Noticable "attrition"

**General Maximus** · March 29, 2012, 08:33 AM

In Vanilla, my Imperial army landed near Alexandria, and was about to march to Cairo, then suddenly two full stack Egyptian armies, one led by a 8 star general and another by 5 star, appeared very close to my army. (It looked like they were coming to attack me, but as soon as they reached me they ran out of movement points)

Obviously, I wished to protect my army and so they were forced to run off into open desert with no roads built. I could see that those full-stack armies followed me, ending close to me every turn.

Then after a turn I noticed that my troop numbers has decreased. 7-8 men per unit. Next turn it decreased again, and went on until my army somehow reached the coast and hired a ship (my old ships which brought the army to Egypt had been destroyed by Venetians). The army had to come home to retrain.

So, what does this conclude? This means that attrition IS in the game, just as a minor hidden mechanic.

First I thought that this was just some other factor, but then I tried two other campaigns:

In my Crusades campaign, my huge army of Jerusalem was left standing desert South-East to Kerak. They also reduced 5-10 men each turn. Another huge full-stack army marched to Baghdad, but by the time it reached only 965 out about 5000 men were left.

Second, when my French army came near Mosul for Crusades, it started losing 5-6 men per turn. Even after capturing Mosul, armies lost men when they stayed too far from the settlement. Same was for Baghdad.

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I found that when you upgrade the farms in the region, the land starts to become greener and death rate of armies slows, and finally stops!

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**The Despondent Mind** · March 29, 2012, 08:34 AM

Are those armies by any chance in a crusade ? If not i never heard or noticed something like this .

**General Maximus** · March 29, 2012, 08:37 AM

Only a single army (French one) was on the crusade. But most armies that I throw into the desert are just normal armies.

**Aeratus** · March 29, 2012, 09:09 AM

Sounds like you fought an army with plague and got plague. With the plague, you lose huge amounts of men every turn.

Normal attrition does exist, but you don't lose that much. Also, normal attrition only occurs during winter turns.

**General Maximus** · March 30, 2012, 06:40 AM

Sorry for late reply.

Originally Posted by Aeratus

Sounds like you fought an army with plague and got plague. With the plague, you lose huge amounts of men every turn.

Normal attrition does exist, but you don't lose that much. Also, normal attrition only occurs during winter turns.

Well the region was not plagued, and I captured the region to confirm it. Seems due to being different climate.

Didn't get winter attrition much often, because my troops are cozy in their forts and castles by winter

Originally Posted by mansch

Could it be the desert? The bonus most moors troops get for fighting in the desert, could be not loosing men in the desert?

The attrition was in the desert. The Egyptian-Moorish armies didn't lose as much men as me, but still lost 2-3 men per turn (as spy reported).

Originally Posted by Drachos

Are you getting this when you're fighting on grassy lands? Maybe the temperature of the desert.

In grassy lands, I never got attrition, but when the same battlefield was covered with snow, I lost 1-2 men each unit. Artillery didn't got any attrition.

**mansch** · March 30, 2012, 03:17 AM

Could it be the desert? The bonus most moors troops get for fighting in the desert, could be not loosing men in the desert?

**Drachos** · March 30, 2012, 04:17 AM

Are you getting this when you're fighting on grassy lands? Maybe the temperature of the desert.

**eXistenZ** · March 30, 2012, 09:08 AM

it has to be the plague, there can not be another explanation if its vanilla. Its not because a region (city) is plague free, that an army inside that region doesnt have the plague

**TWWolfe** · March 30, 2012, 11:17 AM

Actually, units in the deserts will suffer attrition just by being in the deserts, even without the plague. Just be happy it didn't get your general this time

It does happen in Vanilla, but it's reserved mostly for the deep deserts in Africa.

**Double A** · March 30, 2012, 12:03 PM

The only time I ever get attrition is when the AI is besieging me. I've marched all the way to Timbuktu and only lost men in the ensuing fight. Not a single one of my men have died in the winter.

April Fool's is on Sunday, guys.

**Aeratus** · March 30, 2012, 01:13 PM

Attrition also happens in the mountains. Sometimes, the Timurids get stuck in the Caucasus and wear out due to attrition.

**Drachos** · March 30, 2012, 05:59 PM

Imagine yourself in a desert: dehidration, the vast deserts...Would you die?

**Double A** · March 30, 2012, 08:35 PM

Yes, now imagine yourself in a large and well-supplied army.

Not quite so dead anymore, are you?

**Malarkeyy44** · March 30, 2012, 08:50 PM

Only most Medieval Forces were not that well supplied. They tended to live off the land quite a bit. Plus if you go tramping through the dessert, away from the trade roads, wouldn't it be hard for supply trains to find you?

**Double A** · April 01, 2012, 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by Malarkeyy44

Only most Medieval Forces were not that well supplied. They tended to live off the land quite a bit. Plus if you go tramping through the dessert, away from the trade roads, wouldn't it be hard for supply trains to find you?

His point is that everyone who goes in the desert dies, and you're jumping on me?

**♘Top Hat Zebra** · March 30, 2012, 11:30 PM

Hmmm. I've never noticed this before, and I've played this game quite a bit.

Then again, I usually never play in the desert, so...

But I DO play in the far north, and I've never gotten winter attrition.