Jon Snow? (Spoiler)

A Song of Ice And Fire

Just curious if anyone else believes Jon Snow to be Rhaegar Targaryen or Lyanna Starks offspring?

Rhaegar kidnaps Lyanna, and keeps her in seclusion/secret for long enough to
sire a child wit her. This begs the question whether Prince Rhaegar annulled his marriage to Elia Martell (because he is not only a Targaryen who did as he wishes [hence kidnapping Lyanna], but he was also royalty and 1st in succession for the throne, meaning he could do pretty much anything he pleases), and in secret married Lyanna Stark, meaning not only would Jon be a trueborn of wedlock, he'd also be a trueborn Targaryen, and rightful heir to
the Seven Kingdoms.

Even though Jon has black hair (as we've seen in terms of Robert Baratheons lineage), black hair was the predominant trait over blond (in the case of all his legitimate children). So with Lyanna Stark having black hair (presumptively), it took dominance over the "silver hair" gene of the Targaryen's, which is a viable possibility.

I even would go as far as to think that Aemon Targaryen (The Maester of the Night's Watch), believes Jon Snow to be of his own royal blood, hence why he favors him and protects him from 'Justice', after Jon returns from beyond the wall.

Even though the Targaryen King Aerys II wronged the Stark family by executing Ned's father, and his elder brother Brandon as well, most of us would be just as unforgiving as Robert was towards what the Targaryens did.
Ned seems to have forgiven the Targaryens when he spoke early on in the series to Robert over lunch, Robert spoke of wiping out the Targaryen line, and Ned tried sort of to just shun the comment and move on past it. Perhaps because if Robert knew Jon to be Rhaegar (and Lyanna)'s child, he might wish him killed out of spite.

The only man said to know the truth of Jon Snow's parents is Howland Reed of the Crannogmen, who has yet to make an appearance in the series. Hopefully the next two books can shed some light on the lingering question which could prove to be the most awing twist in the series so far, in my opinion.

What's your thoughts?

He's dead.

That theory has been around for like 5 years .

Jon Snow was assumed dead now.

Assumed, but we all know hes not. The woman of fire will prob save him or one of the Thennn warriors... forget the commanders name he was there at the end maybe he will intervene and cut the assassins down.

Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens

Assumed, but we all know hes not. The woman of fire will prob save him or one of the Thennn warriors... forget the commanders name he was there at the end maybe he will intervene and cut the assassins down.

You don't know George R. R. Martin very well if you think you can really say you know he's not dead.

Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens

Assumed, but we all know hes not. The woman of fire will prob save him or one of the Thennn warriors... forget the commanders name he was there at the end maybe he will intervene and cut the assassins down.

well, there is the theory that there will be one rebirth by Fire and one by Ice, and since the Fire one points to Dany, the theory goes that Jon will be brought back via Ice. Now, we also could use an explanation on the Others and their motivation, so who knows? Maybe a Jon with blue eyes could be seen soon enough, to tell us exactly what is going on up North.

Or he could be a wolf now, and live through Ghost.

Actually if he was dead it would be much more fun... But yet he probably would not die...

Also there is an other dream that he is dreaming the whole chapter, because at the end of his last chapter he goes to bed with a fever, so why not a fever dream?

Whose theory is that?

Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens

Whose theory is that?

Read it somewhere on Westeros.org

Assumed dead, then the 6th book will start with him in a bed mending up lmao. Come on hes the one character they wont lose

I figured this was the case while reading the first book, before ever I saw any discussion of the series or anything on this or other forums. Everything I've read since then has only served to strenghten my suspicions.

Which is what Greywolf? Not sure what you were referring to specifically.

Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens

Which is what Greywolf? Not sure what you were referring to specifically.

It was Lyanna's last words to Eddard "promise me, promise me" (look after the kid, raise him as your son, and perhaps protect the baby from Robert's fury), the bloody bed (after giving birth), and the fact that Rhaegar 'kidnapped' her. These are all described throughout 'A Game of Thrones'.

The 'kidnapping' to me seems more like the fact that Rhaegar and Lyanna eloped (initially wasn't sure but later books seem to confirm it). Robert - and perhaps Eddard - mistook what had happened as a kidnapping, and the fact that Aerys put out a bounty on Robert's head and burned Eddard Stark's father and brother created the civil war.

Originally Posted by GreyFox

It was Lyanna's last words to Eddard "promise me, promise me" (look after the kid, raise him as your son, and perhaps protect the baby from Robert's fury), the bloody bed (after giving birth), and the fact that Rhaegar 'kidnapped' her. These are all described throughout 'A Game of Thrones'.

The 'kidnapping' to me seems more like the fact that Rhaegar and Lyanna eloped (initially wasn't sure but later books seem to confirm it). Robert - and perhaps Eddard - mistook what had happened as a kidnapping, and the fact that Aerys put out a bounty on Robert's head and burned Eddard Stark's father and brother created the civil war.

the thing is that we don't know exactly how two-sided the elopement is; sure, there was almost certainly a relationship, but that doesn't mean that she was gung-ho in running off an almost certainly killing off her immediate family. I'm not saying Rhaegar is the monster Robert chalked up up to be, but just because he isn't a complete monster does not mean he is a complete hero, and just because Lyanna might have consented to a relationship does not mean that it was her idea or even okay with her. After all, the Targaryens are a little mad, and Rhaegar shows signs of obsession: he turned his entire life upside down, reversed his lifestyle, all for one prophecy in a book. Now, he wanted a child of ice and fire, and if he is willing to rip his own life to shreds for that prophecy, why would he shy away from going a little far with Lyanna? He was desperate for a child, that much is obvious (and not exactly the building block for a healthy relationship), and given Westeros' tradition of not caring what the woman thought, it is a possibility.

We really don't know enough about what happened to say for certain though.

Originally Posted by Timur Amir

the thing is that we don't know exactly how two-sided the elopement is; sure, there was almost certainly a relationship, but that doesn't mean that she was gung-ho in running off an almost certainly killing off her immediate family. I'm not saying Rhaegar is the monster Robert chalked up up to be, but just because he isn't a complete monster does not mean he is a complete hero, and just because Lyanna might have consented to a relationship does not mean that it was her idea or even okay with her. After all, the Targaryens are a little mad, and Rhaegar shows signs of obsession: he turned his entire life upside down, reversed his lifestyle, all for one prophecy in a book. Now, he wanted a child of ice and fire, and if he is willing to rip his own life to shreds for that prophecy, why would he shy away from going a little far with Lyanna? He was desperate for a child, that much is obvious (and not exactly the building block for a healthy relationship), and given Westeros' tradition of not caring what the woman thought, it is a possibility.

We really don't know enough about what happened to say for certain though.

It doesn't matter whether Lyanna Stark was a willing participant or not, or how much she liked Rhaegar. All that matters is that the evidence strongly suggests that she was the mother of Jon Snow, that Rhaegar was the father, and that she wanted the baby to be kept safe.

In my own opinion, I think she fell in love with Rhaegar,they eloped, and they had a kid. But that is only my opinion.

Makes sense. Wonder if Jon will ever find out.

Originally Posted by MathiasOfAthens

Makes sense. Wonder if Jon will ever find out.

Is there anyone left alive who knows? Lyanna is dead. Rhaegar is dead. Eddard is dead. Unless there are a few servants knocking about, then they may or may not know that the baby survived.

Wasn't there a fight between some lords + Eddard Stark and the Reed fella who had to fight the remaining Kingsguard I think at the place where Lyanna was found? And I think only Reed and Stark survived? Admittedly my memory is hazy and I could very easily be wrong on this point. And only Stark and Reed survived, though Reed was injured in the fight? So maybe Reed knows the truth of it.

For sure the Reed kids seem to have an inkling as to what happened.

Someone else said someone else knows the truth of it. Perhaps we will find out.