Physics Cards, are they the future?

[Shaun]

I found some physics cards, well a pair actually, and my question is, are they worth it? Do they take strain off of your CPU and are they the future or a gimmic?
http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/d...s.html?s=physx

[SweetDreamz]

Only if the game supports it like CellFactor or GRAW.

Right now, they are not worth it since there are barely any games that support it. Not to mention the price is just high.

Also, ATI has come up with a solution with physics. You can like buy 2 x1900's and 1 x1300 and the 1300 will do all the physics stuff as its gpu will be dedicated in doing that while you have the x1900s in Crossfire.

But really, all these "physics" is more for eyecandy IMO.

[Spiff]

Games dont really use them at the moment, i think UnrealEngine3.0 will make use of them but thats the only one i can think of for now.

Its a question of alienation. Can a developer afford to alienate every single customer who cant be bothered buying one by making a game which will feature significantly altered gameplay with the benefit of this new card?

I tend to think not, you wont need one for a while yet, its a couple of years id imagine until games really start to demand them as standard.

Think back to the days of original Quake1. It ran in software mode, everyone was happy, but there was also a second version, "GLQuake" for those who invested in a magical 3d accelerator. Think how long it was before games changed from "You get no benefit from a 3d card in this game" to "you can play it with or without this card, but its better with" and finally "You need a 3d card which supports pixel shader v2.0 to play this game". It was a matter of many years as i remember it. (incidentaly while im thinking about it, the first game i really thought "wow this is much better with my 4mb voodoo dragon 3d accelerator" was original Jedi Knight.. great game)


Ill definitely be interested to see what they do with the extra dedicated processing power as far as gameplay mechanics go though.. hopefuly it wont just be more convincing explosions..

[krazykarl]

Unreal Tournement 2007 will be the making or breaking point for Physics Accelerators, Ageia is first to the market, but ATI and Nvidia look to have some interesting tricks up thier sleeves. I hope that we dont end up with another Glide scenario, which is technically superior, but limited to one manufacturer.

[Spiff]

Physics wont be a large part of UT2k7, they dont translate well into such a largely online game so theyll be pretty much kept to a minimum in that, just for ragdolls, some projectiles and vehicles.

The new brothers in arms game on the other hand (also unrealengine) can hopefuly put them to good use in a single player environment

[TigerVX]

I really don't like Physics cards right now, simply because of the price! If they made medium range alternatives, I'd think it'd be great. But the only one out is 300 dollars!? Only the highest range of video cards puncture that price range, and that's the only price right now, it just seems kind of... Wrong doesn't it?

[krazykarl]

I really don't like Physics cards right now, simply because of the price! If they made medium range alternatives, I'd think it'd be great. But the only one out is 300 dollars!? Only the highest range of video cards puncture that price range, and that's the only price right now, it just seems kind of... Wrong doesn't it?

The fastest card you can get The Geforce 7900 GX2 is $750 (cdn) $300 is the price of a mid range graphics card. Voodoo cards were much more expensive when they first arrived.

What I want to know, is why dont they produce a version for PCIe x4 (or even x16), that bus is starting to appear on newer motherboards. The old PCI bus is quite slow, and will nodoubt become a bottleneck.

[HorseArcher]

I somehow think, that the A.I. should be addressed instead of the physics.

here is the deal today;

Sound:
Sound card

Video:
Video card

Physics:
physics card/the video card, but appeareantly the newest fastest video cards should be able to handle.

AI + everything else:
CPU

So.......why games still feature very dumb A.I.? Why can't we have even more smarter AI?
Dual-Core would be the answer?

[General Sun]

No only dual core, but now we have dual processors with quad cores (that's 8 cores maties), and one of these days quad processors with quad cores (16, ). So perhaps everything will just shrink itself back to the CPU and there would be no need for sounds and video and physics cards anymore.

But as to the original poster's question. I doubt that physics cards will come into play in this generation, perhaps the next?

[OTZ]

Depends on how they sell. I think it's reasonable to see GPU + Physics processors on one card - probably not that far into the future.

[italiano]

Archer, it's easier to attract gamers with graphics than with AI and I'd imagine it's easier/more straight forward to produce a good looking game than an intelligent one. They're running a business and have to stick to bugets, time restraints etc. We just have to hope that companies try and make the game as good as possible with the budget/time they're allowed.

[Darkragnar]

Yes i think the Physic's card are going to be part of the future , if these Ageia guys play it Smart that is introducing it and marketing it in the right way along with secureing the right deal with the Big Guys , physic's have really been overlooked in almost all the games but im glad some one finally started to take notice.

Ya there priced high but as time goes and new techniques come along thats going to drop, as for the support for games ,its just a matter of time that it grows as Spiff said games were happy running on Software mode until some one uped the ante with the 3d acceletion.
Physic's are truly an amazing thing to have in your game if you can do them right and they play a big part in Immersion nothing better to see Tree's swaying from an close by explosion.

[Sétanta]

I can see them slowely being phased in for more games, and sooner or later more and more people will buy them and in a couple of years they will be standard, just like Video Cards.

[Timmius]

Right now they actually reduce the performance. Sounds kinda silly, but it does make sense. Because there are more objects when you have a Physics card, your graphics cards also needs to render more objects. This results in a lower framerate.
So until the rest of the hardware is sufficient (DX10 maybe?), they won't be of much use. Unless you like turning the graphics quality down.

[Lee1026]

Well, the game also looks nicer, so the point about reducing performance is moot. After all, just turn back the settings a bit if you are lagging. Also, unlike graphics cards, physics cards do not offer that much more calculation per die space over CPUs, which means that in the future, we would probably rely on extra cores to do the job.

[Timmius]

Well, the game also looks nicer, so the point about reducing performance is moot. After all, just turn back the settings a bit if you are lagging. Also, unlike graphics cards, physics cards do not offer that much more calculation per die space over CPUs, which means that in the future, we would probably rely on extra cores to do the job.

Physics don't calculate polygons and vertex coordinates in space. There are a whole lot more of them with a Physics card (Just look at the difference with explosions in GRAW). It is a fact that current games run up to 15% slower with a Physics card. But I admit, there aren't many of them, so it doesn't say all that much.

[Lee1026]

I am aware what a physics card do, thank you very much. It does add more detail to the game. So if you have too many details, then you should be looking at turning down the settings, which reduces the details.

[Timmius]

I am aware what a physics card do, thank you very much. It does add more detail to the game. So if you have too many details, then you should be looking at turning down the settings, which reduces the details.

Don't see the point in that. You buy something to give extra performance in something (Physics), and because of the thing that you buy, you need to lessen the amount of detail of the exact thing it is supposed to enhance. Then what's the point of buying it?
Yeah I'll buy that ferrari, too bad I can only do 140 km/h with it.
Having said this: Explain to me again the part about reducing the graphics part is moot...

[panservib]

CMIIW
in my understanding, a physic card would have more impact on gameplay than super VGA.
because, while a super hi-end VGA surely capable to create beautiful effect such as HDR or things like that, it surely don't have any effect whatsoever on the gameplay.

while a game that already make use of physic effect (not only game that optimized for Physic card) will be able to make use the effect of physic to enchance gameplay.
for example, Soldiers Heroes of WW2 is a good example of game that make use of physic effect.
in the game, a light tank will rollover when a HE shell from...say a Tiger impact very near to the tank.
a sherman will rollover when a HE shell from IS-2 impacted near the top of turret.
a grenade will also bounce on the ground, then roll down if the ground is a hill

My favorite is tear down an entire house by moving straigh trought it using a tiger or heavier tank

[Lee1026]

Don't see the point in that. You buy something to give extra performance in something (Physics), and because of the thing that you buy, you need to lessen the amount of detail of the exact thing it is supposed to enhance. Then what's the point of buying it?
Yeah I'll buy that ferrari, too bad I can only do 140 km/h with it.
Having said this: Explain to me again the part about reducing the graphics part is moot...

Let us go over this again: you have a game. Let us say that it have a detail score of 100. You install the card, boosting the detail level to 140. You start lagging. So you turn the game down, so you still have a detail score of 110 or so.