Will the war on drugs end in the near future?

[Kitsunegari]

There has been legislation for partial marihuana legalization in several US states and in Europe but progress has been slow. In the meantime we have a swollen prison system (roughly one of every 100 Americans behind bars) that's nearing collapse and endemic drug related violence in Mexico, Brazil, and elsewhere. So, are we going to have a total breakdown of "law and order" here in the US and a Northern Mexico type situation in large parts of the country or will politicians finally bite the bullet and end this unwinnable war?

[brandbll]

Politicians giving up money and power to make things better for civilians, fat chance.

[Primo]

I support the idea behind the war against the drugs - but unlike the politicians I realise the futility of it, and that it can never suceed.

[greenbeard]

Probably not. You have alcohol and pharm companies who see pot as competition, and you have a private prison industry that sure as hell doesn't want to give up the revenue from countless thousands of drug war prisoners. All of these industries are hugely profitable, and therefore hugely powerful in Washington. Also influential are various law enforcement groups like the DEA who owe their livelihood to the drug war. Although they don't have as much influence as the businesses, they do have some. Add to that the fact that there's no real advantage for a politician to come out in favor of legalization. The few people who are one-issue voters on the subject tend to not exactly vote in record numbers. And the people who are very strongly against it tend to be old. Old people always vote.

Half the people in the U.S. favor legalization of pot according to recent surveys, but there are precious few politicians who are willing to go against corporate America and social conservatives at the same time with very little to gain politically from the deal.

While I simpathize with softer drug laws, full legalization would be a catastrophe because it would make cartels very Rich corporations overnight, especially the Colombian terrorists FARC, and thus legitimate access to public power in many countries including Colombia and Mexico.

Not really. With legalization, legitimate businesses (in appropriate climates) could grow coca and put the cartels out of business.

edit: also, the cartels already ARE very rich corporations! Wachovia Bank was caught laundering $378 billion for drug cartels. How many legit corporations make that kind of money?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...ico-drug-gangs

[Menelik_I]

Not really. With legalization, legitimate businesses (in appropriate climates) could grow coca and put the cartels out of business.

edit: also, the cartels already ARE very rich corporations! Wachovia Bank was caught laundering $378 billion for drug cartels. How many legit corporations make that kind of money?

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011...ico-drug-gangs

Nothing will prevent cartels of become the biggest purveyors of drugs, they already have the money and it would not be difficult for them to buy vast swaps of Coca producing lands since the legal status will bring down any political resistance against them.

[Menelik_I]

There has been legislation for partial marihuana legalization in several US states and in Europe but progress has been slow. In the meantime we have a swollen prison system (roughly one of every 100 Americans behind bars) that's nearing collapse and endemic drug related violence in Mexico, Brazil, and elsewhere. So, are we going to have a total breakdown of "law and order" here in the US and a Northern Mexico type situation in large parts of the country or will politicians finally bite the bullet and end this unwinnable war?

While I simpathize with softer drug laws, full legalization would be a catastrophe because it would make cartels very Rich corporations overnight, especially the Colombian terrorists FARC, and thus legitimate access to public power in many countries including Colombia and Mexico.

In don't think that the war on drugs is unwinnable, having zero drug consumption might be impossible, but destroying cartels and putting an end to the violence in Mexico on a pure military sense is fully possible.

[Kitsunegari]

Probably not. You have alcohol and pharm companies who see pot as competition, and you have a private prison industry that sure as hell doesn't want to give up the revenue from countless thousands of drug war prisoners. All of these industries are hugely profitable, and therefore hugely powerful in Washington. Also influential are various law enforcement groups like the DEA who owe their livelihood to the drug war.

Exactly they're basically a cartel of their own.

Half the people in the U.S. favor legalization of pot according to recent surveys, but there are precious few politicians who are willing to go against corporate America and social conservatives at the same time with very little to gain politically from the deal.

Yeah there's little to gain personallly and much to lose.

Not really. With legalization, legitimate businesses (in appropriate climates) could grow coca and put the cartels out of business.

True, who would you want to deal with, the Mexican Mafia or the Philip Morris of cocaine? The gangsters were some of the biggest supporters of Prohibition.

[Surgeon]

I think it might, at least for some drugs. People are becoming increasingly pro-pot and it's only a matter of time before they start calling for legalizing everything and politicians start getting voted in on the issue.

[molonthegreat]

All drugs should be legalized since it's not the governments business what you put into your body and it's also insane to waste billions on something that can never be won, also the thinking that it will be the cartels that profit from it is ridiculous. I mean it's not like the bootleggers became the largest alcohol producers after prohibition, furthermore if the cartels would decide to go legal what is wrong with that? It's better that they start working as a corporation and that they lay down their arms instead of basically warring against the state at the cost of thousands of lives yearly.

[Menelik_I]

All drugs should be legalized since it's not the governments business what you put into your body and it's also insane to waste billions on something that can never be won, also the thinking that it will be the cartels that profit from it is ridiculous. I mean it's not like the bootleggers became the largest alcohol producers after prohibition, furthermore if the cartels would decide to go legal what is wrong with that? It's better that they start working as a corporation and that they lay down their arms instead of basically warring against the state at the cost of thousands of lives yearly.

If you wish to ignore the consequence your policies, be my guest.

[molonthegreat]

If you wish to ignore the consequence your policies, be my guest.

Why the hell would the cartels keep fighting if drugs are legalised and how the hell would they become even richer when prices would go down and competition would increase? The facts are that cartels would either evolve into legal corporations or their main source of profit would vanish, however the best thing would obviously be to crush the cartels before legalising but that simply is not going to happen.

[Menelik_I]

Why the hell would the cartels keep fighting if drugs are legalised and how the hell would they become even richer when prices would go down and competition would increase?

The facts are that cartels would either evolve into legal corporations or their main source of profit would vanish, however the best thing would obviously be to crush the cartels before legalising but that simply is not going to happen.

Once you make it legal, the funds the cartels have become legal, no more money laundering required, so while the price of drugs might go down, they could use the money to pursue political power in various Latin American countries. Take in mind that one the biggest producers of Cocaine is the Communist FARC, who trade in narcotics to pay for the ammunition and because they are s.

I would totally respect if you tell me that it is none of your problem what happen in other countries internal politics, but that is my main objection to full legalization.

This is a very appropriate non-answer for someone who has Thomas Freaking Sowell (seriously?) in his sig.

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2010/05/m...ell-moron.html

Only Americans could find it funny to make a satire Blog about Mobuto Sesseko, I have been to Congo and I can tell you that Congolese would probably not find their national tragedy that funny. What is the funny joke, that He is a right-wing dictator according to the stupid CIA-based conspiracies?

Never again link to sites from middle class American brats who think that reading Nietzsche qualifies them to understand every single country on earth.

[molonthegreat]

Once you make it legal, the funds the cartels have become legal, no more money laundering required, so while the price of drugs might go down, they could use the money to pursue political power in various Latin American countries. Take in mind that one the biggest producers of Cocaine is the Communist FARC, who trade in narcotics to pay for the ammunition and because they are s.

I would totally respect if you tell me that it is none of your problem what happen in other countries internal politics, but that is my main objection to full legalization.

Let them, it's better that they become involved in politics and run legal corporations rather than killing thousands each year, while it may be despicable that former criminals gain power it is still much better than the situation today.

[frozenprince]

Once you make it legal, the funds the cartels have become legal, no more money laundering required, so while the price of drugs might go down, they could use the money to pursue political power in various Latin American countries. Take in mind that one the biggest producers of Cocaine is the Communist FARC, who trade in narcotics to pay for the ammunition and because they are s.

I would totally respect if you tell me that it is none of your problem what happen in other countries internal politics, but that is my main objection to full legalization.

And then they are subject to the legal aspect of now, instead of being a cartel ruled through violence and reprisals, but a massive corporate structure. That is now REQUIRED to live by the law or die.

And besides, no matter what you do the carta will still have majority control and there isn't much you can do other than wage a full scale war against them to stop it. You might as well try to impose legal sanctions on a legal company/party instead of trying to do so to a massive underground empire.

[greenbeard]

Once you make it legal, the funds the cartels have become legal, no more money laundering required, so while the price of drugs might go down, they could use the money to pursue political power in various Latin American countries. Take in mind that one the biggest producers of Cocaine is the Communist FARC, who trade in narcotics to pay for the ammunition and because they are s.

Aaah, so that's what it's really about. You oppose legalization because you're scared of leftists. Of course, this does nothing to address my point that I already accused you of avoiding, but okay!

Only Americans could find it funny to make a satire Blog about Mobuto Sesseko, I have been to Congo and I can tell you that Congolese would probably not find their national tragedy that funny. What is the funny joke, that He is a right-wing dictator according to the stupid CIA-based conspiracies?

Never again link to sites from middle class American brats who think that reading Nietzsche qualifies them to understand every single country on earth.

So, in other words, you have zero response to the actual content of that article, but pretend to be offended because all of the authors on that site ironically choose warlords as their pen names. Note that this is the only time people like you act offended for human rights: when doing so would make the other side look bad.

Read a variety of sources instead of right-wing news sites and libertarian blogs. You're a libertarian, aren't you? I can smell it from a mile away.

[greenbeard]

If you wish to ignore the consequence your policies, be my guest.

This is a very appropriate non-answer for someone who has Thomas Freaking Sowell (seriously?) in his sig.

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2010/05/m...ell-moron.html

[xcorps]

This is a very appropriate non-answer for someone who has Thomas Freaking Sowell (seriously?) in his sig.

http://www.mrdestructo.com/2010/05/m...ell-moron.html

What a wonderful peice of character assassinating tripe you just shared with us in your off topic comment.
I bet I could be a blogger. I think it might be hard, making a bunch of unsourced claims..tossing out ad hominem attacks left and right...grammar and profanity straight from a Counterstrike lobby.

Great post!

[greenbeard]

What a wonderful peice of character assassinating tripe you just shared with us in your off topic comment.
I bet I could be a blogger. I think it might be hard, making a bunch of unsourced claims..tossing out ad hominem attacks left and right...grammar and profanity straight from a Counterstrike lobby.

Great post!

Apparently character assassination is what they call it when you take apart someone's argument. Sorry you're offended by bad words.

[Kitsunegari]

All drugs should be legalized since it's not the governments business what you put into your body and it's also insane to waste billions on something that can never be won, also the thinking that it will be the cartels that profit from it is ridiculous. I mean it's not like the bootleggers became the largest alcohol producers after prohibition, furthermore if the cartels would decide to go legal what is wrong with that? It's better that they start working as a corporation and that they lay down their arms instead of basically warring against the state at the cost of thousands of lives yearly.

My thoughts exactly, unfortunately i'm not sure it will ever happen, most likely we'll have to endure what Mexico is going through now.

[Enemy of the State]

Read a variety of sources instead of right-wing news sites and libertarian blogs. You're a libertarian, aren't you? I can smell it from a mile away.

Wait, what? You can't be libertarian and support the drug war.