pahlava late bodygaurd

[the persian Immortal]

I was wondering when I should use the secondary weapon , as the parthian late bodyguards, their lances is good and AP and it seems like they r a lot better then their swords, I'm not very experienced so I want to ask u in which situation should I use the secondary weapon and in which should I use the primary lances??

same about the Persian hoplites , when should I use the swords and when should I use the spears.

TUA

[Ferdiad]

The BG have AP maces which have higher attack and spped than the lances. As for the Hoplites use Spears agaisnt cav and swords agaisnt Inf.

[athanaric]

The Persian Hoplites also automatically use their swords when fighting on walls, which is a nice feature and may be (can't verify it though) an advantage in comparison to other spear units that don't have swords.

The BG have AP maces which have higher attack and spped than the lances. .

Nope, they have swords like the Gallic bodyguards. The Armenian and Saka late BGs have maces.
I'd use the sword against unarmoured enemies, particularly skirmishers, because of its higher attack rating+speed as well as its high lethality (lower than the lance but still very good).

[Ferdiad]

The Persian Hoplites also automatically use their swords when fighting on walls, which is a nice feature and may be (can't verify it though) an advantage in comparison to other spear units that don't have swords.



Nope, they have swords like the Gallic bodyguards. The Armenian and Saka late BGs have maces.
I'd use the sword against unarmoured enemies, particularly skirmishers, because of its higher attack rating+speed as well as its high lethality (lower than the lance but still very good).

I guessed tbh. I culdnt remember the BG name so i just searched for late and looked for generals units and picked the first one with I saw.

[Casual Tactician]

Pushtîghbânê Shâhigân-î Pahlavânîg (Parthian Late Bodyguard Cavalry):
- I'd use the heavy lance (0.4 lethality / ap / min. animation delay 200) for charging and in melee against armoured enemies, as the lance has the higher lethality and ap ability but slower animations (i.e. lower rate of attacks).
- The sword (0.225 lethality, no ap / min. animation delay 0) I'd use againt non- or low-armoured enemies, as it still has a good lethality and faster attack rate but misses the ap ability.

Kardakâ Arteshtâr (Persian Hoplites):
- If you want the best results use the spear only, as they have identic lethality and animation delay, but the spear has the light_spear attribute which give it +8 defense vs cav and -4 defense vs infantry. Though as it's attack is 4 higher than that of the sword, it's effecively also better vs infantry (as the +4 attack beats the -4 defense).
- If you want to play it use both (for the sake of realism or fun) then perhaps use the spear when fighting cavalry or holding the line, and the sword when using the hoplites to flank, fighting on walls or when cutting down lighter skirmisher units or archers.
Note: You can give light_spear weapons less lethality than swords or lower their attack a little, if you want both weapons to have pros and cons.

Regards.

EDIT: Too late. Athanaric was faster, damnit!

[the persian Immortal]

yo thanks guys +rep 4 athanaric and Casual Tactician , danke

but I have noticed that my BG die faster when I use the swords no matter which opponent they're fighting .. or is it just me ???

P.S : oh and I didn't know that about the light-spear attribute is there other such attributes that offer such advantages ... if so plizzz post them here , for example I know that AP offers an advantage when ur fighting an armoured enemy but what is exactly the advantages and disadvantages ??? same about other attributes like bonus fighting in woods/snow , frighting enemy infantry , bonus vs eles etc etc thanks 4 your help

[athanaric]

yo thanks guys +rep 4 athanaric and Casual Tactician , danke

Gern geschehen.

P.S : oh and I didn't know that about the light-spear attribute is there other such attributes that offer such advantages ... if so plizzz post them here , for example I know that AP offers an advantage when ur fighting an armoured enemy but what is exactly the advantages and disadvantages ??? same about other attributes like bonus fighting in woods/snow , frighting enemy infantry , bonus vs eles etc etc thanks 4 your help

AP halves the opponent's body armour rating, i.e. if you fight a unit with 20 armour, your swordsmen will have a hard time killing it, but your axemen will only have to deal with 10 armour when fighting that unit.
You can look up all those modifiers in Aradan's EDU guide.

[the persian Immortal]

Gern geschehen.

hahah german is so awesome , I'm doing german in college but I'm terrible at it

AP halves the opponent's body armour rating, i.e. if you fight a unit with 20 armour, your swordsmen will have a hard time killing it, but your axemen will only have to deal with 10 armour when fighting that unit.
You can look up all those modifiers in Aradan's EDU guide.

ahh thanks for the link bro +rep

[Lansa]

Probably just you. Granted, I only ever use Hellenic factions but my BG seems to last longer when they switch to the kopis (iirc)

[Menestheus]

I find that when engaging other cavalry units with your own cavalry it is almost always best to stick to the lance. It seems to me like if you don't then your opponents superior reach when using their own lances allows them to score hits on your cavalry before they can get in close enough to start doing damage. However, the Parthian BG's AP mace is very useful when fighting protracted combat against ground units after the charge.

Plus I have a slight fetish for mace warfare.

[Menestheus]

My bad, its not the BG's who use the maces but one of the other Parthian cataphracts, sorry about double post can't figure out how to edit. Nevertheless, the above posted principle remains the same.

[the persian Immortal]

^ the thing is that the lances r AP and that's why ur BG will do better against other armoured cavalry, however I wanted to know if the lances r so good when should we exactly use the swords then.... my understanding was that swords r only useful when fighting unarmoured units such as missile or levy infantry.

[Boriak]

If the swords are armour piercing, they are equally valuable against armoured opponents, though maces often have higher lethality. Not always, though. Check the Units list.

[Casual Tactician]

The only unit with a one-handed ap-sword is the Thraikioi Pelastai; and that unit is terribly OP imo. Cavalry swords are not ap. Some cavalry units use longswords though, and these have a higher lethality than maces or axes.

[Entropy Judge]

The only unit with a one-handed ap-sword is the Thraikioi Pelastai; and that unit is terribly OP imo. Cavalry swords are not ap.

Uh ... no. There are plenty of units that carry kopis or falcatas, which are one-handed AP Swords.

Edit: A partial list, specifically for one-handed AP-sword wielding Cavalry:
Baktrian Horse Archers
Cantabrian Light Cavalry
Campanian Cavalry
Hispanic Auxiliary Cavalry
Hellenic Skirmisher (and Heavy Skirmisher) Cavalry
Iberian Light Cavalry
Italic Generals
Lusotannan Elite Medium Cavalry
Tarantine Elite Cavalry
Iberian Medium Cavalry
Lusotannan Bodyguard Cavalry
Indo-Iranian Heavy Cavalry
Indo-Hellenic Heavy Cavalry
Ptolemaic Heavy Cavalry
Elite Heavy Cavalry of the Italic Allies
Sacred Band Cavalry
Hellenic Cataphracts
Companion Cavalry
Baktrian Late Bodyguard
Thessalian Heavy Cavalry
Greek Noble Cavalry
Iberian Heavy Cavalry
Indo-Iranian Light Cavalry
Kinsmen Heavy Cavalry
Royal Kinsmen Heavy Cavalry
Hellenic Medium Cavalry
Hellenistic Mercenary General
Epeiros Heavy Cavalry
Liby-Phoenician Cavalry
Pontos Late Bodyguard
Eastern Mercenary General
Baktrian Early Bodyguard
Hellenic Bodyguard Cavalry
Carthaginian Bodyguard

[Casual Tactician]

Uh ... no. There are plenty of units that carry kopis or falcatas, which are one-handed AP Swords.

True. Altogether there are 56 units in the EDU using a kopis or falcata with ap and 0.11 lethality.
For some reason when I was thinking about swords, I totally forgot the these and only took the longswords and standard swords into account.

[Ferdiad]

You dun goofed.

[the persian Immortal]

what's the advantage of the pahlava late bodyguards swords ???? r they completely useless??? correct me if I'm wrong but I think that they are faster then other type of swords ... right???

[Boriak]

That sword has a high lethality. It may not be armour piercing but it still does the job. My guess it's perfect for cavalry melee.

[Entropy Judge]

Except against Cataphracts.