Anti-Islamist film shown to more than 1000 police officers as training at NY, USA

[white-wolf]

“This is the true agenda of much of Islam in America,” a narrator intones. “A strategy to infiltrate and dominate America. ... This is the war you don’t know about.”



This is the feature-length film titled “The Third Jihad,” paid for by a nonprofit group, which was shown to more than a thousand officers as part of training in the New York Police Department.



Link


another link


Check out the film's site "the Third Jihad"


It seems as a muslim I missed out the muslim plan of dominate America. Am I not a member of muslim hive-mind anymore?

[Veliky Kaiser Theos]

This is just ridiculous.

[sumskilz]

I don't like beginning a discussion with innaccuraies in play (which exist both in this thread title and in the article).

First, the film was funded and produced by Clarion Fund, not Aish HaTorah.

The article refers to Aish HaTorah as an Israeli Organization, but it is in fact an American Jewish organization founded by an American Orthodox Rabbi named Noah Weinburg. I haven't watched the film to see how biased it is, but I wonder about an investigative reporter that bends the facts. How hard would it have been for him to actually look into Aish HaTorah? Does he know the difference between Jewish and Israeli?

The Clarion Fund, which actually produced the film has a Muslim sitting on it's advisory board - Dr. M. Zuhdi Jasser, the founder and president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy. Strange that this bit of information is also left out of the article.

Jasser's perspective is summed up in his testimony to the U.S. House of Representatives Committee on Homeland Security:

I sit before you a proud, devout, American Muslim whose country is polarized on its perceptions of Muslims and the radicalization that occurs within our communities. One camp refuses to believe any Muslim could be radicalized living in blind multiculturalism, apologetics, and denial, and the other camp believes all devout Muslims and the faith of Islam are radicalized. Between these two polarities is a reasoned, pragmatic approach focused on solutions that recognizes the beauty of one of the world's great religions, while also acknowledging the existence within of a dangerous internal theo-political domestic and global ideology that must be confronted - Islamism. I hope that these hearings are the beginning of a rational national conversation about those solutions.

EDIT: Just started watching it. The film begins with the following text:

This is not a film about Islam. It is about the threat of radical Islam. Only a small percentage of the world's 1.3 billion Muslims are radical.

[white-wolf]

I don't like beginning a discussion with innaccuraies in play (which exist both in this thread title and in the article).

First, the film was funded and produced by Clarion Fund, not Aish HaTorah.

The article refers to Aish HaTorah as an Israeli Organization, but it is in fact an American Jewish organization founded by an American Orthodox Rabbi named Noah Weinburg. I haven't watched the film to see how biased it is, but I wonder about an investigative reporter that bends the facts. How hard would it have been for him to actually look into Aish HaTorah? Does he know the difference between Jewish and Israeli?

The Clarion Fund, which actually produced the film has a Muslim sitting on it's advisory board - Dr. M. Zuhdi Jasser, the founder and president of the American Islamic Forum for Democracy. Strange that this bit of information is also left out of the article.

Jasser's perspective is summed up in his testimony to the U.S. House of Representatives Committee on Homeland Security:

It is quite interesting that you play what you accused me of.

If you read the article you can see both organizations shares members, capich?

Repeated calls over the past several days to the Clarion Fund, which is based in New York, were not answered. The nonprofit group shares officials with Aish HaTorah, an Israeli organization whose officials have opposed a full return of the West Bank to Palestinians. The producer of “The Third Jihad,” Raphael Shore, also works with Aish HaTorah.

So what if the board a muslim member? Does it makes a muslim loving organization or unbiased to muslims automatically?

The person who uttered below words can not be a muslim, even his name is muslim-based:

“Americans are being told that many of the mainstream Muslim groups are also moderate,” Mr. Jasser states. “When in fact if you look a little closer, you’ll see a very different reality. One of their primary tactics is deception.”

[sumskilz]

If you read the article you can see both organizations shares members, capich?

I read it, but that doesn't mean Aish is behind it. By that logic, you could say the American Islamic Forum for Democracy is behind it, especially considering that its president is featured throughout the film. He is also not the only Muslim interviewed.

So if you frame the title to be alarmist, no big deal, but the inaccuracies and deliberate omissions in the NY Times article are of concern.

The person who uttered below words can not be a muslim, even his name is muslim-based

You get to decide who is a Muslim? That quote is him being upset about Muslim groups who are extremist (in his opinion) who are passing themselves off as moderate. He's upset about an interpretation of Islam that he doesn't agree with.

[white-wolf]

I read it, but that doesn't mean Aish is behind it. By that logic, you could say the American Islamic Forum for Democracy is behind it. Especially considering that its president is featured throughout the film. He is also not the only Muslim interviewed.

Being a member of a organization and being interviewed at a film are different things. I think you can capable of understanding it.

Both organizations have same members and you are saying that they are not behind it. I love this logic.

So if you frame the title to be alarmist, no big deal, but the inaccuracies and deliberate omissions in the NY Times article are of concern.

Making propaganda to a big city's police force, law enforcers, giving them "wrong" and "biased" information of a group of citizens, labeling them as enemies does not cause alarm? Yes, you are very right!

You get to decide who is a Muslim? That quote is him being upset about Muslim groups who are extremist (in his opinion) who are passing themselves off as moderate. He's upset about an interpretation of Islam that he doesn't agree with.

No, I can not decide who is a muslim or not. However, it does not mean automatically a person is a muslim, if that person has muslim name. If a person accuses whole set of peoples with "deception", even the moderate ones, can not be member of same group if you ask me. I wonder if he is a muslim, which interpretation he is following.

[sumskilz]

Both organizations have same members and you are saying that they are not behind it. I love this logic.

That's right, both Clarion Fund and The American Islamic Forum for Democracy have some of the same members. It is exactly the same as the relationship between Clarion Fund and Aish HaTorah. This is your logic.

Making propaganda to a big city's police force, law enforcers, giving them "wrong" and "biased" information of a group of citizens, labeling them as enemies does not cause alarm? Yes, you are very right!

You didn't watch the film did you. The film is almost entirely radical Muslims in their own words, and moderate Muslims talking about their concerns. The historian Bernard Lewis is the only non-Muslim with much of a part in the film. I have to admit, Bernard Lewis is sometimes controversial in that he denies the Armenian Genocide, but I don't think that makes him biased against Islam.

No, I can not decide who is a muslim or not. However, it does not mean automatically a person is a muslim, if that person has muslim name. If a person accuses whole set of peoples with "deception", even the moderate ones, can not be member of same group if you ask me. I wonder if he is a muslim, which interpretation he is following.

Again, you obviously didn't watch the film.

I mean some Israeli nutjobs (I would love to meet those who aren't) show an anti-Islam horror film, it's okay in a society which tolerates hypocrisy and hatred behind taboos, but how the hell American Govt.

There were no Israelis involved.

EDIT:

Or correct me if I am wrong.

Actually there is a weird simplification of history going on in the film.

[Adar]

It is quite interesting that you play what you accused me of.

If you read the article you can see both organizations shares members, capich?

You mean like how the CAIR-affiliated whistle blower is a member of an organization with close ties to Hamas, the Muslim Brotherhood and has tried to ask Khaddaffi for money?

[PointOfViewGun]

EDIT: Just started watching it. The film begins with the following text:

That's usually a bogus statement that we had before. It mostly means "We're not gonna talk about Islam but we are gonna talk about Islam."

It's a rather poor documentary with an agenda if it's actually trying to claim that Muslims are trying to take over U.S.A. internally.

[Poet]

“This is the true agenda of much of Islam in America,” a narrator intones. “A strategy to infiltrate and dominate America. ... This is the war you don’t know about.”



This is the feature-length film titled “The Third Jihad,” paid for by a nonprofit group, which was shown to more than a thousand officers as part of training in the New York Police Department.



Link


another link


Check out the film's site "the Third Jihad"


It seems as a muslim I missed out the muslim plan of dominate America. Am I not a member of muslim hive-mind anymore?

shush I thought I told you.

But seriously what the hell is it? God knows and TWC knows that I praised America for the environment they created for Muslims in their country, that is better than many European countries except UK, but this is hilarious. I mean some Israeli nutjobs (I would love to meet those who aren't) show an anti-Islam horror film, it's okay in a society which tolerates hypocrisy and hatred behind taboos, but how the hell American Govt. allowed it's police officers to see such a hate-filled film? What impact would it have on condition of American Muslims in area of those officers?

Let us come to a third point. Third Jihad? I remember (I may be wrong, please correct me) that first jihad started against Byzantine empire because they were supporting those Arab tribes who were used to steal Medina's cattle and those were used to threaten Medina's caravans to Syria. That was the first time when rivalry among Muslims and Christians took place. In centuries after that first clash both sides tried hard to beat the other.

Second jihad was ignited because Turks were attacking Christian lands (in response to a procedure initiated by Byzantine empire and because powers tend to expand), but Pope called a jihad on Arabs ruling over holy land and Jerusalem. I don't remember anywhere that Muslims initiated a jihad (in both of situations without provocation). Or correct me if I am wrong.

[Kitsunegari]

Let us come to a third point. Third Jihad? I remember (I may be wrong, please correct me) that first jihad started against Byzantine empire because they were supporting those Arab tribes who were used to steal Medina's cattle and those were used to threaten Medina's caravans to Syria. That was the first time when rivalry among Muslims and Christians took place. In centuries after that first clash both sides tried hard to beat the other.

Second jihad was ignited because Turks were attacking Christian lands (in response to a procedure initiated by Byzantine empire and because powers tend to expand), but Pope called a jihad on Arabs ruling over holy land and Jerusalem. I don't remember anywhere that Muslims initiated a jihad (in both of situations without provocation). Or correct me if I am wrong.

Lol really?

[Poet]

Lol really?

Instead of laughing out loudly why don't you correct me?

I suppose he forgets the Rashidun caliphate and the other mega states.

No I did not forget. If by jihad that org means 'first Muslim jihad against any Christian empire', then I am right. Otherwise I know that first war was fought against pagan tribes of Mecca. First clash of Muslims and Christians happened in last years of Prophet (pbuh) and first war was fought in Abu Bakr (r.a.) era. Read 'ghazwa tabouk' for example.

[Kitsunegari]

Instead of laughing out loudly why don't you correct me?
.

B/c you suggestion is laughable, the Roman Empire at the height of power under the Antonines never bothered with the interior of Arabia, yet Heraclius, having just reconquered his eastern provinces and won an extremely costly victory in a Medieval equivalent of a world war, is going to bother with this wasteland? The Romans were content to let the Christianized Ghassanids act as a buffer against raiders from the interior in exchange for some titles. Anyway the Muslims started expanding in all directions soon after the first invasions in Syria and Palestine so your attempt at revisionism fails on all counts

Wars between those states and their enemies related more to the typical relations between states throughout history than a grand unified concept of jihad.

In many cases, especially after some setbacks, but the spirit of djihad never entirely vanished.

[Poet]

B/c you suggestion is laughable, the Roman Empire at the height of power under the Antonines never bothered with the interior of Arabia, yet Heraclius, having just reconquered his eastern provinces and won an extremely costly victory in a Medieval equivalent of a world war, is going to bother with this wasteland? The Romans were content to let the Christianized Ghassanids act as a buffer against raiders from the interior in exchange for some titles. Anyway the Muslims started expanding in all directions soon after the first so your sad attempt at revisionism fails on all counts

I didn't say that Roman empire had any incentives in 'wasteland' (oil had to wait for centuries to get discovered), but those Ghassanid Arabs were their allies and they were teasing caravans and shepherds of Medina, they stole a few cattle and this became reason of Muslims sending envoys to their supporters who denied any help, when Muslims tried to punish those Ghassanids, their supporters came for help and this was the cause of ghazwa tabouk. You may laugh and make fun, it is certainly a mature approach towards mutual learning. Peace.

[Inhuman One]

I am still wondering why muslims seem to dislike their own countries that much considering their mass migration towards western countries. Little of it happens the other way around.

Running away from war I can understand, but why not run to a country with similar beliefs? why must they always come to the west? it does make it rather suspicious.
Many incidents involving muslims are not helping either, especially since no other cultural group of immigrants seem to cause that much trouble.

[NotYetRegistered]

I am still wondering why muslims seem to dislike their own countries that much considering their mass migration towards western countries. Little of it happens the other way around.

Running away from war I can understand, but why not run to a country with similar beliefs? why must they always come to the west? it does make it rather suspicious.
Many incidents involving muslims are not helping either, especially since no other cultural group of immigrants seem to cause that much trouble.

Are you serious?

One word: money.

[white-wolf]

We have been talking and answering different things, it seems it is impossible to reach an understanding with you.

I just reported an article from a newspaper. You claimed inaccuracies which I pointed out not. You can arrive your own conclusion with reading this article, it is not up to me to think for you.

[Adar]

We have been talking and answering different things, it seems it is impossible to reach an understanding with you.

I just reported an article from a newspaper. You claimed inaccuracies which I pointed out not. You can arrive your own conclusion with reading this article, it is not up to me to think for you.

The problem is rather your complete lack of understanding and willingness to believe an organization with close ties to the Muslim Brotherhood

[white-wolf]

The problem is rather your complete lack of understanding and willingness to believe an organization with close ties to the Muslim Brotherhood

You are free to believe whatever you want.

[Dewy]

Can a moderator change the misleading title? Aish HaTorah is not an Israeli organisation nor is it behind this film.