About starting pope and others in late campaign accuracy

**Javiar** · February 23, 2012, 03:58 AM

Alright, one thing I love about this mod is when you start a faction many of the people are historically based and such for the time. ( I love to wikipedia all the starting family members and their lineage as well! it is just interesting!)

Anyway, the pope at the start of the late campaign is "Pope Honorius the Warmonger of the Papal States" with General Religion, Violent, Secretly Female, Purger of Heresy, and Shining Faith.

First, Innocent III was the pope in 1200, the start of late campaign. Innocent III was pope 1198-1216 AD while Honorius III was pope from 1216-1227. Second, I don't think Honorius III should have "the Warmonger" title via the violent trait but that is besides the point and is debatable anyway. Age is wrong as well of course.

So yeah, the pope is screwed up.

Another thing, the french family at the start I must say is very good but the ages are quite bad. For instance Louis VIII is listed as 28 years old when he was 12 in 1200AD

This is all probably worthless to 99% of people, and I don't even know if these things can be changed (at least the age part i am not sure about) or even if they should be. I just remember somewhere one of the modders said they are always striving to make the game even better than it is currently and I thought this could be something they could put at the bottom of their list.

Now, please start to yell at me for being stupid

**Losthief** · February 23, 2012, 04:24 AM

Dunno about the pope, the french thing is to make the succession ogo to the prince louie in this case if iirc, at 12 he wouldnt be of age and thus unable to be hier.

**Kaidonni** · February 23, 2012, 04:52 AM

I believe the Late campaign start date is 1220ad, not 1200. Nevertheless, I do agree that there are a few inaccuracies at the very least, which is why I've started a submod for BGR V. For instance, Sicily? Really? Not in 1220ad, I'm sorry - Frederick II, Holy Roman Emperor, was in charge then. The Normans of Sicily had kicked the bucket (you even get the family tree from the Early campaign

). I'm planning two start dates - 1194 and 1224, each with differing aspects. Sicily can exist in 1194 for instance (just...technically, within the year, its fortunes changed dramatically, sealing the fate of Norman rule), but not the Teutons (1224 is a perfect date, therefore - the year the state of the Teutonic Order came into being).

If you check the progress for WIP mods like Dominion of the Sword, you'll see people putting great effort into things like historical family trees. I've started with that, but they've really done something with them for their mod!

Losthief, you can actually set an underage heir or leader in descr_strat, but only there - once the game starts, no other underage characters can be heir or leader. It's a one-time deal. Funnily enough, you can do some pretty funky things with family trees in descr_strat, especially for the dead members.

**Homeros** · February 23, 2012, 06:00 AM

Originally Posted by Kaidonni

I believe the Late campaign start date is 1220ad, not 1200. Nevertheless, I do agree that there are a few inaccuracies at the very least, which is why I've started a submod for BGR V.

Nice!

While you're at it, please change the Mongols too. Jebe was an awesome general, but not a member of the Khan's family. Ogudai should be heir - it was he (Genghis' thrid son) who inherited the empire.

It would be cool to add Tolui too (the fourth son). I believe 3 of his sons became Khan, with Kublai being the most famous (although he never fought in the west AFAIK).

**Ferdiad** · February 23, 2012, 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by Javiar

Alright, one thing I love about this mod is when you start a faction many of the people are historically based and such for the time. ( I love to wikipedia all the starting family members and their lineage as well! it is just interesting!)

Anyway, the pope at the start of the late campaign is "Pope Honorius the Warmonger of the Papal States" with General Religion, Violent, Secretly Female, Purger of Heresy, and Shining Faith.

First, Innocent III was the pope in 1200, the start of late campaign. Innocent III was pope 1198-1216 AD while Honorius III was pope from 1216-1227. Second, I don't think Honorius III should have "the Warmonger" title via the violent trait but that is besides the point and is debatable anyway. Age is wrong as well of course.

So yeah, the pope is screwed up.

Another thing, the french family at the start I must say is very good but the ages are quite bad. For instance Louis VIII is listed as 28 years old when he was 12 in 1200AD

This is all probably worthless to 99% of people, and I don't even know if these things can be changed (at least the age part i am not sure about) or even if they should be. I just remember somewhere one of the modders said they are always striving to make the game even better than it is currently and I thought this could be something they could put at the bottom of their list.

Now, please start to yell at me for being stupid

Good thing game starts in 1220 then isnt it.

**Javiar** · February 23, 2012, 08:12 PM

you and the others were correct, my mistake of course

although this is what happens when i don't get any sleep

sadly i don't know if i can delete threads i create?

**Jambat** · February 23, 2012, 07:32 PM

Originally Posted by Javiar

This is all probably worthless to 99% of people, and I don't even know if these things can be changed

Not at all. Go to the sub-mod forum, find Fair Prince. He has three (ish) sub-mods in the work that are going for the exact historical accuracy you are looking for. I believe it's the SSNOP one that's dealing with entirely accurate lineage, traits, and etc...