More accurate ranged units for SS 6.4

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

Are you tired of seeing your archers\artillery crew sending their shots god knows where ???

Well i was so i started to making some experiments of my own and i came up with this, it makes all ranged units more accurate and deadly but of course its far from perfect due to the fact i didn't take any balances in acount .

Now archer and artillery have a more pertinent role on the battlefield.

Just replace your descr_projectile.txt file in the data folder of the Stainless Steel mod and your good to go. it should be something like C:\Program Files\Sega\Medieval II Total War\Mods\SS6.3

Just don't forget to BACKUP your original file !!!

I made this for SS 6.4 don't ask me if it works with previous version cause i have no idea

I way far from being a modder so if you want to thank do it to the SS team for this great mod
Feel free to criticize and give some feedback.

and sorry for the bad english

[Eldorien88]

Maybe a little un-balanced, but its a nice one! +rep for your effort!

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

Maybe a little un-balanced, but its a nice one! +rep for your effort!

thanks a lot man yeah its a little unbalanced but i intend to fix that only if had more time XD anyway i believe theres is a similar sub mod for Third Age mod i might speak to its creator to ask some tips i probably will reduce peasant and militias accuracy about artillery i didn't test it properly yet perhaps a little bit.

and of course as i said any suggestion is welcome

[Ferdiad]

Maybe reduce missile ammo by 10% and take a point or wo off the damage values.

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

Maybe reduce missile ammo by 10% and take a point or wo off the damage values.

yeah thats not a bad idea i may apply that on the horse archers. thx for the feedback

[Loke-Shah]

How much you increased accuracy? I wonder how balanced Horse Archers are now? I believe it's not save game compatibile right?

[Eldorien88]

How much you increased accuracy? I wonder how balanced Horse Archers are now? I believe it's not save game compatibile right?

If only the descr_projectile.txt is modified then it should be compatible! :-)

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

How much you increased accuracy? I wonder how balanced Horse Archers are now? I believe it's not save game compatibile right?

In the projectile file you have (for example) accuracy_vs_units -- >0.0675 i just made it accuracy_vs_units -- > 0.000675 for all projectiles so now i just have to increase or decrease the values to balance them.

Yes its compatible i tried myself.

The horse archers kick some ass do not under estimate their are really strong (perhaps too much) and whatever you do try to avoid the rocket launcher ... its like getting sniped with explosive rockets of course i will have the values.

And there is something else i've noticed in sieges the attacking archer own the ones on the walls because those on the walls can´t shoot a proper frontal volley (CA made it like that), fortunately the AI don't seem to use them much a least on the tests i did ( i made them on VH)

[Loke-Shah]

The horse archers kick some ass do not under estimate their are really strong (perhaps too much) and whatever you do try to avoid the rocket launcher ... its like getting sniped with explosive rockets of course i will have the values.

Sounds good for mebut the other hand if you want to live don't mess with the Mongols Anyway nice feature

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

Sounds good for mebut the other hand if you want to live don't mess with the Mongols Anyway nice feature

Men with the last i tried to play against them they kill half my army(mainly composed by infantry) only with the archers XD. Thats why they may be too strong i will have to play with them more to be sure.
Anyway try the new file, i hope you like it.

[Ichon]

I've played around with these files and my conclusions was to increase accuracy of cannons but make them fire very, very slowly... So yeah there is a chance to get a lucky shot on the general or a more guaranteed shot on one enemy unit but in a whole battle you might only get 2-3 chances to fire so play odds and shoot for the general or make some more probable losses on a large unit. The slow firing on walls should not make much difference as you can just increase the speed while the slow firing in battles is actually also historical.

Archers and crossbow is more difficult to decide how to balance. Since the values effect both short and longer range shots with MTW2 engine only applying modest penalties at longer ranges making high accuracy.

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

I've played around with these files and my conclusions was to increase accuracy of cannons but make them fire very, very slowly... So yeah there is a chance to get a lucky shot on the general or a more guaranteed shot on one enemy unit but in a whole battle you might only get 2-3 chances to fire so play odds and shoot for the general or make some more probable losses on a large unit. The slow firing on walls should not make much difference as you can just increase the speed while the slow firing in battles is actually also historical.

Archers and crossbow is more difficult to decide how to balance. Since the values effect both short and longer range shots with MTW2 engine only applying modest penalties at longer ranges making high accuracy.

I get your point about the cannons but a don't want to make them reload much more slower cause it can get a little boring. I personalty don't use them a lot and im not yet sure what i will do with them(nor how cause im not pro) for now they will be close to the vanilla

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

OK i slightly decreased the accuracy of all the units you still see that they are pretty accurate but doesn't seem as if they use scopes.

The issue of the archer in siege its way better the attacking archers now kill less units on the wall (compared to the last file i posted) which is good now they give some time to the archer on the wall to shoot back, the defending archer will still shoot less than the attacking ones but they still make some casualties especially to units that are near the wall for example the ram unit this can be useful if you quickly block the gate entrance with your infantry, the enemy will try to rush all of his troops through the gate and your archer will take a considerable amount of them down.

The cannon balls are now less accurate (compared to the last file i posted) but not perfect yet.

So as usual play and test as much as you like and post here what and how would you like to improve this submod

[Loke-Shah]

I checked your first version and I must say It's really Evil Awesome. Mostly when I build my army i use 4-6 archer units sometimes plus 2 Horse Ar. at this moment its powerful compilation. I gonna to try your second update and see how much you decreased. Does mod reflects in any way to Gunpowder units Arqebuzers etc.? Crossbowmen seem to work fine . They should be more accuried and they are How about increasing their damage point?

[Ferdiad]

I bet this mod makes England and Mongols real terrors what with the amount of archers they use.

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

I checked your first version and I must say It's really Evil Awesome. Mostly when I build my army i use 4-6 archer units sometimes plus 2 Horse Ar. at this moment its powerful compilation. I gonna to try your second update and see how much you decreased. Does mod reflects in any way to Gunpowder units Arqebuzers etc.? Crossbowmen seem to work fine . They should be more accuried and they are How about increasing their damage point?

Yeah the gunpowder units got more accurate too but i've been playing with them and i think their pretty much like in the vanilla.

And yes crossbowmen need to make more damage but the problem is that increasing the damage alone wont make real, there are some interesting attributes in this game though: armor piercing and body piercing. The first is use for the xbowmen and the second for balistas perhaps if put the two together work around with the values maybe i can make them more deadly in a realistic way.

I bet this mod makes England and Mongols real terrors what with the amount of archers they use.

Indeed but with some tactics and good maneuvering you can beat them.
Against England i would suggest 3 tactics:
- engage the infantry a soon as possible and cavalry flank (in case you don't have cav)
- send your archers and skirmishers in loose formation to make them waste arrows
(home rule in shogun 2)
- if you have mounted archer its "easy" ... skirmish mode waste them with arrows and then flank them.

Against the Mongols it's always hard do counter horse archers but i would suggest ...
- using a combination of archers, spearman and light cav (even thought your archers do approximately the same damage than the mounted archer, your archer have more troops per unit which means more arrows getting fired)
and then chase the with the light cavalry.

[Eldorien88]

And yes crossbowmen need to make more damage but the problem is that increasing the damage alone wont make real, there are some interesting attributes in this game though: armor piercing and body piercing. The first is use for the xbowmen and the second for balistas perhaps if put the two together work around with the values maybe i can make them more deadly in a realistic way.

Just be careful friend, not to overpower them.
Applying both armor piercing and body piercing will make their arrows inhale the enemies and hit lines of soldiers. This will be too unbalanced and you will loose the consistency of the game. Remember that all units in the game have their role and must be kept in balance. Armor piercing is the attribute that you must focus if you want to make crossbows more deadly and believe me its enough.
Just a friendly opinion.. :-)

[Ferdiad]

If you give ap to Crossbows at least half their damage and make their range smaller. The damage is for balance reasons so they dont wtfpwn everything and the range is again balance and the fact that heavy bolts wouldnt be able to travel as far as lighter ones.

[PT_ReVoLuTioN]

Just be careful friend, not to overpower them.
Applying both armor piercing and body piercing will make their arrows inhale the enemies and hit lines of soldiers. This will be too unbalanced and you will loose the consistency of the game. Remember that all units in the game have their role and must be kept in balance. Armor piercing is the attribute that you must focus if you want to make crossbows more deadly and believe me its enough.
Just a friendly opinion.. :-)

If you give ap to Crossbows at least half their damage and make their range smaller. The damage is for balance reasons so they dont wtfpwn everything and the range is again balance and the fact that heavy bolts wouldnt be able to travel as far as lighter ones.

Well i followed your advices, i messed with the BP attribute but it makes crossbowmen way too strong so i didn't add it, but i noted that in the vanilla mod file all crossbowmen had AREA attribute something i wasn't expecting but it seems to be working so i let it be however i add AP attribute to all crossbowmen units.

Now they make short work of militias, peasants etc but are now match for heavy armored units ...
against archer they take some casualties due to the range difference but as soon as they get in range they make up for it .... two advices:
- if your army its composed by weak units peasants and militias and your enemy has lots of ranged units, well just run.(you can try to engage but peasants and militia rout pretty fast)
- don't let your army just standing while the enemy shoots at cause you will regret it.

and as always test it, if you think something can\should be improved say it

btw sorry to giving you the files one post at the time i know it gets really messy but its just i can't edit the thread

[Ferdiad]

Mate it really should be the opposie way around. Archers stong agaisnt lightly armourd units while crossbows strong against heavily armoured units.