossings next to Baktra and have one unit of toxitai garrison each. (You have to make sure the seleukids are neutral, which is easy enough, as the Parthians usually attack them immediately, so just side with them against the Seleukids. If you are allied, the seleukids will be able to walk past your forts and then siege Baktra, when they first betray you.)

The whole point of building the forts is to buy you time, allowing you to get your army back from India to save Baktra. Using Jirisys's sub-mod, with the realistic movement points, this is perfectly possible, provided you are a confident enough to win these battles.

When conquering India, use your spy to scout their armies. You'll never come across more than half a stack at a time, but fighting in open terrain isn't a good idea. Ideally, move onto a river crossing in their territory and they'll bite. Keep your phalangitai on the crossing, your archers (with flaming arrows) and peltastai (with javelins) on the elephants and you should be fine. Let your general chase down any routers. If you can't manage to manouevre your army to allow a river battle, move your army right up against a mountain range, so that you have a terrain advantage on the battle-map. The ridiculous slopes will tire the enemy while they march towards you, and the extra height will extend your archers' range considerably.

After you win each battle, there should be only one general's unit of elephants left in the regional city, which you should use your peltastai and their javelins to deal with on their own. Garrison the newly conquered settlement with cheap troops and then move onto to the next Indian city, working south. When you have all three, then you will have enough money to start consolidating your position. Use Baktra as your military production settlement and India as your economic hub.

Be careful that the Saka don't invade from the North-East, and that the Seleukids don't attack India from the South-West while you build up, so extra spies in those regions are advised. If you can stop the latter two pulling a sneaky on you, then you have a successful and interesting Mid-game ahead of you. I've only out-lined the part of the strategy for the Early game, as after you've built up, you can go vastly different directions.

[Stath's]

Mmmm, if you know what you're doing, taking the Indian cities can be a breeeze...

Normally, I take 3 pantodapidoi phalangitai, 2 peltastai and 4 persian archers and go east. I leave the faction leader in Baktra, let my heir lead the army and have the 3rd FM govern Kophen (the settlement just east of Baktra) once I've taken it.

I then train a couple of units of cheap toxitai and get my Basileus to build forts the other side of the two crossings next to Baktra and have one unit of toxitai garrison each. (You have to make sure the seleukids are neutral, which is easy enough, as the Parthians usually attack them immediately, so just side with them against the Seleukids. If you are allied, the seleukids will be able to walk past your forts and then siege Baktra, when they first betray you.) (be neutral)

The whole point of building the forts is to buy you time, allowing you to get your army back from India to save Baktra. Using Jirisys's sub-mod, with the realistic movement points, this is perfectly possible, provided you are a confident enough to win these battles.

When conquering India, use your spy to scout their armies. You'll never come across more than half a stack at a time, but fighting in open terrain isn't a good idea. Ideally, move onto a river crossing in their territory and they'll bite. Keep your phalangitai on the crossing, your archers (with flaming arrows) and peltastai (with javelins) on the elephants and you should be fine. Let your general chase down any routers. If you can't manage to manouevre your army to allow a river battle, move your army right up against a mountain range, so that you have a terrain advantage on the battle-map. The ridiculous slopes will tire the enemy while they march towards you, and the extra height will extend your archers' range considerably.

After you win each battle, there should be only one general's unit of elephants left in the regional city, which you should use your peltastai and their javelins to deal with on their own. Garrison the newly conquered settlement with cheap troops and then move onto to the next Indian city, working south. When you have all three, then you will have enough money to start consolidating your position. Use Baktra as your military production settlement and India as your economic hub.

Be careful that the Saka don't invade from the North-East, and that the Seleukids don't attack India from the South-West while you build up, so extra spies in those regions are advised. If you can stop the latter two pulling a sneaky on you, then you have a successful and interesting Mid-game ahead of you. I've only out-lined the part of the strategy for the Early game, as after you've built up, you can go vastly different directions.

This has worked for me on VH/H

[Antiokhos Euergetes]

Perhaps I will add some stone walls, extra garrisons and a few roaming armies of Indians

[smoesville]

I waited for AS to betray me since i was making money while we maintained the alliance. Things went all to hell after a while and i was reduced to Kophen by Pahlava, AS and the Saka, i then expanded into India and solidified my hold on power. Then i started to expand back West and in a twist AS had been driven to near destruction by the Ptolomies and agreed to first peace and then an alliance I've done my best to keep them alive since retaking Bactria proper mostly because i dislike when factions die out.

[Antiokhos Euergetes]

I waited for AS to betray me since i was making money while we maintained the alliance. Things went all to hell after a while and i was reduced to Kophen by Pahlava, AS and the Saka, i then expanded into India and solidified my hold on power. Then i started to expand back West and in a twist AS had been driven to near destruction by the Ptolomies and agreed to first peace and then an alliance I've done my best to keep them alive since retaking Bactria proper mostly because i dislike when factions die out.

I am having the experience other way around in my AS campaign, I am defending Baktria from the Saka and Pahlava

[Entropy Judge]

Many suggested Sweboz among others, i played with them, but got tired from all the infantry and no cavalry.

Sweboz have cavalry. Granted Reidonez are pretty meh in the grand scheme of things, but Leuce Epos are extremely awesome, and Marxolitho Wolxiskod are great (for the MW, Luguow is probably the nearest area that's reasonably easy to take). Granted, you need to wait a long time for the Xosenthozez Marxoreidonijoi (or mod the reform requirements a bit ...), but once they do come into play they can really kick ass.

2) When you besiege a city, do you attack or wait for them to starve and sally? (i always wait)

Depends on the unit mix I have and that my enemy has, wall level, and my faction. Generally, I like to starve them out, breaking the siege and renewing it if they haven't been dropped to a low enough level, but if it's only Wooden Walls or a small group (or a Barbarian settlement, which I don't usually have problems fighting in), then I'll storm them.

[Team Sleep]

The siege question.

I always attempt to starve out the competition. The only time I will release is if I KNOW the enemy has significant reinforcements in the area. At that point...separate the two armies by drawing them away from each other, fight regroup lay siege. Odds are always better to wait them out.

[Stath's]

@andrew_murphy I will try that and let you know. Thank you very much for the detailed instructions

[andrew.murphy1]

@andrew_murphy I will try that and let you know. Thank you very much for the detailed instructions

Np happy campaigning!

[The Sloth]

I love playing as Baktra. My only issue is that in my campaigns, Rome tends to get kicked out of Italy by Carthage. No Romans = no marian reforms = no improved baktrian bodyguards. Does anyone know what I could do to get my bodyguards? They just look so cool...

[The Kybrothilian]

I love playing as Baktra. My only issue is that in my campaigns, Rome tends to get kicked out of Italy by Carthage. No Romans = no marian reforms = no improved baktrian bodyguards. Does anyone know what I could do to get my bodyguards? They just look so cool...

Install Force diplomacy minimod, send diplomats to Carthage and Rome, use the force diplomacy to take the Italian cities from Carthage and give them to Rome.

[The Sloth]

Thank you. I guess there isn't any easier solution. Or maybe I could just use the money cheat to bribe the carthaginian armies away.

[tarem]

2) When you besiege a city, do you attack or wait for them to starve and sally? (i always wait)

I try to avoid urban warfare as much as possible (way too much chaos and death in it, more then in forests actually), so i usually wait for them the mount a field army and then i besiege their city. The field army will come to relieve the siege and i defeat both the army and the garrison in the open. If both the garrison and the army are full stacks in size, i usually bring along some backup captain with me too. I only storm large walls and above, if i the enemy garrison is 10 or less units it size. I assume i am having a full stack or an almost full stack.

Edit: Bactria is probably my favorite faction in this mod (and in history), with Carthage in close second, but somehow i have always failed to play a full campaign with them...

[Entropy Judge]

Or teleport the Carthaginian armies to some harmless island somewhere. Or get the Romans to accept a region where you can protect them from external threats to prevent them from dying off, then gift them a suitably large city in Italy to trigger the Reforms.

[HUtH]

Well, finally I conquered Indian provinces... Elephants? Pfff, epic cheap anti-elephant weapons: the Dahaeans(spelling) and the Arachosians.
I must say that I've become a great fan of javelins(what would it be in greek? philakon or smth like that? ), now I'm trying to make army with the most amount of units with javelin What a shame that phalangitai don't use them lol


Though now an odd idea crossed my mind... in Opiana was a general with elephant unit(x2 bigger than normal unit)... maybe I could have bribe him... Anyone have done it? Would it be possible? It'd be great to have such a general
I don't know if I have savegame before Opiana's capture, will check later...