The Role of the EU in geopolitics : Bringing about the NWO.

[Menelik_I]

I Heard many times people, on TV and discussions, justify the EU has being a way for Europe to counter balance the USA and China, anything between cocky dreams of EU superpower status to balancing the geopolitical landscape. Now the prefered tune in Europe is Federal Union, despite the derision the likes of Nigel Farage for years for saying that the EU was a federal project, never mind.

I contend that the purpose of the EU is not to counter balance the USA, China or India, and much less to become a superpower, because the Europeans don't have the stomach for these kind of imperial duties, nor can the afford the expense or even be willing to scale back their welfare state in order to afford these ambitions, in fact the EU will always be under the USA military umbrella, the EU purpose is to be setting block for a One World government, in 2 ways.

1- Forget Alex Jonex, the advent of the NWO won't have black helicopters or UN troops, it will happens via a boring 3 hours discourse by some Herman Van Rumpuy like drone after 20 of insane bureaucratic process, just like the EU Federal state. In this context we might think of the EU has the preliminary stage, with the constitution of a orderly government over the European provinces of the World Government, under safekeeping and Financial backing of the American and Russian political elites. It will be much more easier to integrate a single European Federal state into a global federal structure than doing so with 20 so states, in part because the Europeans citizens are being trained into the art of receiving orders from outside their countries for at least 20 years.

2- The EU will catalyze the emergence of similar blocks in other continents, either by imitation or inducements, thus facilitating the global government by reducing the number of sovereign entities and training people into the EU-style consensus governance.
An example of such is the African Union, a giant bureaucratic copy of the EU on a auto pilot flight to continent political and monetary Union ... without any democratic approval whatsoever, just their European teachers.

The EU is already effectively a Federal State of sorts, despite the lack of official announcement of such and the denial of EU supporters, and the World government if set up will be in similar manner by first setting up the mechanism of control and only when these are installed beyond any hope of removal are we going to wear Nazi Uniforms and kill giant bugs like in Starship Troopers.

PS: Just to clarify that I don't believe in A NWO conspiracy, there are various NWO conspiracies, sometimes competing with each others and sometimes cooperating with each other. These conspiracies are not national, and can be made of elites of various countries, but that is something for another thread.

[Basil II the B.S]

The UK is the US puppet in the EU. Kicking them out is a necessary condition fot the EU to depart from the American hegemony.
France is against American influence in Europe since the times of De Gaulle. Germany would rather follow them than the over-seas partner. It takes time and it's not even an immediate priority.
Depending on how the crisis goes and how long it will take for continental Europe to lose patience with the UK, the EU won't be an American tool.

[Menelik_I]

The UK is the US puppet in the EU. Kicking them out is a necessary condition fot the EU to depart from the American hegemony.

The American Nuclear Umbrella was the only thing preventing Europe of Becoming a Russian Tank parking lot.

The EU is never going to supplant or become independent from the USA, the only thing that can happen is that the EU is used by European and American Elites to better integrate Europe and the USA in a world government with the EU and NATO.

France is against American influence in Europe since the times of De Gaulle.

Drama to make History books interesting, the political Elites of Europe and part of those of the USA wouldn't take it badly to build a world government in their command, nationality is purely optional in their minds already.

[removeduser_487563287433]

[Cesarz]

[Aetius]

^2 people who shut off any thinking after seeing the word "NWO"

Yes, every day the world is moving towards a more centralized oligarchic system. Anyone with a brain can see that the general trend is for wealthy people and or organizations to facilitate a steady progression away from sovereign entities. We live in a world where major powers are all at peace, so now wealth accumulates and centralizes, along with power, this is a trend in history. This theory can be applied to individuals as well as countries. Ultimately the dream of a powerful interconnected groups essentially ruling the world is coming closer than ever. A mistake though is to think this is all being orchestrated from a central shadow orginization or something stupid, when it is more like a natural process akin to evolution.

[Menelik_I]

A mistake though is to think this is all being orchestrated from a central shadow orginization or something stupid, when it is more like a natural process akin to evolution.

You are right that there is not a single group, akin to the Bilderberg, who wants to rule the world, but probably various groups and schemes running at the same time.

I wouldn't call it a natural process because this is the fruit of people writing books, advocating a world government and then acting on these ideas in official policy and NGOs around the globe. The only thing natural would be human ambition, which is the thing fueling a lot of these people.

[Caelifer_1991]

I don't see why you seem to love the idea of the world being divided into artifical borders drawn on the map, whose only relevance is their reflection of historical conflicts of minimal importance now, anyway. Greater cooperation and unity in the world is generally a good thing, and people will still compete with each other as much as they have ever done, it's human nature.

A world with a Federal EU and many other regional bodies reminiscient of such around the world, seems like a step in the right direction; and if our differences fade over time enough that such transformations happen on a global scale too at some point, well, why not?

It's not as if there's any reason to assume that increasing global interconnectivity and cooperation is inevitably going to further segregate people along class lines or anything, if anything, having access to the entire world market with minimal interuptions to trade and good ideas seems like a leveling factor, even if some gain more political power than is possible on merely a national scale.

[Menelik_I]

I don't see why you seem to love the idea of the world being divided into artifical borders drawn on the map, whose only relevance is their reflection of historical conflicts of minimal importance now, anyway. Greater cooperation and unity in the world is generally a good thing, and people will still compete with each other as much as they have ever done, it's human nature.

A world with a Federal EU and many other regional bodies reminiscient of such around the world, seems like a step in the right direction; and if our differences fade over time enough that such transformations happen on a global scale too at some point, well, why not?

It's not as if there's any reason to assume that increasing global interconnectivity and cooperation is inevitably going to further segregate people along class lines or anything, if anything, having access to the entire world market with minimal interuptions to trade and good ideas seems like a leveling factor, even if some gain more political power than is possible on merely a national scale.

The borders are not artificial, they in part divide different cultural realms, and also enable a better world because a 1920's style level of stupidity apart, it is kind of hard for all countries to commit suicide by sheer idiocy like the EU have just done with their idiotic economic policy.

The strength of the USA for example is that besides being a big and populous country, it is also a somewhat decentralized one so that stupidity don't sink the whole boat at once.

[Invictus XII]

I don't see why you seem to love the idea of the world being divided into artifical borders drawn on the map, whose only relevance is their reflection of historical conflicts of minimal importance now, anyway. Greater cooperation and unity in the world is generally a good thing, and people will still compete with each other as much as they have ever done, it's human nature.

A world with a Federal EU and many other regional bodies reminiscient of such around the world, seems like a step in the right direction; and if our differences fade over time enough that such transformations happen on a global scale too at some point, well, why not?

It's not as if there's any reason to assume that increasing global interconnectivity and cooperation is inevitably going to further segregate people along class lines or anything, if anything, having access to the entire world market with minimal interuptions to trade and good ideas seems like a leveling factor, even if some gain more political power than is possible on merely a national scale.

There are so many problems with centralising power. As the old saying goes, don't put all your eggs in the same basket. Diversity is good, it makes life interesting. Imagine if the world was forever at peace, how horrible it would be. That was one of the contributions to the First World War, peace time is dreary, long and makes life meaningless. It doesn't allow for experiences, dangers, and resolutions. We need greater diversity in this world. All ready the west has to much influence over the east, and they are losing their identity. Why? So we can all live in comfort and ease, what joy is there in that?

[Condottiere 40K]

The other possibility is that the world splinters and sub-national entities become sovereign, such as megacorporations.

[Caelifer_1991]

The borders are not artificial, they in part divide different cultural realms, and also enable a better world because a 1920's style level of stupidity apart, it is kind of hard for all countries to commit suicide by sheer idiocy like the EU have just done with their idiotic economic policy.

The strength of the USA for example is that besides being a big and populous country, it is also a somewhat decentralized one so that stupidity don't sink the whole boat at once.

Individual cultures only grew because of various groups of people being seperate from each other, cultures are already homogenizing with increased global economic interconnectivity, political cooperation, and communication such as is offered by the internet. If culture is a reason to resist integration, then it's gradual homogenization is only reason for such to take time, as it does anyway even if only to ensure that it is done properly.

The EU has not commit suicide, if it was going to fall apart, it would have done already. Also the main flaw with the EU economic policy, is that it had been prevented from working properly by being subject to individual national economic policy that has largely prevented it from being significant, and the relevant tools being in the hands of such national sovereignties. The EU policy makers cannot be held responsible for the mistakes made on national levels. Even if you want to point to Greece, then that is their own fault for lying about their economic situation prior to joining, if they had followed the guidelines (including the requirements for joining) they would not have faltered as they did.

Also the strength of the USA is not in it's decentralization, but in the opposite. It has the ability to direct the resources of what is, thanks to being one entity, the largest economy in the world at whichever priority is useful to all it's constituent states. It's level of decentralization is simply sufficient to make such work more efficiently.

[Menelik_I]

Individual cultures only grew because of various groups of people being seperate from each other, cultures are already homogenizing with increased global economic interconnectivity, political cooperation, and communication such as is offered by the internet. If culture is a reason to resist integration, then it's gradual homogenization is only reason for such to take time, as it does anyway even if only to ensure that it is done properly.

The EU has not commit suicide, if it was going to fall apart, it would have done already. Also the main flaw with the EU economic policy, is that it had been prevented from working properly by being subject to individual national economic policy that has largely prevented it from being significant, and the relevant tools being in the hands of such national sovereignties. The EU policy makers cannot be held responsible for the mistakes made on national levels. Even if you want to point to Greece, then that is their own fault for lying about their economic situation prior to joining, if they had followed the guidelines (including the requirements for joining) they would not have faltered as they did.

Also the strength of the USA is not in it's decentralization, but in the opposite. It has the ability to direct the resources of what is, thanks to being one entity, the largest economy in the world at whichever priority is useful to all it's constituent states. It's level of decentralization is simply sufficient to make such work more efficiently.

Beyond a certain size it is impossible to have a democracy, such that a planetary government will never be democratic, unless a false cosmetic democracy is of taste this days. There is simply no way to effectively vote out your Global World President if you are citizens of a small country who just happened to be screwed at the profit of other people.

It take something like 30 years for the USA to swing from a strong left-wing policy to a strong right wing policy and back, how long would it take to realize such political change in a Planetary scale ? I would dare say that it would take at least 150 years, such that there is no reason to bother because nobody will ever live long enough to see his political grievances solved.

It is simply impossible and Dictatorship is the only way it can be run.

[Mangalore]

...

It take something like 30 years for the USA to swing from a strong left-wing policy to a strong right wing policy and back, how long would it take to realize such political change in a Planetary scale ? I would dare say that it would take at least 150 years, such that there is no reason to bother because nobody will ever live long enough to see his political grievances solved.

It is simply impossible and Dictatorship is the only way it can be run.

No, it wouldn't. It would fail for the same reason as a democracy: Lack of cohesion and common interest, let alone no understanding of a united concept of democracy. In comparison every European state in the EU has a grasp of a liberal representative democratic system. With China and a bunch of other states an entirely different system would compete with that and individual nationalities wouldn't let themselves get submitted to such an entity. Add different lifestyles (e.g. Islamic world vs. the West) and you get no basis of operating within one government and society (as a government is solely the representative of a society).
Again, in comparison the EU is a unified entity in terms of general ideology and political systems.

Other than that the notion that scaling democracy somehow makes it slower appears a bit unrealistic. The speed of a representative democracy depends on the delegation of representative powers and streamlining election processes, not on size. Also political shifts are caused by changes in the development of a nation, not just because it would be about time to do so. Boring politics is usually a sign of a stable democracy and this can imply long stable political trends on the political spectrum.
In contrast fast changes happen in "interesting times" when a society is not quite certain how the future is best secured. And interesting times usually imply instability.

[Caelifer_1991]

Beyond a certain size it is impossible to have a democracy, such that a planetary government will never be democratic, unless a false cosmetic democracy is of taste this days. There is simply no way to effectively vote out your Global World President if you are citizens of a small country who just happened to be screwed at the profit of other people.

It take something like 30 years for the USA to swing from a strong left-wing policy to a strong right wing policy and back, how long would it take to realize such political change in a Planetary scale ? I would dare say that it would take at least 150 years, such that there is no reason to bother because nobody will ever live long enough to see his political grievances solved.

It is simply impossible and Dictatorship is the only way it can be run

If economic imperitives are largely universal and security is no longer a factor due to the dissolution of borders and individual states (assuming a lack of rebel groups) then voting on a global scale would be little different to voting on a national scale whereby national priorities are equally similar. As things homogenize, these issues become less significant. Certainly the world is not yet ready for a global order, but perhaps in several hundred years it might be.

As for the US, it has never been either far left or far right, it has generally simply resided at the center right with limited movement in either direction, a trend that continues on today.

As for the possibility of a one world order, I disagree. Such a state of affairs can only exist in a democratic state, since otherwise it would inevitably fracture. Supranational organizations that clearly do not serve the interests of all constituent nations, do not last, and states of any size that do not serve their citizens, are equally temporary in their existence.

[Thorn777]

^

Borders = rule of law
Rule of law = important

dont be naive

[Condottiere 40K]

Latent racism will ensure that borders will continue.

[Aanker]

Read NWO in thread title. Read the OP thinking that it might just not be that centered on conspiracy theories. Was proven wrong.

Is there any actual, significant evidence that supports this? Most seems to point towards the EU working to, for instance, make itself a more important world entity.

[Menelik_I]

Read NWO in thread title. Read the OP thinking that it might just not be that centered on conspiracy theories. Was proven wrong.

I used the New World Order like George H. W. Bush did in 1992, to describe a geopolitical order different from the present, and which I qualified as being a world government, Bush qualification in that discourse was different.

So don't go Alex Jones on me and start screaming conspiracy theory each time you read NWO.

Most seems to point towards the EU working to, for instance, make itself a more important world entity.

To become such the EU would need to outgrow the American Nuclear umbrella, thing they are not doing and in fact they are diminishing their military. It is more likely for the EU to be absorbed in a Neo Soviet Eurasian union than becoming a world power.

European Unity is the priority before Economic power or military self-reliance.

[Vhakazar]

I used the New World Order like George H. W. Bush did in 1992, to describe a geopolitical order different from the present, and which I qualified as being a world government, Bush qualification in that discourse was different.

So don't go Alex Jones on me and start screaming conspiracy theory each time you read NWO.



To become such the EU would need to outgrow the American Nuclear umbrella, thing they are not doing and in fact they are diminishing their military. It is more likely for the EU to be absorbed in a Neo Soviet Eurasian union than becoming a world power.

European Unity is the priority before Economic power or military self-reliance.

Mmmm. Don't be so defeatist about the EU's chances, that's very middle class. First there is no such thing as an "American Nuclear Umbrella". The nuclear systems in Europe are maintained by the Nato. Although I do realize the USA has great influence, the Nato is not entirely subjugated to the US.

Secondly, the European armies (the armies of the member states) are more than adequate in defending their own interests. The German Bundeswehr and the French army (especially the Force de Frappe) will not hesitate to defend their own lands and the land of their European brothers. We do not need the USA to hold our hands, thankyouverymuch. Indeed, defence cuts were made, but the USA might better to the same to prevent the total destruction of it's economy.

That brings us to the last point of importance. Economical power is as important as military power. And whilst the EU is having some issues there, we're not alone at all. The European economy will recover, but that will demand some time. The advantage of this crisis is that, in the long term, it will strengthen the Union.

Uniting the EU is a necessary step to protect our wealth, our dwindling power and our identity. And whilst a united Europe might not necessary become a superpower, we will not have to bow for the wishes of the USA, China, India or Russia. And perhaps if fewer supranational institutions exist, the creation of a united world becomes more plausible. But first, let Europe centralize itself. In a few years we will realise it is either that or total oblivion. We will get there, after a certain time