Results 1 to 15 of 15

Thread: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

Hybrid View

Previous Post Previous Post   Next Post Next Post
  1. #1
    grouchy13's Avatar TW Mercenary Veteranii
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    East Midlands, UK
    Posts
    2,280

    Default Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    New measures in regards to highly controversial night raids of suspected militants hideouts in Afghanistan have been announced.

    http://uk.reuters.com/article/2012/0...8391BZ20120410

    Afghan elite raiders say they are U.S. equals

    By Mirwais Harooni and Rob Taylor
    KABUL | Tue Apr 10, 2012 9:28pm BST

    (Reuters) - It's a special-forces entry like no other and guaranteed to spoil the element of surprise, but Afghanistan's new elite soldiers insist they will be no less effective in countering insurgents than controversial night raids by U.S. forces.
    Under cover of darkness, Afghan soldiers will surround the homes of suspected insurgent targets and then shout a demand that those inside separate into men and women before storming the door, safeguarding conservative cultural sensitivities.
    "We announce eight to 10 times that we are Afghan security forces and won't harm you. We ask them to take women and children to one side of the home and males to the other," said Colonel Jalaluddin Yaftali, the commander of Afghan special forces.
    "We operate very carefully and find our target," Yaftali told Reuters in an interview.
    Surprise night raids in pursuit of militants have long fanned anti-Western sentiment in Afghanistan, with many locals seeing them as violations of privacy, especially of women, in conservative southern areas where Taliban support is strongest.
    On Sunday, Afghanistan and the United States reached an agreement that only Afghan forces would be able to search residential homes or compounds, while Afghan police and soldiers would have to protect women and children, as well as culturally sensitive places.
    The agreement, reached after months of at-times tense negotiations, also gives Kabul the power to veto operations and removed a major obstacle to a wider pact to secure a U.S. presence after withdrawal of most foreign combat troops in 2014.
    The hope is that the strategy will lower civilian casualties in night raids and reverse some of the calamitous damage they have caused to President Hamid Karzai's popularity as foreign combat troops hand over to Afghan security forces.
    Under the deal, Afghan police and soldiers are supposed to seek an Afghan judicial warrant before conducting raids. Afghan authorities will also have control over prisoners taken and will decide whether to allow U.S. interrogators access to detainees.
    U.S. defence officials insist that not much is changing in special forces operations, which occur mostly at night, and say they have been almost 100-percent Afghan-led since last year.
    CONCERNS
    Some security analysts, and privately even some members of the Afghan military spoken to by Reuters, worry that the constraints now attached may make raids less effective, and see fewer carried out.
    Western commanders have seen the raids as one of the most effective anti-insurgent tactics and the danger is that shouted warnings could give targets time to escape in Afghanistan's warren-like, mud-walled villages and home compounds.
    A U.S. defence official, speaking on condition of anonymity, acknowledged that the new arrangement might, hypothetically, slow the pace of efforts against the Taliban and its allies in the crucial period when foreign forces begin to withdraw.
    "In theory could this severely hamper operations in Afghanistan? Potentially," the official said. However, he added: "In practice, do we think it will do so? No, because both sides understand the importance of these operations."
    U.S. officials insist they do not expect the warrant requirement to slow quick-strike raids. They also note that, in theory, the Afghan constitution allows for warrantless search/detention in some situations if warrants are requested within 48 hours of a raid taking place.
    Pentagon spokesman Captain John Kirby said that since the shift to an Afghan lead in special-forces raids in December, more than 350 raids had been carried out and insurgent targets were located in more than three-quarters of those.
    He said the agreement would apply only to U.S. special forces units and not other foreign contingents with special forces, including the British and Australians.
    Yaftali said he did not think the new law would create problems for operations.
    "Whatever we do is according to the Afghan constitution," he said. "In most of the cases in Afghanistan, we get to our target without any fighting or fatalities, because our operation is fast and accurate."
    "During our night raids we have killed many so-called shadow governors for the Taliban, self-nominated Taliban police chiefs and shadow district governors, as well as their commanders and fighters," he said.
    He said his unit, planned to number about 3,000, but still only half that size, was as well-equipped as NATO forces, with American M4 rifles and night-vision gear. It had also recruited female soldiers to search women-only compounds, he said.
    "Right now our personnel operate independently and around the country. Our operations are in cooperation with a U.S. technical team," Yaftali said.
    A new Operational Coordination Group, or OCG, to be set up by the Afghan government will oversee special forces operations, with the U.S. providing intelligence, helicopter and air support, as well as medical evacuation, security and support.
    There will also be a bilateral oversight committee chaired by Afghan Defence Minister General Abdul Rahim Wardak and NATO's top commander in the country, U.S. Marine General John Allen.
    U.S. officers spoken to by Reuters in southern Kandahar province welcomed the change, saying it would help free up American troops and deepen cooperation with Afghan forces.
    "I think it's a natural progression," said Colonel Todd Wood, commander of the 1/25 Stryker Brigade Combat Team, which has been in charge of three districts for the past year.
    I found most interesting the fact that some Afghan commanders believe the measures are in place to make such raids less common, sort of like chopping your nose to spite your face. Will be interesting to see once the Operational Coordination Group is in full swing how much intelligence about raids locations and targets will be leaked and what the reaction of the Coalition will be if something seems fishy.
    Last edited by grouchy13; April 11, 2012 at 02:51 PM.
    Under the Patronage of the Venerable Jom Patron of the one true Shogun wealthmonger, Antipodean son IZob, Terrifying Sultan of the Blitz totalwar_legend & Warden of the Iron Throne Dux








  2. #2
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Well its the perfect excuse for "oops we killed the wrong drug kingpin".
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  3. #3
    s.rwitt's Avatar Shamb Conspiracy Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Lubbock, Tx
    Posts
    21,514

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    And how often does that happen?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Quote Originally Posted by s.rwitt View Post
    And how often does that happen?

    With Afghan Army troops? We are about to find out.

  5. #5
    Comes Limitis
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Planet Ape
    Posts
    14,786

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Who knows.
    Quote Originally Posted by snuggans View Post
    we can safely say that a % of those 130 were Houthi/Iranian militants that needed to be stopped unfortunately

  6. #6
    mrmouth's Avatar flaxen haired argonaut
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    10,741

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Same thing as in Iraq. Wasn't as problematic as it appeared on the surface. We created CT Bureau was highly insulated from the Iraqi Gov. We made the deal with Iraq due to political pressure, same as here, and ultimately we created a self contained bureau that wasnt a whole lot different from the task forces, or any less effective. Of course the typical morons cried foul, and started calling them al Maliki's death squads.

    We trained the elite Iraqi CT guys in the Nevada desert, same with the Afghans. They have a strong command structure filled with equally committed/motivated people. They know this works.
    The fascists of the future will be called anti-fascists
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity

  7. #7

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Quote Originally Posted by BarnabyJones View Post
    Same thing as in Iraq. Wasn't as problematic as it appeared on the surface. We created CT Bureau was highly insulated from the Iraqi Gov. We made the deal with Iraq due to political pressure, same as here, and ultimately we created a self contained bureau that wasnt a whole lot different from the task forces, or any less effective. Of course the typical morons cried foul, and started calling them al Maliki's death squads.

    We trained the elite Iraqi CT guys in the Nevada desert, same with the Afghans. They have a strong command structure filled with equally committed/motivated people. They know this works.
    Shame on you, using logic and facts to dispel a perfectly rational anti-american argument. How on earth can you sleep at night?

    Patronized by the mighty Heinz Guderian

  8. #8
    s.rwitt's Avatar Shamb Conspiracy Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Lubbock, Tx
    Posts
    21,514

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Afghan Army troops have been leading their own operations for a long time now justicar, and their own raids since the end of last year.

  9. #9

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Quote Originally Posted by s.rwitt View Post
    Afghan Army troops have been leading their own operations for a long time now justicar, and their own raids since the end of last year.

    and just how many have been about settling tribal scores rather than fighting the taliban (tho I do acknowledge it would be hard to tell sometimes)

  10. #10
    s.rwitt's Avatar Shamb Conspiracy Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Lubbock, Tx
    Posts
    21,514

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    You think ANA units are running around looking to settle tribal scores?

  11. #11

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Quote Originally Posted by s.rwitt View Post
    You think ANA units are running around looking to settle tribal scores?

    All, no. Some certainly possible, it's a civil war.

  12. #12
    mrmouth's Avatar flaxen haired argonaut
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Chicago
    Posts
    10,741

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Ah, its a civil war. That's what I was missing.
    The fascists of the future will be called anti-fascists
    The best lack all conviction, while the worst are full of passionate intensity

  13. #13
    s.rwitt's Avatar Shamb Conspiracy Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Lubbock, Tx
    Posts
    21,514

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation


    All, no. Some certainly possible, it's a civil war.
    It's really not.

    Don't get too hung up on the tribal thing.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    Quote Originally Posted by s.rwitt View Post
    It's really not.

    Don't get too hung up on the tribal thing.

    hang on, it is a civil war. It certainly fits the definition, two native power groups fighting over control (ok one has outside allies but that doesn't stop it being a civil war)

  15. #15
    s.rwitt's Avatar Shamb Conspiracy Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Lubbock, Tx
    Posts
    21,514

    Default Re: Insight into new Afghan raid legislation

    A load of Taliban are from Pakistan.

    Also, the sides go beyond tribal or ethnic divisions. There are a hell of a lot of Pashtuns fighting for the government.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •