OotMM units!

[removeduser_3847562873423]

Hey TATW players!

Does someone know a submod that gives ootmm more units or a submod that is in development and will do this? I like them very much in Tatw 3.1 (on strat map) but they just have not much good and interesting units. Gundabad has atleast got some different trolls but ootmm got nothing special at all.

Thanks!

[TheXand]

I too would be interested in something like that. Given how vast the Misty Mountains are I'm sure that a few more enemies of good could be bundled into their faction. Didn't Tolkien specify any of the evils that dwelt there? You'd think that there would be some evil human hill clans, or giant spiders, or troll variants, or wild wolves. There were giants that lived there too.

[TheXand]

If you'd like I could upload the files need to let you recruit mounted and dismounted Black Numenoreans for Orcs of the Misty Mountains and Gundabad. I'll make hillmen available for OotM as well. Eh, I think I also disabled the AoR limitations for Ithilien Rangers and Fountain Guard as well as the standard Dunedain units for Eriador as well because I felt they should be recruitable everywhere as I wanted to see more of them in the campaign if you don't mind that.

[Malinwa]

Numenoreans in the MM??????

[Mhaedros]

[TheXand]

Pretend they're generic evil men or w/e if you're that bothered by it. Just thought some heavily armoured black riders would be a cool addition and suit the whole "vast forces of darkness theme" rather than just a bunch of gobbos.

'Sides it's not like Tolkien ever actually categorised everything that was ever in the Misty Mountains so it's not like there's definitely not any secluded enclaves of them in that rather large uncharted region. I mean there's still lots of Numenoreans kicking around Eriador in the form of the Dunedain.

Gods but diehard lore fans are unimaginative, Tolkien would be ashamed at the closed mindedness his books brought about in people.

[Mhaedros]

I dont think your the one to talk about Tolkien being ashamed right now.

[TheXand]

Is that because Tolkien himself descended from the heavens and told you all the secrets of Middle Earth did he?

[Mhaedros]

No, but supporting evil numenoreans living in the Misty Mountains and Tolkien being ashamed about people misstolking isnt really smart

[Malinwa]

Yeah there were many evil creatures in the MM, but they were not all under the influence of Sauron. So adding them in a faction like Orcs of the Misty Mountains is rather stupid.

Besides, do you know what creatures? Don't think so... There dwelled no Numenoreans in the MM for sure. Maybe one and that was Aragorn when he passed through Moria with the Fellowship.

I agree with adding more units to Orcs of the MM, but then Orcs. (and no kind of invented hill folk)

[Formann]

i always mod the files so that the ootmm can recruit the gundabad goblin units and mountain trolls, its not much but its a little bit of variety atleast, and it gives the ootmm spearmen to counter cavalry without being forced to wait until recruitment of halberds. The files are very easy to change, its possible to give any faction any unit you want with a little effort. How much anyone wants to "stretch" lore is up to personal preference, but personally I like the notion of the ootmm to be a more secluded and selfsufficient orcish society that operates more on its own except when Sauron himself demands them to act. On the other hand there were Black Uruks of Mordor in Moria in the Fellowhsip of the Ring chapter 5 "The bridge of Khazad -Dum", so its possible that Sauron sent some troops to help the goblins

[TheXand]

I still think that there would have been humans living in the Misty Mountains and that the Black Numenorean cavalry really suit OotM. Maybe rename them to Black Riders or something generic to prevent the usual "ohmigaw lore rape" outrage by people who have no idea whether or not Black Numenoreans actually dwelt in the Misty Mountains or not. Some hillmen types would suit them too, maybe some rogue highland clans or something. Anything other than more bloody gobbos.

Certainly Tolkien always implied that there were creatures other than Goblins that lived in the Misty Mountains, up to and including dragons and giants and humans. Gandalf suggested that there werewolves in the Third Age too so the Misty Mountains would be an ideal place to find them.

[Mhaedros]

No dragons lived in MM. Some giants was mentioned in the Hobbit, but it is older than many other books, and for children.
NO humam beings lived in the MM either

[Formann]

No dragons lived in MM. Some giants was mentioned in the Hobbit, but it is older than many other books, and for children.
NO humam beings lived in the MM either

That is true, in both the hobbit and lotr the population of the misty mountain orcs are always described as being purely orc/goblin with some trolls thrown in. The giants dont seem to have any kind of affiliation with the orcs, as Gandalf thinks about asking one of them to block the entrance to the goblins hideout. And that is if they are to be counted as canon at all, some see them as a euphemism for the destructive thunderstorm

[RexImperator]

You could have unique units without them having to be evil men. There could be hobgoblin units which could be a more effective heavy infantry force and in the Hobbit Bolg son of Azog has a bodyguard of big armoured goblins. There could be Moria Goblins, armed and armoured in looted Dwarf gear and Wolf Riders as a sort of light cavalry force. Wolves and Wargs without riders possibly. The above mentioned giants as well, though I'm of the opinion that Giants and trolls are the same thing.

[TheXand]

It's interesting how you seem to know for sure just what did and didn't live in the Misty Mountains despite Tolkien himself not going into great detail on the matter

Obviously we have people like you to thank for the lack of diversity in the Orcs of the Misty Mountains faction when it would be entirely plausible to have human, giant and dragon units for them. Cold-drakes, werewolves, evil hill clans and giants would all fit right into such a faction for such a mysterious region and add great depth to gameplay without sacrificing lore.

[Swad]

It's interesting how you seem to know for sure just what did and didn't live in the Misty Mountains despite Tolkien himself not going into great detail on the matter

Think of it this way, in the same way I think we can reasonable say there aren't any fire breathing yogurt jars in the Misty Mountains because Tolkien doesn't explicitly state they don't exist, I think we can infer that anything that he does not explicitly state to exist, like humans, in that place does not actually exist in that place.

If it is the case that we can say that certain being exist in certain places without any sort of evidence to say they actually do, well, I guess we can say almost everything can't we?

[Keyser_Soze]

Third Age:total war is a mod which immerses you in the world of LOTR. To add 101 new fairytale creatures to a faction not specified to ever have these creatures is incredibly disengaging, as is, in my eyes, their very presence in LOTR. If we were in the first age, I'd think things like dragons to be alright (would still look shoddy due to engine limitations), but we're not. I'm reluctant to really see anything beyond spiders as I find anything else disengaging, and even then, I don't want to see them outside of Mirkwood. While unknown creatures are said to be in the misty mountains, sometimes it's better to keep mysteries as mysteries.
Essentially, TATW wouldn't be TATW with dragons, werewolves and every creature inbetween.

[k/t]

any fire breathing yogurt jars in the Misty Mountains

I think those should have their own faction.

Essentially, TATW wouldn't be TATW with dragons, werewolves and every creature inbetween.

Dragonborn is the mod for the people who want such things.

[Malinwa]

...because there isn't great diversity in the MM.

Maybe you can add the rock-throwing giants yourselves, however they're only mentioned once and very vague so it would be some challange...