Partial Fog of War?

**Yamato** · March 17, 2012, 07:20 PM

Hi,
Is there a mod or another way to get a partial fog of war in the game?
I want to see on the map which area is controled by which faction so I can know what is happening in the world but I dont want to see everything like enemy army positions etc as it does when typing in the cheat code toggle_fow. I have searched for hours but can't find anything. Preferebly it should also work with The Third Age lord of the rings mod. If anyone knows something please tell me.

Thank you for your time.

**SturmChurro** · March 17, 2012, 07:23 PM

You could send diplomats around and ask for map information or your could build watchtowers.

**Yamato** · March 17, 2012, 07:31 PM

True but this takes alot of effort and resources on such a large map with so many factions.
Looking for more of a mod/cheat

**tudor93** · March 18, 2012, 02:31 AM

Originally Posted by SturmChurro

You could send diplomats around and ask for map information

this works in the early period, but I don't know why later in the game they don't want to give me map info anymore
In my SS campaign (but this happened to me in vanilla too) even those with whom I have perfect relations won't give me map info even if the deal seems 'generous' or 'very generous' for them

**.L.** · March 18, 2012, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by tudor93

this works in the early period, but I don't know why later in the game they don't want to give me map info anymore
In my SS campaign (but this happened to me in vanilla too) even those with whom I have perfect relations won't give me map info even if the deal seems 'generous' or 'very generous' for them

Because they don't have any map info to give you.

**Mausolos of Caria** · March 21, 2012, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by tudor93

this works in the early period, but I don't know why later in the game they don't want to give me map info anymore
In my SS campaign (but this happened to me in vanilla too) even those with whom I have perfect relations won't give me map info even if the deal seems 'generous' or 'very generous' for them

Well they will give you the map information if you offer enough money

But that always seems to be ridiculous high, when playing the Byzantines I was the largest faction on the map and factions with like 5 or 6 provinces would still demand about 10 000 florins until they gave map information.

**Dredd** · March 17, 2012, 08:08 PM

Unfortunately there's no fog of war mods like the one you suggested, it's either watch your enemy's movements or just stare at a cloud hovering over kingdoms.

**Sitalkes** · March 18, 2012, 06:20 AM

In addition to diplomats, use spies, merchants, and priests enough and you will get what you want

**P.T.** · March 23, 2012, 12:33 PM

This is a ridiculous aspect of these games.

Why isn't the map visible?
Didn't people know what the world looked like in the middle ages?
Didn't they know where the various cities were located?

They could show the map without showing the other nations troop movements.

**Dredd** · March 23, 2012, 10:59 PM

Originally Posted by P.T.

This is a ridiculous aspect of these games.

Why isn't the map visible?
Didn't people know what the world looked like in the middle ages?
Didn't they know where the various cities were located?

They could show the map without showing the other nations troop movements.

People thought the world was flat and that the Earth was the center of the universe, I doubt they knew the outline of the entire world.

**P.T.** · March 25, 2012, 08:21 AM

Originally Posted by Napo

People thought the world was flat and that the Earth was the center of the universe, I doubt they knew the outline of the entire world.

There was trade from China to Europe at the time.
People from the middle east traveled to Spain.

The Romans, 1000 years before the medieval time frame had been in the middle east, England, Spain and North Africa.

The world from China to Spain and from the British Isles to North Africa was known.

Also, the idea of a round earth was around in pre-Roman times.
It just wasn't proven one way or the other.

**florin87** · March 26, 2012, 05:41 AM

Originally Posted by P.T.

It just wasn't proven one way or the other.

it was proven. some ancient greek chap (forgot the name) did it using two sticks. he also calculated the earth's diameter with a precision of about 95%

**Sitalkes** · March 26, 2012, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by florin87

it was proven. some ancient greek chap (forgot the name) did it using two sticks. he also calculated the earth's diameter with a precision of about 95%

Eratothesnes (mathemetician and Hellenistic librarian of Alexndria), he did it by looking down wells at Alexandria and at Thebes and comparing the shadows at midday. But his work was forgotten and in any case was not taught by the church, and all education was provided by the church.

**ccgr1121** · March 25, 2012, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by Napo

People thought the world was flat and that the Earth was the center of the universe, I doubt they knew the outline of the entire world.

Not true. From Terry Jones:

"There is no doubt that intelligent people in the Middle Ages knew perfectly well that the earth was a globe. Aquinas, in the thirteenth century, wrote that "the astronomer and the natural Philosopher both demonstrate the same conclusion, such as that the world is round..."

Medieval Lives, Terry Jones, p126-7, BBC Books

**Sitalkes** · March 25, 2012, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by P.T.

This is a ridiculous aspect of these games.

Why isn't the map visible?
Didn't people know what the world looked like in the middle ages?
Didn't they know where the various cities were located?

They could show the map without showing the other nations troop movements.

Don't you like exploring? It's more fun that way! It's an RTS tradition to not show the map until you have explored it. It is also quite realistic and was a major factor in ancient and medieval warfare. For instance, the battle of Carhae was fought and lost by the Romans because the Romans needed Arab guides to show them where to go and the guides led the Romans off into the desert towards the Persian army. People in the Medieval World did not have maps and very few people could even read one if they did, since the majority of the population (including kings and military leaders) was illiterate. Maps were also not drawn the way they are today and were inaccurate. It wasn't until the invention of the bicycle and the train that the average person go on long trips away from their town/village or even wanted to do so. Most people never left their village or town and many eg the serfs, etc were even legally required to stay put on their land until the plague broke down the fuedal system to some extent. Even up to the 20th century in countries like England people rarely left their local area, and if they did, they didn't travel very far. So no, people didn't know what the world looked like, and they didn't need to as they weren't going there and anyway it was all set down in the bible. They didn't know how to get to various cities and in many cases didn't even know they exisited especially if they were far away in another country. If you want a copy of the map you can download it (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images...w2map2qh7.jpg/ or just search the forum).

**Malarkeyy44** · March 24, 2012, 01:32 AM

There is a cheat actually to lift the fog of war, if you really want to do that. First you have to click the "~" button. Then type in: toggle_fow. And that should do it. Have fun with it.

**P.T.** · March 26, 2012, 01:53 AM

It may be a tradition in RTS games, but most RTS games use randomly generated maps.

Since the Romans had already been to Jerusalem I think the Crusaders could find Jerusalem as well.
Since the Romans had been to much of Europe I think the way around Europe was known.
Maybe not to the commoner, but to traders and Military people and others who needed to know.

You make it sound like an army left a European city with the intention of going to Jerusalem or Constantinople and started asking for directions as soon as they left the city gates.

**Sitalkes** · March 26, 2012, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by P.T.

Since the Romans had already been to Jerusalem I think the Crusaders could find Jerusalem as well.
Since the Romans had been to much of Europe I think the way around Europe was known.
Maybe not to the commoner, but to traders and Military people and others who needed to know.

You make it sound like an army left a European city with the intention of going to Jerusalem or Constantinople and started asking for directions as soon as they left the city gates.

You have a very modern perspective and should try to think like a medieval person.

People going to Jerusalem quite often got lost along the way and had to take guides. Whole armies were lost in Anatolia trying to get there and this was mostly due to the terrain and climate and not to enemy action - they would take the wrong route and get lost and/or be unaware of the requirements of the trip. The 1st Crusade arrived at Antioch after eating most of their horses and most of the knights fourght on foot for quite some time. Crusading armies that travelled overland quite often went by bizzare routes to Jerusalem and attacked some rather unlikely targets on the way.

What the ancient Greeks knew and what the Romans knew was only known in the Roman empire ie Byzantium and to a lesser extent in the Islamic world. Outside the eastern Roman empire the knowledge was lost and that's what the Renaissance was - a rediscovery of that knowledge, prompted to a great extent by the movement of Byzantine scholars to Italy after the fall of Constantinople. yes, people didn't know how to get there and yes they were asking for directions unless they took a priest or two who might know something of the route at least to Rome.