Lessons learnt the hard way

[Vindigo]

This is a thread for posting advice that is important but not immediately apparent from the encyclopedia or ingame messages. I started a Fujiwara campaign in RoTS and things went real bad real quick due to my ignorance of some mechanics that aren't fully explained.

- The other Fujiwara family abruptly broke the alliance. They allied again for 500 but as I found out, the clan alliances are not mandatory, not even before the endgame.

- I was allied to Ashikaga who had a nice 3 provinces next to the blue clan. I was preparing a campaign wherein I would take Hitachi by bribery and then use Ashikaga lands as a jump-off point for attacks, and refuge. 2 turns into the war, I find Ashikaga has not only dissolved the alliance (there was no message) but allied with the enemy all of a sudden! Not only that, but attacking them would make everyone hate me.

- I thought ok, how bad could it be? I attacked with the forces I had reserved for the blues. After the siege, everyone was -50 and unfriendly because of that and half of Japan canceled the very lucrative trade my clan was banking on. That's where I ragequit.

I understand these are the finer points of diplomacy, but man, Ashikaga just ruined the whole campaign for me. I don't know if this is normal, if it's because they're blue-aligned or because the game thought I was being cheap with military access.

[♘Top Hat Zebra]

-Just because a clan is your vassal (In RotS) does not mean they won't take advantage of you. I played a Fujiwara campaign, and I made the clan that starts on that little island (The one with the gold) my vassal. Well, I kept pushing on with my main force, having already taken out my sister clan, and my "Vassal" landed an army behind me, and promptly destroyed me from behind..


- Alsom this cannot be stressed enough for RotS: Allies are only your allies until you screw up.

[BubbaLou]

All you folks itching to call in Fire support

-The AI knows when you're about to call in a strike. They don't continue on, blissfully ignorant of that green flare that just landed in the centre of the line because, who cares, we're the AI! Green flares do no damage.

No, they're aware that Green Flare means Apocalypse, and will actively try to shift and move either out of the way, or mostly out of the way. If you're calling in an Area bombardment, the AI is less inclined to move because the area is so big. For a Focused bombardment, if left unattended, the AI gets the hell out and watches you blow up alot of dirt.

To properly call those in, you need to distract your target. The busier the AI troops are, the less they will move out of the way.

You can hit the AI in the final stages of the approach (they won't totally sabotage their line before they're about to make contact), during the fight (most reliable, but usually difficult to get a full grouping), or as the AI is routing IE: in a straight line (absolute hilarity. Don't shell your general).

[Sir Furlong]

I have learnt that you should still have back up melee troops for when things get messy...

[Robin de Bodemloze]

I have learnt that you should still have back up melee troops for when things get messy...

This was my first "oh crap" moment playing FotS, realising that once melee troops reached your line of riflemen bad things happened.

[Elitewolf]

I have learnt that you should still have back up melee troops for when things
get messy...

Or: Create double lines. Levies up front, linemen behind them. order them to shoot into the levies once the enemies hit them. Ride carbines/revolver cav around the back, or keep skirmishers hidden for this. Tell them to open fire into the backs of the enemy. Charge yari kii into enemy general, sabre cav into melee.

It's costly, but an effective emergency tactic when attacked by an all traditional army early on. And I always use the double line in sieges, it's even better there.

[CleverFool]

Navies are super important; I played a game as the Satsuma where I ended up losing due to the sheer number of fleets surrounding my island. They started bombarding my towns, improvements, etc., and before long I was losing money every turn (plus negative modifiers to happiness).

My second lesson learned was to not modernize too fast. I reached level 4 in no time, but was still quite far from being able to research the final techs. It's best to play it slow at times, so as to not lose out on happiness modifiers.

As others have said, melee is still important. I find even 4 Levy Spearmen to cover the flanks and act as a meat shield when the rifles start blasting.

Oh, and kneel and fire melts faces. So do Armstrong Guns (I had two combine for 500 / 450 kills in one battle).

[aeoleron9]

This is a thread for posting advice that is important but not immediately apparent from the encyclopedia or ingame messages. I started a Fujiwara campaign in RoTS and things went real bad real quick due to my ignorance of some mechanics that aren't fully explained.

- The other Fujiwara family abruptly broke the alliance. They allied again for 500 but as I found out, the clan alliances are not mandatory, not even before the endgame.

- I was allied to Ashikaga who had a nice 3 provinces next to the blue clan. I was preparing a campaign wherein I would take Hitachi by bribery and then use Ashikaga lands as a jump-off point for attacks, and refuge. 2 turns into the war, I find Ashikaga has not only dissolved the alliance (there was no message) but allied with the enemy all of a sudden! Not only that, but attacking them would make everyone hate me.

- I thought ok, how bad could it be? I attacked with the forces I had reserved for the blues. After the siege, everyone was -50 and unfriendly because of that and half of Japan canceled the very lucrative trade my clan was banking on. That's where I ragequit.

I understand these are the finer points of diplomacy, but man, Ashikaga just ruined the whole campaign for me. I don't know if this is normal, if it's because they're blue-aligned or because the game thought I was being cheap with military access.

Wait, you bribed whose settlement? I think bribing towns/generals will make the faction hostile so maybe that's why Ashikaga betray you.

[Vindigo]

Wait, you bribed whose settlement? I think bribing towns/generals will make the faction hostile so maybe that's why Ashikaga betray you.

Kawakura captured Hitachi from the small clan that's Fujiwara-friendly that has it initally. I don't think my claiming that settlement with the political agent was what got Ashikaga to switch sides, especially since they were neutral toward Kawakura.

[Vindigo]

Another diplomacy lesson: I was playing Shimazu and was allied to Sagara, at war against Shoni. After leaving Shoni with the NE province in Kyushu and absolutely no army (they wouldn't make peace otherwise), I wanted to turn things around and attack Sagara so I can have 95% of Kyushu including the lucrative and safe Higo province. The alliance breaking dishonor timer was running out so I put together a force to attack Higo. Then I broke the alliance and oh crap what's this - Declaring war on them in the next 10 turns will make everyone hate me? Well, I had another idea. I allied with Shoni (the change of their Daimyo after I killed him made Shoni a lot more cooperative somehow) and then I 'gifted' Shoni my entry into their war against Sagara (which btw gave a +100 relations). There was no diplomacy penalty with anyone else, as it doesn't seem to count as a DoW if you're joining an ally's war. It may also matter than Shoni attacked Sagara in the first place. I did notice a few factions had a -40 'dishonoring treaties' penalty, but they were distant and seemingly random (like Hojo). No neighbors seemed to have it.

tl;dr: Joining an ally's war against a former ally will ignore the diplomacy penalty from attacking a former ally.

[Steam Engenius]

Something I have failed to remember multiple times, before RD, build a navy to intercept those armies that sail right behind the frontlines. I am such a cheapskate on naval power and I always regret it when every ship in Japan attacks in some far flung province I conquered decades ago.