Syracuse : A question (or three)

[Stworca]

Hello.
Let me begin the post with handing a mark of quality, as this mod brought a tear of joy and wind of change after all those campaigns where one curbstomps the AI.

I'm using the 'delta' version, listed on the very top of the download page.
I've tried using the beta from 20th January, but i received missing city texture bugs to a point where sieging a city would force me to blindly guess where the walls are...

At any rate, I've tackled the Syracusan campaign and..
- How come the initial Syracusan "army" doesn't have the Archimedes Workshop weapon and armor improvements?
- (Not to complain, but) How come the Syracusan Quinquerems receive so few losses during battle? My 3 SQ 3 Triremes fleets manpower losses were all from Trirems.
- What is the purpose of "The Senate" when one plays as Syracuse? (Or rather : Is there any?)
- Can You recruit Spartan RG once you capture Sparta as Syracuse? (and get barracks to the correct level naturally)
- With the lovely starting treasury of 6000, and income of -5grand.. How exactly did Syracuse manage to exist in history? Or rather : What are Your 'ways' of dealing with this economic dilema..
I went for the "not too historical" route : As i doubt that Syracusans took Sicily by force and after a series of ridiculous field battles victories took most of Punic lands in Africa

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Not overrun by Romans only due to naval supremacy, and the land bridge to Sicily not working for some reason.

Finally : Buildings have

"Improves tax income by 2%"
"Improves tax income by 2%"
"Improves tax income by 2%"
"Improves tax income by 2%"
"Improves tax income by 2%"

Instead of one "By 10%" : What, why and how?
By Carthago's River Clearing it's 5* "by 3%" and once "-5%", which actually puzzles me even more.

Ahoy!

[GeoHitmanGR]

The delta is severely outdated. Instead you can try this
http://wmwiki.com/hosted/cv/xcfiles/test19012012.exe
Many bugs have been corrected and features implemented since then.

-In the latest versions, Syracuse have Archimedes workshop.
-The Syracusan Quinquerems are an improved version of the Quinquerems, a ship that was truly a behemoth of that era.
-The Senate has a similar function to it's vanilla counterpart. It gives some missions to the Carthaginians, and improves slightly their AI.
-IIRC yes.
-Disband any high upkeep units, and cower behind Syracusan walls, while rebuilding a much cheaper army, mostly slingers and levy spearmen/peltasts. Also you can try to get ASAP trade rights with as many factions as you can and sell you map knowledge for about a grant each time.
-The new markets in XC do not give a standard income in each city. IIRC it gives a 2% for each resource in the region built. So the engine calculates it as different bonuses. (still works the same though). River clearance, gives on the same logic a 3% for each resource, but a standard -5% to counterbalance the bigger values.

[Stworca]

-In the latest versions, Syracuse have Archimedes workshop.

I've meant that the starting units do not have gold weapons and armor, with the workshop existing since turn 1. Was it intended or perhaps an oversight? This extra 3/3 makes a world of difference on VH.

I've tried a 'test' exe from 20th January before going for the Delta, but it had all the textures for an Eastern city missing, and so sieging it came down to guessing where the walls are, as the city was invisible.
Might have been an installation issue on the HDD though, going to give the link a go.

Last question (unless i find more in the new version!) : What would be the most unforgiving and difficult province to play as (faction?)

[GeoHitmanGR]

Not sure about the upgrades. The extra 3/3 is certainly a lifesaver.

The texture problem is a bit strange. You may want to reinstall XC, or check if the problem exists in vanilla RTW.

[Stworca]

I've just now installed the version provided, and let me elaborate and put it this way :

Spoiler for Images: 

We start the campaign as Syracuse :


We have the Foundry right away :


But our troops have basic weapons made from wet towels, and basic armor, made of paper.


Same for the navy.

I hope that this will be fixed in the future

[GeoHitmanGR]

This is quite easy to fix, if it does not cause trouble in balance

[Stworca]

Well, i haven't played for too long with the newer version, but in delta :
- You had 3 units less than in the last version.
- Carthaginian army was waiting for you in an Ambush, instead of a fort (successfull ambush = pain)

But :
- Since you had less units, you had better income (-5000 not -7000)
- The fort complicates things, as you have to waste another turn (of insanely negative income) to get it, unless you bypass it.
- Wooden walls had no platforms, thus sieges of non-stone cities were easier.
- Syracuse generals were all on foot.

In Delta (VH*2) :
- With or without the upgrades i managed to take all of Sicily, Carthago, and all 3 settlements south of Carthago with just the starting units, after about 5 "vs full-stack" battles. Note that i've spent the iintial cash to re-train the initial garrison in the 3/3 attempt.
The initial victories had to be halted though, as units were all bloody and battered. It took a lot of emergency economy merging, and leaving just a general in each city to - after many turns - get back to the "gaining money" sphere while keeping the 'army'.

With more units in the newer version conquests will be easier, but the economy mending more difficult. With Punic fort you'll get another kick to the crotch economy-wise.

In the end, the +3/+3 on initial units will allow one to suffer fewer casualties (from non-AP missile weapons) - should he blitz the Punic - but the economy will halt the progress regardless.
And since the game is recommended to be played on H/H, it's more of a 'fair fix' than 'unbalancing tweak'.

But that's just my opinion.

[GeoHitmanGR]

Actually XC is intended for M/M. H/H is for game veterans and VH/VH is plain sadistic.
It may seem playable now, but when logistics and corruption come in play, Things are getting a lot worse.
Thanks for the feedback and if you are doing well, you can post a picture or two in the "show your petty kingdom thread"

[Stworca]

To be perfectly honest I'd rather make an AAR of double VH campaign. But since i doubt it would be a deep-RP one, it hardly fits rwcenter AAR section

[Zarax]

Archimedes was 12 at campaign start and his career started on civilian projects rather than rearming the military.
Add to that that sicilian economy was devastated by civil war plus Pyrrhus' campaign against Carthage so the army could not be equipped at its best level.

Ironically, while most players will start with aggressive conquest (I should maybe tone down armies on both sides) what both Syracuse and Carthage did was to start reducing army size to peace levels, which is what will trigger in time the whole mamertine affair.

Like geohitman said, suggested difficulty is M/M with reduced AI bonuses and unlike other mods I wouldn't shun players going for easy at start as the mod can be vicious.

[Silver Legionary]

Like geohitman said, suggested difficulty is M/M with reduced AI bonuses and unlike other mods I wouldn't shun players going for easy at start as the mod can be vicious.

Seconded on the mod being vicious. It can be INCREDIBLY tough.

[Ferdiad]

H/H is very doable for a Roman cmapaign, thats what i used and while the first years are tough once you get Marian units its steamroll central from then on.

[Stworca]

Another question : When (or how?) is the landbridge from Italy to Sicily created? As it's not there yet in my campaign.

[Zarax]

It's not created, historically while the strait was small currents were fierce, meaning you couldn't just cut a few rafts and move an army across.

[Ferdiad]

It would probaly be better for the AI though.

[Zarax]

AI can pull naval invasions and this way the player actually has to keep an eye to the sea.

[Stworca]

What are the bonuses given to the AI anyway? (optional module during installation)
Can someone break down the numbers?

Also : The river clearing. 20 000 denari for a 10% bonus on tax income? That seems hardly worth the investment, unless - ofcourse - one plays until AD. Where after those few hundred turns it starts paying up. Or am i missing something crucial here?

[Zarax]

The AI bonuses are in EDB, look for the monument section.

River clearing is not supposed to be cost effective but rather a money sink as that kind of project was literally monumental.

[Stworca]

The AI bonuses are in EDB, look for the monument section.

Great! Now.. what is EDB?

[Zarax]

export_desc_buildings.txt in your xc/data folder.