Russian Expansion

[Spetsnaz GRU]

I am starting a campaign as Russia and I read some guides advising not to take the eastern settlements (of Modern Russia) as the Mongols go through there and the rebel towns serve as buffers. However, what if you they invaded further south? Should I take them to boost the economy or leave them?

[Exarch]

it's up to you; you're the king after all

[complete noob:(]

I usually capture Riga and Vilnius with an army built in Novgorod, while the starting armies high-tail it down to capture Smolensk and Kiev (and Iasi if you are quick enough)

[Avatar]

You definitely want to take Kiev. For one thing, if you don't then Poland certainly will. While its the prime target of the Mongols if they appear north of the mountains, its far enough away from their spawn point that you can prepare a defence if required. If the Mongols appear in the south, then you might want to grab the eastern settlements but be aware that the Timurids are still to come, if the game lasts long enough. The eastern areas won't do a whole lot for your economy, but each region counts towards your victory target, so....

[The Unknown General]

You could always just take out Poland and Hungry at the start and capture Russia at your leisure.

[shikaka]

Taking the eastern steppe provinces _upon start_ is a waste of time:
- they are far from each other (3-4 turns, and this is when you know exaclty where they are)
- they simply don't grow (I sent a task force to take them early, and they were still useless by the time the mongols arrived - 10-20 turns of developement -: they could only train peasant archers, nowhere near dismounted dvor and the likes)
- they are dirt poor
In short: poor, difficult to improve and because of this, cannot be defended easily

The most important is either to
A) take the south coast of the baltic (Thorn). can only be done if you send your westernmost family member with cavalry only to Thorn (if you take infantry, Poland will be there first)
B) take out Poland ASAP. That is: take everything possible and throw it on the eastern polish settlement, retrain/hire mercs and take the other one. If you do this, you are free to rampage the baltic cost at your leisure.



In both cases you can take Helsinki and Stockholm (!) with some militia trained in Novgorod, and send a small force to Kiev-Kaffa. This actually is enough to 'seal off' the steppe, which you can take when you are bored.
What is very important imho as Russia is to forget the historical 'duchy of Muscuvy' 'Tsardom of Russia' crap, and go for a russian scandinavia-baltic.

[... where did it run?]

The way I do it:

First moves: start building a dockyard and novgard.

Now you have few turns left until you'll have first ship. Take prince's army to riga and capture it. Take army from the novgard garrison to helsinki and capture it (turn it into city ofc, once you have it). Take 3rd army and take Smolensk. Once you'll have Riga, you should already have ship for transportation. Take the ship to Riga, and use same army to take over stockholm. You can also take over Settin if it's not taken yet. This lil monster at their backyard will help you to deal with the poles. Having alliance with danes also helps. It's good idea to agree on one before poles do it.

Later you can take over oslo (turn it into city ofc). Just don't forget to block the passage for danes to scandinavia with a warship and you should be safe for the time being.

Now sturm Vilnius and you should be able to outproduce and outnumber poles.. and their annoying noble cavalry D:< the hate within in me for those units is strong !


Dealing with hordes: take over Kiev. Get ready to defend. With dismounted dvor as garrison (and maybe few cavalry to take out nasty trebuchets) you should be able to fend off 4 - 6 stacks. Once they finally take Kiev their army will disperse to take Vilnius, Smolensk and that other Halych (spelling) castle. After Kiev it shouldn't be hard to deal with the remains. Once it's done, train an army to take Kiev back. Timurids are even easier... since they spawn with fewer number of stacks.

Those east provinces are not worth the time and effort.

[shikaka]

Now sturm Vilnius and you should be able to outproduce and outnumber poles.. and their annoying noble cavalry D:< the hate within in me for those units is strong !

If you don't take Thorn, the poles will, and they will have the second best castle in the region. (the best castle is Bran)
They will most likely have better units then you (not that it matters much

Dealing with hordes: take over Kiev. Get ready to defend. With dismounted dvor as garrison (and maybe few cavalry to take out nasty trebuchets) you should be able to fend off 4 - 6 stacks. Once they finally take Kiev their army will disperse to take Vilnius, Smolensk and that other Halych (spelling) castle. After Kiev it shouldn't be hard to deal with the remains. Once it's done, train an army to take Kiev back. Timurids are even easier... since they spawn with fewer number of stacks.

Those east provinces are not worth the time and effort.

I think it is also worth mentioning that putting a half stack on the crossings/bridges of the river Volga can slow down the advance on Kiev. Nothing special, just crossbows and spearmen. They can weaken the mongols a bit, even when they lose.

[Silverheart]

Since the Mongols and Timurids hardly ever attack rebel settlements, I´d say it´s damn well worth it to take the eastern provinces - that way, the hordes will attack you early, and you will have plenty of chances to weaken them by sacrificing the defenders of those settlements.
And it´s also worth doing what Shikaka suggested, and placing small armies of crossbowmen and spearmen on bridges and crossings to further wear the hordes down.

However, it is correct that you shouldn´t go for those settlement first when playing as Russia. After all, the eastern settlements are mostly castles (and should be kept that way in preparation for when the hordes come), and do not generate much income or advantage due to their relative isolation and the vast distances between them. So taking them first would be a waste of time and resources, but it still worth it in the long run, if you can properly establish yourself first.
It´s far more important to first of all establish a clear frontline against Poland and Hungary - and THEN you send some small armies eastward to claim the steppes.

[Spetsnaz GRU]

Thanks everyone, you all had good advice.