What NEW TW game do you want after RTW2? (with maps!)

[Intranetusa]

What NEW Total War game do you want after RTW2? (no sequels such as MTW3)
Use the maps below to help your decision. Pick 3 please!

Ancient TW:
Warring States to Qin Empire
Han Dynasty & Three Kingdoms
Parthian Empire
Seleucid Empire
Sassanian Empire
Mauryan Empire
Medieval TW:
Tang Empire
Mongol Empire
Song Empire
Late & Post-Medieval:
Ottoman Empire
Ming Empire
Victoria TW (Emphasis/focused mainly on Great Britain)

[austin.weathers]

I know you said pick 3, but there is only 1 I wanna see, and it involves and empire that the sun could not go down on.

[Colonel Dax]

Victoria, first and foremost.

Failing that, however, I'd be happy with China's Warring States period, or the Three Kingdoms period.

[Intranetusa]

I know you said pick 3, but there is only 1 I wanna see, and it involves and empire that the sun could not go down on.

Man, you have no imagination or curiosity...

Victoria, first and foremost.
Failing that, however, I'd be happy with China's Warring States period, or the Three Kingdoms period.

I'm thinking similar to Empire: TW, but better guns, cannons, and ironclad ships? Anglo-Zulu War seems like it'd be an interesting DLC. I always pitting masses of melee infantry vs infantry with guns.

[Gandalfus]

When did the Sassanian empire ever reach that extent? If my knowledge is correct, they were at a constant stalemate with the Romans and never took and held terittory west of Carrhae

[Intranetusa]

When did the Sassanian empire ever reach that extent? If my knowledge is correct, they were at a constant stalemate with the Romans and never took and held terittory west of Carrhae

It is the territorial height of the Sassanian Empire at the end of the 6th century. I believe the Eastern Romans contested the region in Turkey once again in the 7th century.

[Xerrop]

When did the Sassanian empire ever reach that extent? If my knowledge is correct, they were at a constant stalemate with the Romans and never took and held terittory west of Carrhae

The maximum extent of the Sassanids shown in this map happened between 610 and 629 when the Persians conquered Syria, Egypt and parts of Asia Minor. Egypt for example was conquered somewhere somewhere between 616 and 620 - and became a regular sassanid province in 620. But only a decade later starting in 629 their troops and administrators had to leave.

Just take a look on the wikipedia article about this long and destructive war:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzanti...War_of_602–628

p.s. the southern Arab provinces have been incorporated earlier during the 6th century. Starting with the Aksumite-Yemenite War in the 520's when the Sassanids supported the Arabs while the Byzantines supported the Africans. Later on around 570 Persian influence in Yemen was strong enough to allow the installation of a Sassanid province.

[Count von Orlok]

Victorian TW would be great. Colonial wars(mostly british), German unification(Prussia-Austria-France), Italian unification, Crimean War ,American Civil war etc and all these in a huge map (similar to Empire's) with railroads and ironclads.

[Count von Orlok]

Victorian TW would be great. Colonial wars(mostly british), German unification(Prussia-Austria-France), Italian unification, Crimean War ,American Civil war etc and all these in a huge map (similar to Empire's) with railroads and ironclads.

[Xerrop]

What is this for a strange poll?
The only real options would be Warring States and Victoria TW. As this would be unique eras with different factions involved. All other options are only random selected Empires already present in some TW games or without any storyline or an era to make a full game of it.

Parthian and Seleucid Empire are playable in Rome:TW as two of their main enemies, while the Sassanid Empire is featured in Barbarian Invasion and all mods dealing with Late Antiquity.
In some mods the Mauryan Empire is also playable - and if the map is expanded eastwards in Rome2 maybe we can even play them in Rome2?
The Rise of the Ottoman Empire was playable in Medieval:TW and slow decline in Empire:TW.
Mongol Empire and Song Empire were the main forces clashing in the east during the 13th century during the reign of Genghis Khan and Kubilai Khan - so it would be only one TW game!
Also the Ming Empire was established by a Chinese Dynasty fighting against the Mongols (who destroyed the Song Empire 60 years before). It could be part of a Fall of the Mongols-DLC or Standalone expansion.
And again the Ottoman Empire would also be a playable (or major nonplayable) faction in a possible Victoria:TW as a difficult faction short before it's collapse.

[Intranetusa]

What is this for a strange poll?
The only real options would be Warring States and Victoria TW. As this would be unique eras with different factions involved.

Did you post this on opposite day?

Victoria focused on GB would mostly be a naval superpower curb stomping pre-industrial civilizations. It wouldn't be that unique since it's mostly asymmetrical warfare. Of course you can throw in other European powers into the mix, but then you would take the emphasis off of British expansion.colonies in Asia, Africa, and the Americas.

Other ancient Sinictic time periods would be far more unique than the Warring States. Although it should be noted that the Warring States kingdoms each had their own distinct culture, weaponry/armor, etc, the conflict or trade & diplomacy did not spread beyond their boundaries.

The Han Dynasty on the other hand, if you take a look at the map, went from the Warring States to an empire that stretched from the sea of Japan to the borders of the Parthian & Kushan Empires. Their trade routes went all the way to the heart of the Roman Empire. A Han army campaigned deep into Central Asia, reached the Caspian Sea, and sent scouts to the Persian Gulf. Trajan's army came within a day's march of a Han fortification. There is a huge potential for a Han Dynasty game to become an East Asia "Rome Total War" type game - a Total War game with plenty of unit diversity and plenty of totally distinct civilizations.

The Tang Empire also stretched into Central Asia in the west and the northern borders of Korea in the East, with its power projection felt far and wide, stretching west to the Caspian Sea. Historically, the Tang even fought the Arab Abbasid Caliphate for control of Central Asia. The later rulers of the Abbasid Caliphate (boundaries stretching to West Africa) were on friendly terms with the Tang and even sent troops to help the Tang Empire recapture the Tang capital.

All other options are only random selected Empires already present in some TW games or without any storyline or an era to make a full game of it. Parthian and Seleucid Empire are playable in Rome:TW as two of their main enemies, while the Sassanid Empire is featured in Barbarian Invasion and all mods dealing with Late Antiquity.
In some mods the Mauryan Empire is also playable - and if the map is expanded eastwards in Rome2 maybe we can even play them in Rome2?

The Parthians, Seleucids, and Sassanids all had their empire cut in half at the Caspian sea. None of them have been accurately or even remotely fully portrayed except in mods, and even those don't portray their eastern conflicts, trade, and diplomacy. Even in mods that portray the Mauryan Empire, you only see a small portion of the north western empire.

So none of those factions listed have been adequately or fully portrayed. Considering how large the Persian-based empires were and the fact they were in the center of civilization for the Eastern Hemisphere, I see huge potential for those empires to become great TW games.

The Rise of the Ottoman Empire was playable in Medieval:TW and slow decline in Empire:TW... And again the Ottoman Empire would also be a playable (or major nonplayable) faction in a possible Victoria:TW as a difficult faction short before it's collapse.

You have a better point about the Ottomans than you do about the others, but even for the Ottoman Empire, it has not fully portrayed due to the fact the Ottomans reached their peak after MTW and before ETW. Furthermore, again, the games cut off the Ottomans right at their boundary, and don't adequately portray the full extend of their conflicts, trade, diplomacy etc

Mongol Empire and Song Empire were the main forces clashing in the east during the 13th century during the reign of Genghis Khan and Kubilai Khan - so it would be only one TW game!

That is totally incorrect. The Song also clashed with the Xia Xia Empire, Tibetans, and Khitan Liao Dynasty. They also fought he Ly Dynasty, Southern Han, and the Jin Dynasty - the former two kingdoms having war elephant corps and the later being a steppe & sedentary empire, had one of the largest cavalry armies in the world. The Song also increased their influence into the Indian Ocean due to the decline of the Chola Dynasty. The influence of the Song was so strong that the rulers of the Fatimid Caliphate of North Africa sent gifts to the Song emperor.

I see no reason why a Song map can't expand to parts of northern India, East to Japan, and west into the the Khwarezm Empire of the Middle East.

Also the Ming Empire was established by a Chinese Dynasty fighting against the Mongols (who destroyed the Song Empire 60 years before). It could be part of a Fall of the Mongols-DLC or Standalone expansion.

The Ming also had had the largest and most advanced blue water naval fleet in the world in the 15th century, which sailed around the world in power projection voyages, reaching at least the coasts of Africa to spread their influence and create new trade routes. There is more to the Ming than just fighting the Mongols.

Where's Victoria?

The last option, #12.

[Gandalfus]

Yeah, that doesn't really count because heraclius recon queried them and then the Muslim conquest was not a short time later, so they didn't really "occupy" it for very long.

[The Useless Member]

Where's Victoria?

[King Beowulf]

No more tw games based on one culture please....but Victoria Total War calls out to me the most out of all of these

[Intranetusa]

No more tw games based on one culture please....but Victoria Total War calls out to me the most out of all of these

None of those civilizations in the poll would be based on just one culture, in the same sense "Rome" Total War wasn't based on just one culture.

The only Total War game that has ever been based on just one culture has been Shogun 1 and Shogun 2. It's impossible for a TW game to be based on just one culture unless they are isolated on an island.

[King Beowulf]

Your correct saying that Rome wasn't just focused on one culture but lets face it, before barbarian invasion most of the European tribes and Egypt had been given almost near to no thought at all while Rome was by far the most detailed (not complaining, I just would have preferred the same amount of effort to be placed into other factions).

[Intranetusa]

Your correct saying that Rome wasn't just focused on one culture but lets face it, before barbarian invasion most of the European tribes and Egypt had been given almost near to no thought at all while Rome was by far the most detailed (not complaining, I just would have preferred the same amount of effort to be placed into other factions).

For time & expenses purposes, CA will either focus on a single culture with high detail (Shogun) or multiple cultures with less detail with a few "primary" cultures (RTW/MTW/etc). Victoria Total War would probably be the later to the extreme - focused on primarily Great Britain and everyone else as peasants, barbarians, or savages.

There is no way there would be more detail into the other factions unless it's a historical mod like Europa Barbarorum.

[King Beowulf]

Although with Shogun....the clans all seemed to have very similar units as a result of a mono-culture game. But my statements aside I believe there wouldn't be enough of a target audience for most of these listed, possibly warring states, mongol, and ottoman but other than that it does seem rather limited. Most of the CA's customers are really either European or American and as such most (not all) would prefer games relating to their culture with the exception of Shogun as samurai's have been so hyped up through anime and such throughout the years everyone seems to think they have superpowers being the best warrior in the world, overhyped katana etc....

[Intranetusa]

Although with Shogun....the clans all seemed to have very similar units as a result of a mono-culture game.

Shogun was on an island. If RTW was a game that included only the Romans and transported them to an island, it would be the same as Shogun.

But historically, most or all of the empires listed in the poll weren't mono-culture, and all of them had conflicts, trade, diplomacy with many different civilizations. Any one of them would be far more diverse than Shogun.

But my statements aside I believe there wouldn't be enough of a target audience for most of these listed, possibly warring states, mongol, and ottoman but other than that it does seem rather limited. Most of the CA's customers are really either European or American and as such most (not all) would prefer games relating to their culture with the exception of Shogun as samurai's have been so hyped up through anime and such throughout the years everyone seems to think they have superpowers being the best warrior in the world, overhyped katana etc....

The vast majority of TW players don't play for history - they just want to see masses of soldiers killing each other. Napleon TW as an historical era appeals to an extremely small group of people and it was almost a remake of Empire, but it still did well. I doubt there would be a lot trouble with a game just because it had a setting that is not as well known to a lot of people. Watching anime and playing TW is totally different...and I don't think people who played STW/S2TW really care that much about Japanese hype or history.

I'm a history buff and I got Medieval 2 Total War despite the fact I don't particularly like or care about any of the factions in the game.

Prince of Persia and Assassin's Creed both did very well despite taking place in ancient Persia and the Middle East, both places that are arguably unknown to most Western audiences.

[King Beowulf]

You are correct in mentioning Prince of Persia and Assassin's Creed however there is a larger market for those types of games, it is very action-packed almost everywhere you turn but in total war games you would get a completely different audience due to it's slower and more thought-provoking pace so I think the sorts of dynasties which not many people have heard about and/or relates to them still applies but hey it depends on how you see it in your perspective.

I'm also a history buff but then, I'm terribly versed in eastern-history as it just does not appeal to me and as such shogun (to me) just doesn't have that interest which I share with Rome, Medieval and Empire.