war !!!

[fox991]

how to make a war with other faction in an Indirect way ?

[Ichon]

Armies in their territory while low garrison on your shared borders. War with their allies... Assassins but that will lower relations with everyone. Get a large border and then disbanded a lot or units... AI will think you are weak and attack though almost every AI will so it tends to cause lots of wars not just one. Some people have said asking allied. AI to attack a faction drawing you into a war with the target faction but I have never been able to get that to work.

[Bringer Of Storms]

Assassins but that will lower relations with everyone

Now I've always wondered. What if your assassins never get caught. Will you still get lowered relations for using them?

[Losthief]

Now I've always wondered. What if your assassins never get caught. Will you still get lowered relations for using them?

yes

[Henry X]

That's stupid.

[Ichon]

That's stupid.

Why? Just because there is no outright proof people will still suspect which faction is behind it and treat them differently.

[Bringer Of Storms]

Why? Just because there is no outright proof people will still suspect which faction is behind it and treat them differently.

You know, never thought of it that way.

[Henry X]

Why? Just because there is no outright proof people will still suspect which faction is behind it and treat them differently.

Then shouldn't they think of everyone that way? I mean, at least Medieval: Total War said that you think it was the faction that did it or that they had no idea who was behind the murder.

[Ichon]

Then shouldn't they think of everyone that way? I mean, at least Medieval: Total War said that you think it was the faction that did it or that they had no idea who was behind the murder.

Never played the first MTW or do you mean the dialogue box wording?

[Homeros]

Why? Just because there is no outright proof people will still suspect which faction is behind it and treat them differently.

It is stupid, because only when agents get caught (and talk, although torture isn't a reliable source for information) one can point a finger to a specific faction. When agents are successful, no one knows who has send them and therefore cannot blame anyone specific yet that's what the game does.

Shogun 2 has the same issue. When I use my ninjas to sabotage armies, and they are successful, the AI still knows who did it and you receive a diplomatic penalty. When the AI sabotages my armies, successfully, I have no clue who did it - as it should be.

[Judeman266]

But you can always suspect who had motive to assassinate the family member. There are plenty of examples in history. There is almost never proof, but one suspects and this leads to war.

[Homeros]

But you can always suspect who had motive to assassinate the family member. There are plenty of examples in history. There is almost never proof, but one suspects and this leads to war.

Not really. In most cases war was inevitable anyway, when something bad happened it was used to justify war or retaliation. Propaganda is a powerful tool to gain support and it doesn't exist in TW games (would be very difficult to implement).

The assassination that triggered WW1 is perhaps the most famous example. But I can't name historians who claim that, without the death of the Arch Duke, WW1 wouldn't have happened. It might have been delayed for a while, but the political situation, the over-confident (and brain-death) commanders, the public opinion, the military industrial complex and so on guaranteed that war would come, sooner rather than later.

[Ciciro]

Yes, but it is much easier to justify war when you have an actual reason for it instead of just saying "Oh, I don't like you, so I think I'll go to war with you." (Though many wars have been started in this way.)

[Ferdiad]

Yes, but it is much easier to justify war when you have an actual reason for it instead of just saying "Oh, I don't like you, so I think I'll go to war with you." (Though many wars have been started in this way.)

Thats what evey war in TW is.

[Ciciro]

No, every war in TW is started because you want win the game, not because you don't like the other factions.

[Ferdiad]

I disagree thats alot of my justification for war right there.

[Ciciro]

You only don't like those other factions because they are your rivals, but is that really a justification for war?Because you don't like them?

[Ferdiad]

You only don't like those other factions because they are your rivals, but is that really a justification for war?Because you don't like them?

Yes thats all the justification I need.

[Judeman266]

While I don't necessarily start a war with a faction because I don't like them, I do attack factions if they insult me (violate territorial boundaries, cease a merchant's holdings, violate treaties, attack my vassal or weak ally), attack somewhere where I was hoping to expand, are getting too strong, attempt assassinations, or are spying. Some of these are arguably justifiable reasons for war in the time period, but some of them are pretenses which were used extensively in the Middle Ages. Just because there is no definite proof of something doesn't mean factions will not blame someone, rightfully or not.

[Henry X]

Now I have a reason to roleplay again! This is excellent!

Ultimately, I think the game should tell you about what other factions suspect after an assassination.