Chimp strength

[Kitsunegari]

I've been kind of curious about this for a while, and today i saw this. So, relative to humans, how strong are chimps? I've heard some say that on average they are much stronger than any human, but i guess this is an exaggeration? It would make sense though, since they are far less capable of manipulating their environment and therefore need to rely on sheer power more than us.

[Visna]

I've been kind of curious about this for a while, and today i saw this. So, relative to humans, how strong are chimps? I've heard some say that on average they are much stronger than any human, but i guess this is an exaggeration? It would make sense though, since they are far less capable of manipulating their environment and therefore need to rely on sheer power more than us.

The muscles in all species are specialized, so it's difficult to compare. Without being too sure, I suppose a bodybuilder could, say, benchpress more than a chimp (if you could even get a chimp to do it in the first place), but that same bodybuilder will be rediculously outmatched at grasping, dead weight lifting or pulling for example. Chimps can easily break human bones by grasping, and I read an article once about a pissed off (female!) chimp pulling something like 1300 pounds in one hand. Imagine what a male could. *shudder*

[Kitsunegari]

Right, even though we are very closely related, their muscular structure developed very differently i'm sure. Also, now i have the image of a chimp cranking out 300+ lb reps on the bench at my gym

[Phier]

One theory is that in part it is due to our fine motor control. Humans have more control over their muscles, which while it means we can do delicate tasks, it also means we don't always have ALL of our muscle power working for us and there might even be some inhibiting of the fibers.

[Col. Tartleton]

Don't forget retarded chimps. Between chimp strength and retard strength they're like super heroes.

[boofhead]

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0330200829.htm

ScienceDaily (Mar. 30, 2009) — February's brutal chimpanzee attack, during which a pet chimp inflicted devastating injuries on a Connecticut woman, was a stark reminder that chimps are much stronger than humans—as much as four-times stronger, some researchers believe. But what is it that makes our closest primate cousins so much stronger than we are? One possible explanation is that great apes simply have more powerful muscles.

Indeed, biologists have uncovered differences in muscle architecture between chimpanzees and humans. But evolutionary biologist Alan Walker, a professor at Penn State University, thinks muscles may only be part of the story.

In an article published in the April issue of Current Anthropology, Walker argues that humans may lack the strength of chimps because our nervous systems exert more control over our muscles. Our fine motor control prevents great feats of strength, but allows us to perform delicate and uniquely human tasks.

Walker's hypothesis stems partly from a finding by primatologist Ann MacLarnon. MacLarnon showed that, relative to body mass, chimps have much less grey matter in their spinal cords than humans have. Spinal grey matter contains large numbers of motor neurons—nerves cells that connect to muscle fibers and regulate muscle movement.

More grey matter in humans means more motor neurons, Walker proposes. And having more motor neurons means more muscle control.

Our surplus motor neurons allow us to engage smaller portions of our muscles at any given time. We can engage just a few muscle fibers for delicate tasks like threading a needle, and progressively more for tasks that require more force. Conversely, since chimps have fewer motor neurons, each neuron triggers a higher number of muscle fibers. So using a muscle becomes more of an all-or-nothing proposition for chimps. As a result, chimps often end up using more muscle than they need.

"[A]nd that is the reason apes seem so strong relative to humans," Walker writes.

Our finely-tuned motor system makes a wide variety of human tasks possible. Without it we couldn't manipulate small objects, make complex tools or throw accurately. And because we can conserve energy by using muscle gradually, we have more physical endurance—making us great distance runners.

Great apes, with their all-or-nothing muscle usage, are explosive sprinters, climbers and fighters, but not nearly as good at complex motor tasks. In other words, chimps make lousy guests in china shops.

In addition to fine motor control, Walker suspects that humans also may have a neural limit to how much muscle we use at one time. Only under very rare circumstances are these limits bypassed—as in the anecdotal reports of people able to lift cars to free trapped crash victims.

"Add to this the effect of severe electric shock, where people are often thrown violently by their own extreme muscle contraction, and it is clear that we do not contract all our muscle fibers at once," Walker writes. "So there might be a degree of cerebral inhibition in people that prevents them from damaging their muscular system that is not present, or not present to the same degree, in great apes."

Walker says that testing his hypothesis that humans have more motor neurons would be fairly straightforward. However, he concedes that testing whether humans have increased muscle inhibition could be a bit more problematic.

[Kitsunegari]

Will grey matter removal replace steroids for body builders if this is true?

[Phier]

Will grey matter removal replace steroids for body builders if this is true?

Bodybuilders no, powerlifters maybe.

[Condottiere 40K]

It's always been an urban legend that a full grown male chimp could rip your arms off.

I'm sure given our close genetic relationship with them, some bright spark will figure out a genetic treatment that will surpass steroid usage.

[John I Tzimisces]

Chimps have powerful upper bodies (I almost typed, "have upper bodies" derp) because of the way their skeleton has adapted to a still highly arboreal lifestyle, a physical trait human ancestors shared up until around homo habilis. Essentially their shoulders are articulated in such a way to facilitate hanging for long periods, almost letting them lock their arms in an upward position. Chimps being smaller yet similarly sized to humans, this means they need quite a bit of muscle to hang and swing about (bearing in mind Chimps do things like hunt arboreal monkeys).

Humans on the other hand haven't really needed arboreal adaptations for quite some time, so even humans who approach the upper body strength of chimps (3 or 4 times the strength of an average adult male human is thrown about, possibly/probably accurate, although bear in mind this is kind of a difficult thing to quantify) would still have difficulty doing things like hanging in a manner similar to chimps, again, due to the fact our shoulders simply aren't made for hanging and supporting our body weight.

[brandbll]

Who cares if they're stronger, they have a kryptonnite called bananas...

[Col. Tartleton]

Who cares if they're stronger, they have a kryptonnite called bananas...

First of all you force him to drop the banana; then, second, you eat the banana, thus disarming him. You have now rendered him 'elpless.

[flota]

so in a "hand-to-hand" fight the chimp beat the human

[Visna]

They're pretty damn awesome at specific intelligence tasks too.



I for one welcome our new chimp overlords.

[Kitsunegari]

They're pretty damn awesome at specific intelligence tasks too.



I for one welcome our new chimp overlords.

That's really scary, i strongly oppose any efforts to breed intelligent chimps for use as slaves lol.

[Visna]

That's really scary, i strongly oppose any efforts to breed intelligent chimps for use as slaves lol.

It's quite interesting stuff, they have an extraordinary photographic memory, the shortest timespan the numbers were shown was 210 miliseconds. And they got it right pretty much every single time.

[Adar]

Chimps are well adapted at beating up middle aged women.

This is what happens versus nerdy biologist


They are certainly stronger and more compact than humans which combined with their dirty fighting techniques make them a nasty opponent.

But I think that what saved us during the "good old days" was that we were much better at fighting as a team with primitive weapons.

[John I Tzimisces]

so in a "hand-to-hand" fight the chimp beat the human

in "hand to hand fights" that have happened, typically the chimp subdues the human by beating him/her mercilessly, all the while biting (off) fingers and face, and ripping at the genitals.

so...it's never really a fight. Unless there's like two humans, in which case one is getting beaten savagely and the other is desperately trying to fend off the chimp with a shovel or whatever is handy. Not sure that really counts as a fight either.

[Condottiere 40K]

Or very, very angry.

[Condottiere 40K]

Or the chimps chased us out of the trees, and we adapted to the plains.