Notebook purchase

[Basileos Leandros I]

Since my computer fried and no other possibility to repair it, I need to purchase a new laptop. Some time ago I made a thread about notebooks and eventually chose the ASUS G74SX, a very very good laptop, but with the very steep price I really had second thoughts whether it would be a viable purchase.

So in the end I decided to look for a rather more work-oriented notebook instead of a gaming machine. I can buy the gaming machine once I make my own money

Here's my two finalists.

Most probable purchase

ASUS K53SM-SX139D
Intel Core i5-2450M 2.5GHZ
4GB DDR3 RAM
640GB HDD 5400rpm
nVidia GT630M 2GB
Windows Vista 64 bit Ultimate (without an operating system, I choose Vista because I own it and it's very good for me)
15.6 inch



Hopeful purchase

ASUS G53JW-SX082D
Intel Core i5-460M 2.53GHZ
4GB DDR3 RAM
500GB HDD 7200rpm
nVidia GTX460M 1.5GB
Windows VIsta 64-bit Ultimate
15.6 inch


Can anyone give me any thoughts on these two notebooks? One is work oriented, the other one is more gaming oriented.

Any help on this? Apart from personal reviews and opinions, professional reviews would be good too.

[craziii]

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16834246324 800$ no tax or delivery if you live in us + nyc

I just bought this 2 weeks back for my bro in law, he has been loving it. he might ask me to buy a ssd for him soon to make it even better but that is 300$+ more

basically budget gaming laptop. 555m = to 440 desktop version. don't expect miracles, but it will run your games ok.

if not in a hurry and don't mind spending a bit more the asus g75 will be out soon.

[RZZZA]

Technically speaking, any laptop with a dedicated graphics card IS a gaming laptop. So both of those are, even though their video card is slightly outdated now.

If you're looking for just a school laptop, just go for one with an i5 processor. Maybe something around 14" so it'll be nice and portable. Try a Toshiba Portege or a HP Pavilion or a Samsung Series 3 or something.

just go to Best Buy or Office Max or something and browse around. Most of their laptops do not have dedicated graphics card. They also have sales all the time so you could get one with an i5 thats around $550 or so.

a GTX 460M is quite a decent card, it's not even outdated really. So I'm calling you a liar. You aren't REALLY looking for a non-gaming laptop a GT 630M is significantly less powerful though.

In fact, I'm fairly sure you could run Skyrim on medium-high settings at around 30 FPS with a GTX 460m

[karamazovmm]

the gt 630m = gt 555m - there are 5 models of the gt 555m, with varying performances, the best one is the one in the m14x, the worst is the one in the y570, the most power efficient is the one in the lg p330 (13'' notebook, with 6h of battery life, weighting about 1.5kg, with a mSATA slot for you SSD coupled with the standard 2.5'' 9.5mm HDD bay, so more than 1tb of storage in that thing, and AW calls the m14x a good gaming notebook, what a joke!)

Nvidia line up

gt 425m/435m/540m/550/555m = medium settings in 1080p, 768p high settings

gt 445m/555m/630m = medium settings in 1080p, 768p high settings

gtx 460m/560m = high settings in 1080p, 768p ultra settings

gtx 570m/670m = high/ultra settings in 1080p, 768p ultra settings

gtx 485m/580m/675m = high/ultra settings in 1080p, 768p ultra settings

so basically nvidia is rebranding their cards since 2010. Although in 2011 we saw the introduction of the 570m, the 485m and the gt 520xm.

in 2012 nvidia will rebrand the 520m (which is the gt 420m), 555m, 570m, 580m.

AMD line up

5660m/6550m= medium settings in 1080p, 768p high settings

6600m/7500m= medium settings in 1080p, 768p high settings

6700m/7600m= medium settings in 1080p, 768p high settings

5800m/6800m = high settings in 1080p, 768p ultra settings

6900m = high/ultra settings in 1080p, 768p ultra settings

basically AMD rebrands their best selling cards (mid range, X600m/X700m, they drop them to a lower number, i.e. 5660m to 6550m, or 6770m to 7690m) and the lower end (X500m), with the accommodation of the insertion of the 6800m

The usual difference between an entry range medium gpu is usually how smooth the game will play. There will be a noticeable gains when you move to the gt 555m and the 6770m (they are equal in power, at least the m14x gt 555m the rest is slower, by almost 15%) from the gt 540m or the 6650m.

There is a noticeable difference when entering the gaming line, even the lower end of it, not so much in the case of the gimped gtx 460m/560m

Some base stats:

gtx 460m = heavily downclocked gts 450

6990m = 2x the performance of the gtx 460m

gtx 580m = 2x the performance of the gtx 460m

Conclusion: the 460m is an outdated card launched in 2010

And the version in the g53 is gimped. and that aint anything close to mobile at all. its the same size as a 17'' laptop (excluded the g73/g74 those are quite big as well, and have about the same size as the m18x and the p180hm)

We are also expecting a healthy performance increase in the higher end gpus, with the gtx 680m and the 7970m, given that the latter is probably going to use the 7850 as the core.

I would wait for ivy bridge to come out before buying a laptop right now. 3 reasons:

1) more battery life

2) newer gpus, the gt 640m is already faster by a decent margin compared to the gt 555m, and its the same chip that will be used for the 650m and the 660m, so overclock the damn thing and get the GDDR5 version for the best performance

3) if you dont have the budget to spring for the new models, the older ones are going to be cheaper.

Currently I would be looking at the dv6t with the 1080p panel, dont forget to chose the model that comes with the 7690m.

The k53 series was designed with the gt 540m in mind, and the gt 630m being used in that model I dont think its the new chip in the lg p330, thus is the one that has heating issues in the N55 series, the same used in the y570; heat issues and lower performance, not a good combination.

The y580 is going to come at reasonable prices in US 800ish and will pack the gtx 660m

And for the life of me I cant understand why you would want anything from the asus g series after the 2010 line (g73j, or the g73w), those were the best and quite affordable at the time, now they are more expensive, using gimped cards (excluded the g73/74, and only some models), with a 2010 gaming power.

The msi gaming series is a great buy and are cheaper, even the 15'' can pack the gtx 580m, and usually pack the gtx 570m

There are new clevo/sager models coming, those are going to have more battery life due to optimus and a backlit keyboard.

The m17x is a good machine, although expensive.

For non gaming class notebooks I prefer the workstation ones, like the w520 or the precision m6600, thus you can game and enjoy the better build/cooling quality, not to mention the enterprise class support.

For the mainstream ones, the best right now is the dv6t, packing considerable more power than the xps 15, the overheating asus n55 and the problem filled samsung series 7, the non battery life of the lenovo y series.

For a dirty cheap notebook the k53A with the AMD cpu and gpu are usually sold for 500ish in the US, the y470p and y570p are also good buys, beware the the "p" here is the designation for the AMD gpus, this is essential if choosing the y570p (packs a 7690m), since the gt 555m in the y570 is the worst that there is.

[RZZZA]

^ good info. Yeah thats what I'm gonna do, I'm gonna wait like 6 months and buy a Sager for around $1700. I hear good things about the build quality of Sager versus MSI or even Asus laptops.

[Basileos Leandros I]

ASUS is readily available over here in Romania, one of the most purchased brands, they have their own official company over here, hence my choice. I tested the probable purchase and it looks good, feels good on my palms and is light enough to carry it around while packing a decent punch to run all of my old games on maximum.

(Apart from BF3 and Assassins Creed, don't play anything except old games + TW)

And plus, the ASUS can be an efficient workstation.

I would definitely love a G74SX, but it's too expensive now. And MSI is not available in Romania, same goes for Sager.

[karamazovmm]

at least wait for the new series to arrive. They will be redesigned, and packing at least the 660m, which is a new kepler gpu, at least the tech is new, it aint milking consumers.

Aside that I have forgotten about the samsung series 7 gamer, it packs a 6970m, and will also be made available with the 680m or the 7970m

BTW define workstation.

I can get my work done a in a vaio z2, which is a 13'', with the i7 2640m, 1080p res, 512gb of SSD in raid 0 and 8gb of ram. I could do the same with the x220, and the same as well with the p150hm.

here is a link for the pre order of the new samsung series 7 gamer, and yes this site probably sends the unit to romenia
http://www.provantage.com/samsung-np...s~7SAMG06Y.htm

[Basileos Leandros I]

I'm waiting another month or so, my purchase will be made in around mid May.

Workstation and games, that's what I want to combine. I want a 15" inch laptop with medium/high performance at a good price. I want to play games a lot (AC3 and BF3 are the only new games on my list), I want a sturdy keyboard that I can type on it for hours on end. For my gaming I will buy a large monitor and set it up on my desk, I just need the components of the computer to be powerful without me paying too much for it. Hence why I think the ASUS K53 is a really good buy.

But obviously I'm open to suggestions, and the new HP Pavilion DV6 looks amazing and has really good components.

And that Samsung Series 7 definitely looks good! I'm looking into that one!

ASUS G75 looks amazing as well too, but still some way to go until it will be released I heard.

[karamazovmm]

workstation per definition is a notebook that has some usual components, meaning, 4 Ram slots, a professional gpu, like a quadro or a firepro, a great screen, sturdy, robust, great cooling.

The therm is used for notebooks that can do graphical work or heavy duty programming work.

Do please describe the kind of work that you are going to do with that laptop. It will be best for us to give input regarding that.

The problem is as I said, I can use the vaio Z2, which is a 13'' laptop for programming, the high res is beneficial, the ram is somewhat limiting, but the storage capacity is great, and it weights less than 1.4kg.

And yes I can game in the intel HD 3000 that this mbp, which is my only personal pc.

For mainstream line up, take a look at the:

HP - Envy, dv line. Probook, Elitebook, and Elitebook W (these are their enterprise line up, being the latter the workstation line, it packs the best screen that there is in a laptop, the dream color 2, its IPS with a high gamut range, just superb)

Asus - There is always something wrong in the asus notebooks, as I said before, it doesnt matter that you like it so much, the problem is that there is at least 2 problems with a model. But since you are looking for mid range the N series and the K series are the ones you are looking for. BTW one thing that they are always renown in their models is that their keyboard is always GARBAGE, the screen is always GARBAGE, the touchpad is always GARBAGE (although thats a moot point for non trackpoint users, or people that havent used a mac touchpad, since most of them are terrible)

Acer - we are hoping for their ultrabook line up. And the advancement in their mainstream line up, last year models were gaining more quality, it usually packs the same problems as the Asus models, cooling, build quality, keyboard, trackpad, screen, at least the processor, the ram and the gpu usually works as it should, if the cooling provided is adequate.

Toshiba - outside their gaming line, and their enterprise line, there isnt something to write home about.

Sony - there is a review of the vaio SE in anandtech right now, take a peek, it should be one interesting model for you. Its light, its good a better than average screen, and there is some gaming in there. The F series is great for the screen as well.

Lenovo - the Y series is promising, the Y580 is going to pack the gtx 660m, which gives me the creeps, since the asus G series is going to pack the same gpu, in a way more bulkier chassis, meaning that the 660m is power efficient as we were promised, and that asus just have some not that good engineers working on their laptops anymore. And if you like try to look at the w520, but it should be pricey where you live. Im looking forward for the T430u, which is a 14'' ultrabook packing some nvidia gpu that I dont know yet, its fairly light and it can have up to 1tb of storage, meaning a common 2.5'' HDD bay. If you want have a look at this one or its edge brother.

Sager and Clevo are ruled out because there isnt a single reseller in your country right? have you really taken a look? The upcoming W line up is interesting they will release a m11x competitor, but packing a 35w quad core and gt 650m which is almost as powerful as the gtx 560m, its the same power as the gtx 460m. And that is in a 11'' chassis. There will be 15 and 17 models as well. Not to mention their performance series with the P150em\

Samsung - their mainstream line up is usually one with problems, but they are fairly cheap to compensate, its the same idea of asus and acer, buta little bit more expensive. And the gamer line is just expensive, but you can find one of those in a brick and mortar store, same idea that asus had, and what made it popular.

Dell - AW is a good company with only 2 models to right home about, m17x and m18x. XPS is the ones you are looking for, and hopefully they will be more Xtreme Performance Systems in the next iteration, since the chassis redesign from the m series... the performance is quite mainstream with a better build quality, and in the 15'' model a good screen.

[Zerosliver]

I don't really agree wholly with Mr. MM on build quality. But that's just personal preference. There are my thoughts on build quality:

Acer: Bad bad bad, cheapest laptops out there, but the laptop is always just made of cheap plastic with a bad keyboard, don't even mention the touchpad..
Asus: Better build quality than Acer, nothing too great though. Usually very good pricing for good components, the laptop itself usually has a mat finish on the back and feels more sturdy. Also makes great subnotebooks/netbooks.
Toshiba: Not really noteworthy these days and aren't even sold much in my country.
Sony: Overpriced, but good build quality. Usually lacking in specs when comparing similarly priced models from competitors, but sports a great 'Vaio' futuristic look that just stands out.
Samsung: Usually a bit more expensive than Asus, but the build quality is much better. I personally like their models the most out of most mid-range laptops. Personally got a nice e-350 powered subnotebook that sports a look comparable to their ultrabook lineup, but of course skimps on usb 3.0 and the screen and has no disc drive.
Dell: No experience with them at all the last couple of years, used to be cheap components/garbage build quality in the past, but I think that pretty much changed.
HP: Really depends on the model, they got some great build qualities on some, but some other models are just way too bulky and heavy for my liking.

[karamazovmm]

Disagree all you want. The fact is that the build quality is divided in tiers even among the lines of a said manufacturer.

For example Lenovo, the Y line has a consumer type of build, however the edge moves to the prosummer market, and the thinkpad is where the quality is at. However inbetween we can see the Z line and Q/B line, the Z line has a more quality feel due to the materials used, while the Q/B line is the entry line for budget enterprise class, however the build quality is also not to par with what the edge line offer.

so in a sense the enterprise class for lenovo is basically Q/B>edge>thinkpad and some other models in that mess.

The ones that I advised him to get are considered the best quality models, for example the acer timelineX although the current models have throttling issues the build quality is good. The N line from Asus has some solid chassis, while the keyboard and the throttling happens are just....

the envy has a better than average build quality, and the components are good, however if you compare it to the MBP 15 it is going to lose in terms of build quality, both are premium models, both pack a very similar hardware, while the envy 15 packs a IPS display, the MBP 15 packs some of the best TN display and in terms of color accuracy it will trounce that IPS to shreds, btw the vaio SE uses the same IPS monitor.

Acer is in a trend to raise the price and the quality of their products. The idea is to diminish the offered products, and to raise the margin, while focusing on R&D, so that they can offer some good build quality in new formats. Which they have started with the TimelineX and are expanding to their other line ups.

For example the build quality of the K series is lower than the DV line from HP, however the N line is a very though plastic that they put in there. The G series has some quality, while the screen, the components, and all the other stuff are way out of what you expect for the price you paid. The A series is somewhat a mixed bag, the U series is also a mixed bag, for example there is a huge difference in terms of build quality between the U36 and the U41 or even the U31 to remain in the same screen size. Not to mention that screen, keyboard, speakers... are terrible in that line.

[Basileos Leandros I]

I looked through most of the notebook offers on the market, and in the end I settled for an upgrade, still from ASUS. It's lightweight and offers the most performance for the price.

Haven't bought it yet but this will probably be it when I go to the showroom and test it out throughly.

Asus K53SM-SX086V
Intel® CoreTM i7-2670QM 2.2GHz
4GB DDR3
750GB HDD
nVidia GeForce GT 630M 2GB
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium

That's more or less the best configuration I could get with a very good price/performance ratio. I found MSI and while they do have a GTX570M, it costs twice as much.

I want to work on it, and carry it around, but I also want to play games on it.

I just want to find out now if the components are upgradable, because that would be a very big plus if I could update the components.

[karamazovmm]

I looked through most of the notebook offers on the market, and in the end I settled for an upgrade, still from ASUS. It's lightweight and offers the most performance for the price.

Haven't bought it yet but this will probably be it when I go to the showroom and test it out throughly.

Asus K53SM-SX086V
Intel® CoreTM i7-2670QM 2.2GHz
4GB DDR3
750GB HDD
nVidia GeForce GT 630M 2GB
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium

That's more or less the best configuration I could get with a very good price/performance ratio. I found MSI and while they do have a GTX570M, it costs twice as much.

I want to work on it, and carry it around, but I also want to play games on it.

I just want to find out now if the components are upgradable, because that would be a very big plus if I could update the components.

on that model you can change the screen, cpu, hdd, ram.

I would go for the asus n56v, its being sold with the 650m, and sincerely its the same performance as that g53w that you wanted, thats how good mid range has become, and you can overclock the bastard, since the 640m/650m/660m are the same gpu.

the hp dv6t with the 650m can also be found for less than the asus.

you may find the recently released envy 4t or 6t quite interesting it gives incredible mobility at the cost of some performance, but it will still be much better than what you had in your m1710 (in cpu terms) take a look at those, they were released yesterday and are already being sold, and as a GREAT bonus they are quite cheap the envy 4t that I wanted:

CPU: i5 2467m
GPU: 7670m
RAM: 4gb
HDD: 500gb
backlit keyboard
total 845

and this thing is in the ultrabook category (dimensions Dimensions 13.38"(W)x 9.28"(D)x 0.78"(max D) and the weight is 3.9lbs). The gaming performance should be quite close to the ones that we discussed earlier, the 7670m has the same performance as the 6750m, and is much better than the 630m

The 630m is a 425m/430m/540m/550m/555m rebadge, not even clocks are higher. you get a 2010 performance in 2012 for the price of new! great deal!

but nonetheless the ivy dual cores are coming next month, and sincerely, its better for you to wait a bit, the new tech havent jacked up in price so far, however I dont know how are things in your country.

Another great thing on the envy line is the different CS that they have, AFAIK its international warranty, much like the premium enterprise class warranty that the, duh, enterprise class notebooks share.

[Zerosliver]

Usually most laptops only allow replacement of ram and hdd. Seems like a nice configuration, I'm hoping for you that it has interchangeable components.

[Basileos Leandros I]

I checked out your suggestions, there's no ASUS N56V on the market, not even private imports.

And the HP DV6 notebooks sold around here come with Intel Core i3 and ATI Radeon 7470M with 1GB, and on top are slightly more expensive, not much of a deal to be had there. Forget about the Envy notebooks, nothing to be found.

Ivy Dual Cores, I read about them, but it will take some time until they arrive here (around another month) and they will be more expensive.

I would have waited if I didn't need my computer now.

Overall, what's your thoughts on the ASUS above? Price performance ratio is excellent, but I want to know the quality, and whether it's a good idea to buy extended warranty for it.

[karamazovmm]

The n46v is available on poland and russia, there should be more countries

http://asus.podberi-notebook.ru/pric.../n46vz/12.html

http://www.x-kom.pl/p/79408-notebook...-rw-7hp64.html

usually the 15'' market is much larger, if a 14'' is already out, the assumption is that the n56v is going to be.

sincerely its up to you. However I have to reinstate that I was wrong on the 630m, here is why:

425m/430m/445m/540m/550m/555m - it could be any of those cards, either 96 cores or 144 cores. The problem is that there is also a variation of ROP units, bandwidth and vram used, each of those variations give you a good variation in performance as well.

Why to reinstate? There is now the 635m the 640m LE, both use the same cores (5 in the case of the 555m and 1 in the case of the rest, with the exception of the 445m that uses the more powerful combination, its essentially the 555m that dell uses in the m14x and the dell xps 17 from from 2 years past). The logical approach is that it should be one of the 96 core.

A true kepler card is much more powerful, usually around 20% if compare the 640m LE to the 640m, now you take the lower clocks and you will know what Im talking about.

In your first thread, I remember that I stated for you to get a similar model from asus, either the A or K series, they are the same anyway, and vouched for you to get a more powerful clevo notebook, since there are several resellers in europe, but my memory plays tricks, and if it isnt it was at the start of this year.

[Basileos Leandros I]

You kinda lost me there in the technical gizmos. So, let me see if I understand, the 550M has either 96 or 144 cores, so in this case, what's the difference with the 630M/635M/640M LE?

Clevo is not available, that's my problem. My choice is quite restricted.

[karamazovmm]

Ok let me separate a little bit more

96 cores - 425m/430m/540m/550m/555m

144 cores - 445m/555m

There are differences regarding the ROP count, the bandwidth and the vram used, either DDR3 or GDDR5 (the gddr5 version is the worst one)

the 630m/635m/640m LE can be using any of those combinations

Welcome to the mess that nvidia made in mid range sector!

[Basileos Leandros I]

Ah, I got it now. The thing with the GT630M is that it has 96 cores on the ASUS notebook, but isn't there any way to upgrade the video card on it? Is it embedded in the motherboard?

And even worse, there's a lot of forum posts on NVIDIA complaining about the driver issues from ASUS.

[karamazovmm]

what is the vram type? if it is DDR3 which I think it is, its 96 core 8 ROP 128bit DDR3 type, the same as the 425m/430m/540m/550m, the 555m based on the 96 core had a 128bit and GDDR5 to make it go faster a bit, but not far enough. The HD4000 from intel should be a little bit slower than that card.

You cant change the gpu on that notebook. There are a few notebooks that are able to do that, Workstation class notebooks (hp, dell, lenovo) and real gaming notebooks (samsung, clevo, msi and aw), only those. To upgrade a card on a notebook you have to have it connected to a mxm slot, that is a pcie interface developed by nvidia and adopted by amd as well.

For example the m14x and m11x are the only notebooks in the aw portfolio that cant upgrade the gpus, the m15x, m17x, m18x can.
On the clevo side you have the p150, p170, p180, x7200, while the w line cant upgrade.

Basically the idea is mainstream = what you've got is what you have
High end = what you've got can be different from what you will have in the end.

One idea that I do like is the egpu one. Basically you use either expresscard, mpcie or thunderbolt and connect those ports to a desktop card, the problem with all those aside thunderbolt is the bandwidth provided by the interface, but you are still capable of getting a small notebook that can game like hell.

the msi gt 683 should be on clearance, since it has already been replaced by the gt60, I dont remember if you looked at those